Pants crusade?

[Hunt]

My eyes have been opened! If I don't like the pants, there's something wrong with ME! Give me a break! For about the zillionth time, I wear the pants, but I don't think they're very good pants. FACT: that's my opinion. As I pointed out, there must be many others who agree with me, because the first two questions on the Supply Divisions FAQ are obviously responding to complaints about the pants. I've done my small bit to tell the Supply Division what I think, and I urge others to do the same thing.

(Note: Even Bob White doesn't say that he actually likes the current pants, although maybe he does.)

[SemperParatus]

"Life does not consist mainly, or even largely, of facts and happenings. It consists mainly of the storm of thought that is forever flowing through one's head." ~ Mark Twain

 

Give me an opinion anytime...it is the only way to change a fact worth changing. (BTW I love my BSA pants).

[Bob White]

I used to really dislike the fit of the slacks and shorts. Then I lost twenty pounds and suddenly the uniform improved in quality.

 

How can adults not grasp the concept of "uniform".

 

Good grief! Do you remember the sight of the Houston Astros when they first took the field? What was that designer thinking? Did you ever hear the coach say well we will just wear the shirt and you can wear whatever pants you want. (actually they would have loked better the other way around)

 

It's a uniform! The complainers and the composed all get to dress alike.

 

 

[acco40]

No amount of body shaping can change the material. My shirt collars all pill up and my legs don't like the synthetic material of the pants/shorts. I'd like to wear my neckerchief over the collar (yes, I know the collar should be rolled under) but the troop should be uniform and the majority like the under the collar look. Anyone have any experience with the cotton pants or shirt? I can order them but our local scout shop does not carry them.

 

The Philmont shorts (made by Columbia?) are very popular with the staff and youth. I thought they were better made and were much cheaper. I have no idea where or by whom they were made. Iknow they are sold in the Philmont trading post but are only considered "quasi-official."

[EagleInKY]

Like Bob, I've had my uniform pants for ages. I think about 8 years now. The only problem is that they have gotten a few stains on them. Therefore, I bought a new pair of pants. But this time, I bought the dress slacks. They fit much nicer and look great. I still plan to wear my old ones for outings, service projects or anywhere that may get messy. My slacks will be for meetings and more "indoor" occasions.

 

I do hate the pockets, though. Can't we just have real cargo pockets?

[Bob White]

My apologies to Mr. Clements and others for using the word "fact". Please delet it and replace it with the word 'Truth". The truth is that the uniform shirt and slacks are not $50 each unless you are looking at the big and Tall cut and if you go to a store of that typw you will see that the price increas of the uniform is less that than of the increase of civilian clothes.

 

The truth is that the cut of the clothing is not unique and if the uniform pants don't fit then either you are too big or you bought the slacks to small.

 

The truth is there are too many variables in environment climate, and purpose to make one uniform to fit every occassion. And the truth is that with millions of people to cloth you cannot design a uniform to meet every possible whine.

 

The truth is there will always be a percentage of complainers no matter what the BSA does in the next uniform change.

 

BW

[SemperParatus]

"There's a world of difference between truth and facts. Facts can obscure truth" ~ Maya Angelou

 

Thank you for setting the facts (ur, truth)straight and for sharing your opinions.

[Eagledad]

>>The truth is there will always be a percentage of complainers no matter what the BSA does in the next uniform change.

 

BW

[Hunt]

"How can adults not grasp the concept of "uniform"."

 

It's very easy to grasp--but it's not the subject of this conversation. Neither I nor anybody else in this thread has evidenced any failure to understand this concept. What this conversation is about is whether an element of the uniform should be changed. To make such a suggestion is not an assault on the uniform method or on Scouting in general. And I admit I was whining, but when somebody pointed that out to me I went to the Supply Division website to register my comments. Isn't complaining the right thing to do when something should be changed? The Army's new ACU was developed after years of complaints and hundreds of comments from soldiers about deficiencies in the prior uniform. Don't you want to help BSA have the best possible uniform, based on the experience of its members?

 

[Torveaux]

"The truth is there are too many variables in environment climate, and purpose to make one uniform to fit every occassion. And the truth is that with millions of people to cloth you cannot design a uniform to meet every possible whine."

 

Good point, Bob White. That is one great reason for them to authorize a fixed color and let the design/material/etc be up to those paying for and wearing them. As long as National sets the parameters it is the uniform. It is not as though the current system has produced a 'uniform' look as there are options available. The key issue here is what those options will be.

 

 

[Bob White]

"Don't you want to help BSA have the best possible uniform, based on the experience of its members?

 

No. I really do not care if there are better uniforms available. I care about the program that is delivered to the scouts. I wear the uniform for what the uniform teaches. not because of how I feel about the uniform itself.

 

I like this uniform, I liked the one before it and the one before that. I will like the next one. I will wear it complete because that is how you wear a uniform.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Spiney Norman]

Last year our troop held it's 50th anniversary celebration at a local banquet hall. Our SM cajoled us pants "slackers" into purchasing and wearing the complete uniform for the dinner.

 

I complied but only after SWMBO absoulutley forbade me to purchase the field pants. She said that no husband of hers would wear pants with an elastic waistband. I guess she doesn't want to feel old yet. Anyway, I purchased the 100% cotton slacks and find them very comfortable. Perhaps I should wear them more often.

 

Ken

[anarchist]

Hunt, you can't 'win' when folks don't want to listen...they think every suggestion/gripe(?) is an attack...

 

I have both BSA pants (wife loves yard sales) only wear cotten regularly...would rather wear my O.D. BDUs any day...real usable pockets...leg room and "look mom, no plumbers butt".

 

Timely observation- had a pioneering practice session two weeks ago...uniforms were not required but most leaders SMs/ASMs wore them anyway...most of these guys are military trim, but each time they 'squatted' or kneeled or raised a leg they all seemingly, had to adjust the leg of their pant...the ol' pinch and pull up on the front of the thigh...those of us in BDUs just scrunched on down and when we needed to stuff ten feet of 5/16 inch hemp into a pocket we could...no sweat...cause we had real outdoors-friendly work pants.

 

Boils down to what we want the uniform for: just to look good in pictures? or to use outdoors playing in the woods...what we have now is a dress pant "in drag" (fake extra pocket). So the Uniform? I wear it when it is called for. When not it stays where it really belongs... in a closet.

 

so the new question is: What should the pant be used for Pictures or activities?

 

And again BW, the poor fit of a poorly tailored garment does not necessarily mean someone is not 'fit'...or that they are over weight...so you are you are wrong again and insultingly so.

The cost of an Item includes sales taxes and shipping and transport... list price is not true delivered price...

and to finish ...

The pants and the uniform are not the program, remember according to THE BOOK, the uniform is NOT REQUIRED... the pants still suck!

gosh I like this scouting STUFF!

[Bob White]

There is no way around this. If you have plumbers butt in a scout uniform either you or the uniform are the wrong size.

 

No one has said the that the book says the uniform is required. What the book says is that a uniform should not be mixed with civilian clothes. That it is better to wear no uniform than a mixed uniform.

 

All I have said is that it is impossible to please everyone so rather than whine because you are one of the ones who isn't pleased just wear the uniform and do the work you agreed to do. Whining doesn't change the uniform or help lead the program.

 

[Fuzzy Bear]

Hunt,

 

Whining- Evaluation, a leadership skill.

 

What is good (about this subject)?

 

What is bad (about this subject)?

 

What can be done about it?

 

That is the job of every leader in Scouting.

 

Listening is a skill used in Counseling which is also a leadership skill which should be known and appreciated by all in Scouting. Obviously, there are those that believe in their own facts and feel that only they alone possess truth. We know full well where that type of truth leads.

 

FB