I don't get it?

[Fat Old Guy]

It's all pretty simple. . . I've found that the most effective way to get Cub Scouts to wear the uniform properly is to beat them with a rubber truncheon. Of course, you do this out of sight of other Scouts so he isn't humiliated and with another adult present because we must follow two deep leadership policies.

[Laurie]

FOG, I shouldn't laugh, but I did--your post did tickle my funny bone.

 

I read the original message (also not knowing the source and not looking it up) as singling out one person. When I asked if the boy knew how to dress, I asked because I know that our Cubs don't. The past month, we have been reviewing proper uniforms in the den, and the boys want to do well, the parents want them to do well, but it does take a little time. There's the issue of money, time, and sewing on insignia. I do believe they will shortly be in uniform, correctly, but I also would not consider being negative in any way. We point out the positives. Interestingly enough, when we do that, other boys want to follow suit--and do.

[SR540Beaver]

In all fairness, it should be pointed out that part of the original post in another thread stated that the dad of this cub has the most Scouting experience of anyone in the unit. He above all other parents should be ensuring that his son wears his uniform properly. From my experience, I've seen a number of scouters (cub and boy) who take the attitude of, "it's JUST cub scouts" like it should not matter. The problem with that approach is that a bad habit will be reinforced for 4 or 5 years before a boy makes it to boy scouts and his willingness to change will be very low. In these parts, many of the high school baseball coaches put on summer clinics for the little league boys. Know why? To teach them correct techniques and fundamentals before they get them 5 to 10 years down the road. If the kid has spent his young career trying to make grandstand plays or swinging for the fence, he won't want to change his style when he hits high school. It is not "JUST" cub scouts, it is scouting! Teach them the right way now.

[OldGreyEagle]

Maybe this would be too obscure, but then again sometimes obtuse is my middle name, Actually Grey is my middle name but thats beside the point. Rather then wear the Cub uniform silly, and potentially risk embarassing a boy, and have the collateral damage of other boys in the future 'copying" the leaders bad example because they thought it was a hoot, why not have a leader or boy scout show up in "silly uniform" for football, hockey, etc. Have it all wrong, and have the scouts critque the "silly uniform", why is it wrong? Safety equipment missing or on wrong, jersey inside out, helmet backwards, that sort of stuff. Have the uniformee straighten himself out until it looks right, and then make a correlation to the scout uniform. Its still done with humor, but not to the scout uniform.

[Marty_Doyle]

This is my first year as Cubmaster, and I put on this year's Pack Night schedule that there would be two official uniform inspections, one in December and one in May, with a practice inspection in November. (The December inspection nominally performed by a Marine, there for Toys for Tots kickoff, and the May one by a White Plains police officer, there for a short talk and demo). I handed out copies of the official BSA Cub Scout/Webelos Scout Uniform Inspection Sheet to all of the leaders at our last Leader's Crackerbarrel.

Every den leader has called or e-mailed in the last two days asking if I am serious about using it, since the last Cubmaster had made the wearing of official BSA Scout socks and pants "optional".

After taking a deep breath each time, and explaining that a Cubmaster cannot make any part of the official uniform optional, I then explained that I would use 65% as a passing grade (approximatley 80% of 80 points, discounting the 15 points for official pants and 5 points for official socks. Not even discussing current registration cards, which I found last week in one of the boxes the former Cubmaster left me...)- those that pass get a patch.

I actually am now planning on using TwocCubdad's

"Leader Uniform Inspection" Skit as a teaching minute just before the practice inspection. I think it will as valuable as pointing out specific pluses and minuses for each boy in the practice run.

 

[Marty_Doyle]

This is my first year as Cubmaster, and I put on this year's Pack Night schedule that there would be two official uniform inspections, one in December and one in May, with a practice inspection in November. (The December inspection nominally performed by a Marine, there for Toys for Tots kickoff, and the May one by a White Plains police officer, there for a short talk and demo). I handed out copies of the official BSA Cub Scout/Webelos Scout Uniform Inspection Sheet to all of the leaders at our last Leader's Crackerbarrel.

Every den leader has called or e-mailed in the last two days asking if I am serious about using it, since the last Cubmaster had made the wearing of official BSA Scout socks and pants "optional".

After taking a deep breath each time, and explaining that a Cubmaster cannot make any part of the official uniform optional, I then explained that I would use 65% as a passing grade (approximatley 80% of 80 points, discounting the 15 points for official pants and 5 points for official socks. Not even discussing current registration cards, which I found last week in one of the boxes the former Cubmaster left me...)- those that pass get a patch.

I actually am now planning on using TwocCubdad's

"Leader Uniform Inspection" Skit as a teaching minute just before the practice inspection. I think it will as, if not more, valuable as pointing out specific pluses and minuses for each boy in the practice run.

 

[Fat Old Guy]

" From my experience, I've seen a number of scouters (cub and boy) who take the attitude of, "it's JUST cub scouts" like it should not matter."

 

I get that at the Boy Scout level, after all Boy Scouts isn't something important like Soccer.

[Fat Old Guy]

Hmmmm. . . we shouldn't tell them what they are doing wrong. Interesting . . . so when my son comes home with three F's and one A, I shouldn't even mention the Fs.

 

I suppose that we should compliment the Columbine shooters on how many students they didn't kill instead of focusing on the negative, the dead kids.

 

If you don't tell a Scout to tuck his shirt in, he may never understand that is what is expected of him.

 

[evmori]

If you don't point out what they are doing wrong then how are they to know it is wrong?

 

Fat Old Guy,

When you son get's F's, just shoot him! End of problem!

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[Laurie]

Not pointing out what is wrong--do you get that from my post? If so, I apologize. Absolutely point out what is wrong...but NOT until they are told how to uniform correctly. I personally will have no problem taking a boy aside and pointing out he can improve his uniform once I know he is aware of how to wear it. I tell my sons all the time--neckerchief needs to be straightened, shirt needs to get tucked in, grab your hat...and wear if forward, shoes are untied, etc. They know how to wear their uniforms already, and we've worked on how to do so at home, long before I began to remind them what needs correcting.

[Bob White]

"I personally will have no problem taking a boy aside and pointing out he can improve his uniform" Mega kudos to Laurie for sticking to a fundemental rule of good leadership..Praise in public, Correct in private.

 

Don't waste time or confuse minds by showing people how do something wgong, and never criticize a scout in front of others, even if you believe you are being really cute at it.

 

BW(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Twocubdad]

Here is what I don't get. How does this improve uniforming in the unit or in the specific scout. I am open to explainations.

 

So when you wrote that, Bob, it was just a rhetorical flourish? That I have shown how we used the "uniform slob" to have a good time and teach the kids about proper uniforming without humiliating anyone isn't good enough? It doesn't sound like you weren't open to much except the preconceived point you were looking to make in the first place.

 

 

[Bob White]

Twocubdad,

You told a terrific story, unfortunately it wasn't what I posted the thread about. It was not relevant to the situation or the questions posed as the topic of the thread. I was asking about mimicking a specific scout in front of the others.

 

I cringe at the thought that an adult leader would want to "put an exclamation point on how foolish this boy looks" I personally do not find that in keeping with the values of the program that we are there to teach.

 

Although I am not a big fan of using demonstration of incorrect behavior as a training technique for children of this age, I do not see your skit as being personally harmful to a scout.

 

Bob White

 

[Twocubdad]

You asked for an explaination of how this could be used to improve uniforming in the unit or with an individual Scout. I provided one. But because it didn't support the preconceived point you wanted to make, you've labeled it a "waste of time" that will only "confuse minds" of the Scouts.

 

I've pointed out -- for the third time now -- that using this to humiliate a specific Scout would be wrong. But also tried to show how this can be used positively, especially with Cubs who enjoy a little silliness at pack meetings. Is that the part you don't get?(This message has been edited by Twocubdad)

[Bob White]

Again twocubdad,

This is a different problem. I do not see your skit as harmful to a scout, I do see it as very funny. If the purpose of the skit is to entertain I would thing it was very effective.

I would even bet if you asked a scout what your exaggerated uniform looked like that many would be able to recall it in great detail because of the visual impression it made.

 

But, if the goal was to train or educate its results were probably less successful than you might think. At this age children learn a lot from what they see and experience. What they saw was a funny uniform in a funny skit. What they learned was if you dress funny you can make people laugh and have a good time (not that there is anything wrong with that). But showing the wrong thing is not as effective a teaching tool as demonstrating the right way.

 

Would you teach a child how to tie a shoe by showing him ways to not tie it? Do you teach someone how to dress by dressing funny? Or do you teach him how to dress funny by dressing funny?

 

I am sure you entertained and thats fine, but was that your goal?

 

Bob White

(This message has been edited by Bob White)