Stop the Insanity!

[Rip Van Scouter]

I talked to the manager of our local scout shop a few days ago. She informed me that the Jac-Shirt prices went up BECAUSE they got a new supplier last year. Now, she has never received any new stock, having plenty of the older Woolrich jac-shirts available.

 

Don't most retailers sell old stock as clearance merchandise at reduced prices, rather than marking it up to the price of the replacement item?

 

Yes, PLEASE stop the insanity!

 

Oh yeah, here is another insane item:

 

I had to order custom uniforms for my 5x size body, since nothing on the rack fit me (except the $157 Jac-Shirt, of course!). In doing so, you are required to order two pair of pants (long or short, choice of materials) or two shirts (long or short, choice of materials) as a minimum, but you can mix-and-match with garment type. I decided to order the poly/wool long pants for winter/dressy wear and the poly/cotton cargo pocket shorts for 3-season activity wear (I like to wear shorts even if it is a bit chilly!). Well, despite being measured by the lady at the Scout Shop in every nook and cranny of my body, Supply Division sent shorts which did not fit properly, and TWO pair of long pants, which still had to be hemmed to length despite all the measurements! Well, we re-measured me (long pants with same measurements fit fine) and sent the shorts back for adjustment. Both cotton shirts (long and short-sleeve) I ordered fit fine.

 

Now, do you think I was getting the extra custom fit long pants for free? Not on your life! I said NO WAY am I going to pay for something I DID NOT order. And the poly-wool pants are the most expensive. Would they make me a deal, second pair for half price or some other discount? The local shop could not make that decision. Supply division's first answer was, send them back. Yeah, right. Who else would they fit? They are CUSTOM MADE to my measurements! Well, it has been since November and they are still trying to get a final answer. In the mean time, the local Scout Shop is sitting on them (figuratively, of course!)

 

The shop just called and informed me my re-made shorts HAD BEEN shipped, but I better allow at least 4 days, "just in case". Hopefully, I will get them in time for warm spring weather!

[Sylvar]

WOW! $157 for a Jac shirt. I am feeling pretty smart right now. I bought mine at Philmont 15 years ago for $50. My buddies made fun of me at the time for buying it a size larger than what I wore. Fits me just fine today.

 

I haven't seen the Aloha shirt. I couldn't find it online either (My catalog is not here at work with me). Is the pattern Scout related at all? I am a sucker for a good Hawaiian Shirt. I have a great Class B shirt from the Aloha Council that I wear from time to time.

 

Sylvar

[Rip Van Scouter]

Sylvar,

 

I did a search on the Scoutstuff.org website for "aloha", "hawaiian", even "tropical", with no result. I looked at all the garment catagories and only found "Island Camp Shirt - Prints" and "Island Camp Shirt - Solids" in the Custom Garment section. As a 50/50 cotton/poly blend I don't know how good a Hawaiian shirt it would be. Aren't the better ones made out of silk? Well, I guess you could get a BSA logo embroidered on the pocket, big deal!

 

What I really want is a nice BSA fleece zip up jacket, but the Custom Garment available does not come in my size. Do you think the uniform police would get on me if I bought a non-BSA fleece jacket in my size in red and sewed on the Universal logo which is the same for the nylon jacket and jac-shirt? Dare I sew on my Philmont Bull also?

[John-in-KC]

Have to agree that Supply Division is out of control.

 

Neckerchief for every level of Cubbing

Cap for every level of Cubbing

 

2 different shirt TYPES during the course of Cubbing...

 

Units have to have bodacious uniform closets anymore.

 

The "uniform" method can be a tool, but National seems to be working really hard to make that tool a dull rusty knife.

 

My two cents.

[JimmyD]

I don't see why they can't have a uniform for tigers-bear and a separte one for webelos just to cut down the cost. I knw when i was a Bear i didn't get hat or the neckerchuef but I did for webelos. Tiger program "merged" as a full program I guess now. THen just have like cub scout logo hat/neckerchief just like the cub scout diamond patch or something. I believe the webelos program has too many restrictions on it to be a step towards boy scouting. THey shoudln't even have the tan uniform in my opinion.

[FireKat]

I really agree. My son has friends that want to join but thier parents are afraid of the costs. Our troop keeps out grown spairs for some that can't afford the $$. We have found some great Offical uniform items at our local Good Will store very cheap.

 

The basic question is: are they there for a fasion show or to learn good life values?

 

(I still like looking at all the neat stuff & wish a bit)

[FScouter]

I'd have to say that a parent that would keep their boy out of Scouting because of the uniform cost isn't really interested in Scouting.

[Grumpy]

I think I liked most of the new stuff in the catalog. Some of the prices are high, but I don't have the same issues with quality or fit that others seem to have. I like the new action shirt, but don't see the need for some of the new stuff, will be able to buy it at a large savings a year from now. LOL.

 

I would love to have a Jac-Shirt, but won't pay those prices. Looks like I will be buying one from Bemidji since it is only $119, is 100% wool, and is 30 oz. rather than the 18 oz. that today's official one seems to be.

(http://www.bemidjiwoolenmills.com/details.php?id=voyscout)

 

My biggest complaint is that there is no on-line shopping. Hops_Scout is wrong about the cost. The savings in retail overhead is leveraged against the initial cost of development, which is capitalized over 48 months. Customer pays the shipping, while today's transportation costs are eaten by BSA. Everyone wins.

 

Oh, and I can buy my Bemidji BSA Jac-Shirt on-line.

[johndaigler]

Now that Tigers are Blue and the Webelos can option Blue/Tan, parents might be able to save a penny or two on the number of shirts they buy during Cubbing. Parents can choose Tan as their son sizes out of Blue as a Fourth/Fifth grader and maybe not need to buy a new Tan when crossing over.

 

I'd like to know who sizes those shirts anyway. Body size and body length never make any comparable sense. Have you ever seen a Cub with the right body fit shirt that didn't have the shirt tails hanging to their knees? - no wonder they don't like to tuck them in!

 

For the pants they need to take a hint from GAP and include those inside-the-waistband-button-up-pull-tab-elastisizers. Works great for those scrawny Cubs whose legs keep growing but whose waists stay the same.

 

The various neckerchiefs, hats, belt buckles and slides is what bugs me. They aren't necessary. Could you imagine BSA telling Scouts to buy/wear different uniform pieces as they progress through ranks...It's as if we're trying to use Cub families to subsidize program.

 

My $.02

 

jd

 

 

[Fuzzy Bear]

A funny thing occurred to me about a topic a few days ago and what I see here with the uniforms/stuff.

 

Someone made mention about a Scout Camp in Texas as being a bad choice. Someone told their D.E. about the bad press and then a great rush was on to make it the best of Camps all over again.

 

So, if we are all concerned about the uniforms and there is bad press here again and again, just maybe if everyone rushes out and tells their D.E.'s about the slander that is going on here, that something will happen.

 

Like:

 

The National Uniform Committee will finally admit to being wrong about their poor decisions and job. There will be a recall of all of the faulty merchandise and prices will dramatically fall. New rugged wear will be designed as the uniform by some person that knows what they are doing.

 

Or someone will rush in to the Forum and make a strong defense of all of their junk. We will be so enamored by their position in Scouting that everyone will shut up and pay the high prices and thank them for sitting us straight once and for all time.

 

Or there will be the inevitable silence that happens when everyone knows that a big problem was created but nothing will ever be done about it. National will stand firmly behind what they perceive as a wind-fall of profits. They might also insert in their literature more about what is required to be bought for any number of reasons. We will march obediently down to the stores and purchase another load of it.

 

Who knows what will happen?

 

FB

 

[John-in-KC]

Fuzzy,

 

I'd bet on your third scenario...

 

 

[FireKat]

To FScouter:

You must live in a rich world where all kids have 2 parents. Some of the kids I am refering to who can afford the high prices are from single parent (mostly mothers) families who can even really afford school supplies much less overprice shirts. These boys are the type that can really benifit from scouting but can you see them trying to explain to their welfare councilor why they had to spend up to $200 to get into scouts? Don't act like it is a rich persons hobby and think of those the program really could help - the at risk kids. I am hoping to help get our troop into a position to give 'scholarships' to those that really want to be scouts but are from struggling families.

[EagleInKY]

Firekat - Not to speak for Fscouter, but I'll chime in. We've debated this often before. His issue - and mine - are not with those that can't afford it. There are lots of creative ways of making scouting affordable for those who can't do it on their own. Our issue is with the soccer moms and dads that will spend whatever it takes on a new pair of cleats, pads, uniform and equipment for whatever sport or activity (soccer, band, etc.) and then complain about something that can be purchased second-hand, if you like, at a reasonable price.

[Grumpy]

Scouting costs money, as does any other worthwhile endeavor. That's life.

 

I also believe it is great to set up "scholarships" for those that cannot afford it. And I also think that a uniform is very important, but should not be the reason a kid does not participate. If it takes a year to get the uniform, so be it.

[scoutldr]

For most of us, it's not a question of whether we can "afford" it or not. But, "A Scout is Thrifty". That means not paying inflated prices for poor quality junk. Hopefully National lurks on this forum and takes on board what is being said. They'd be fools not to.

 

Early on in this thread, LeVoyageur suggested a boycott (personcott?). My last 3 uniforms have come from eBay...brand new goods for about half price. And if I need an Aloha (sorry, I mean "camp" shirt), I'll go to Wal-Mart.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)(This message has been edited by scoutldr)