Uniform Changes

[yaworski]

"A well-designed pair of convertible trousers will not chafe when zipped off, because the zippers will not touch the skin. "

 

It isn't the zipper rubbing on the skin that's the problem. The problem is that the zipper is stiff compared the cloth and that's what rubs.

 

I've tried them all, expensive and cheap and none have been satisfactory for me.

 

"some in technical clothing"

 

As opposed to that Liberal Arts clothing?

 

 

 

 

[k9gold-scout]

My idea would be to keep the color and style but change the fabric and the cut. Zip off pants and roll up long sleve shirts would be good. I would like to see the old square insigna for jr leaders and the round ones for adults.

[glocker21]

I tend to agree that a heavy duty coat in the gore tex type parka with zip out liner OR the heavy duty M65 style coat. I have noticed that there is a tan model.

 

I think that the parka style with the zip out liner is the Better of the two.

[SR540Beaver]

My 2 cents. I was a Cub Scout 35 years ago and was a Webelo the first year the rank appeared. My 9 year old son just joined a pack last week as a Webelo I. Our pack allows the Webelos to choose between the blue Cub Scout or tan Boy Scout uniform. Some wear their neckerchef under the collar and some over. Some are tucked in and some hanging out. Basically, it is helter skelter. Mind you, we've only been in one week, so this is my first impression. My son played competitive baseball for the last four years. His coaches were adamant about their uniforms and I think scouting should be the same way. We decided before each game which uniform would be worn. You came to the game wearing the uniform properly. That meant the right socks, wear your belt, your shirt buttoned and tucked in, and your hat on the right way (not like a punk rapper). No matter how hot it was, a baseball team does not play in shorts. A player does not take the field without a hat. After the game, the coach had better not see you running around the park with your shirt unbuttoned and hanging out. When you have the uniform on and you are at the ballpark, you represent your team and will look like a ball player. Etc, etc. You get the picture. The point was teaching the boys (even at 5 years old) discipline, self-esteem and pride. They knew the rules and followed them.

 

I think scouting is an even more serious venture than baseball and think the pack and dens/troops and patrols should have specified uniform codes and follow them. If the boys know what is expected of them, they will have more respect and take greater pride in their uniforms and in scouting.

 

Having said all of that, I was somewhat shocked at the price and quality of the uniforms. We bought the olive shorts and they were either too big or too tight. They look like they won't have much give and will be binding. The pockets are too small for any useful purpose. The shirt we bought a size bigger and I think it will do fine. The epulats look cool for dress, but could be a pain in the field. I think the hats look dorky and like something my grandfather would wear. Luckily, our pack does not wear them. I bought some genuine military issue BDU's for hunting and love them. I wish the scout uniforms were made from the heavy ripstop material of the BDU's. The pants need to be looser and have roomy cargo pockets. The zippered short/long legs would be a huge plus too. The shirts need true long tails. I wouldn't mind paying the price I did if the clothing were more functional for the field and looked a little more stylish. My son has tried to talk a number of his friends into joining and everyone of them has complained about the dorky uniforms. I don't want them to turn the uniform into a preppy school uniform, but something a little more modern and stylish would attract more kids. I love tradition, but updating things can only help.

[scoutldr]

I have seen the reference to "you wouldn't think of wearing half a uniform on the baseball or football team, would you?"...ad nauseam. The difference is that, in organized sports, the uniform is issued to the player and turned back in at the end of the season...the parent does not have to purchase it...to the tune of almost a hundred bucks. In four years of varsity baseball, all I had to buy was the hat, socks and cup.

 

My 24 year old former Scout son is now playing softball on a church team...guess what...they all got a team shirt, but there are 11 different kinds of pants and hats on the field. Same problem...EXCEPT...nobody seems obsessed about it like we are...

 

As I have said in another post...BSA ARE YOU LISTENING????? You make it hard for kids to be scouts and adults to be leaders by "mandating" poor quality uniforms at outrageous prices...it's no wonder our numbers are dwindling.

[Twocubdad]

I'd like to second an earlier post relating to a parka with a zip-out liner. Scouts in cold weather look like a bunch of homeless people (sorry if that's not PC). I recently bought a really nice Columbia parka with a breathable shell and a nice liner for $135. I know that's steep for kids, but if you could buy each half for half price, that may be more doable. And kid certainly don't need the quality of a Columbia parka.

 

I've always loved my Woolrich jac-shirt, but at almost $100, it's no steal, either. It's great for cool, but not cold weather and you don't want to wear it in the rain. Plus, it has to be dry cleaned.

 

Here's another idea -- why don't they bite the bullet and develop an actual "Class B" summer uniform. Shorts, socks, hat and a nice, cable knit golf shirt, similar to the red activity shirts they have now. (But better than the current one. It's 50/50 blend and feels like you're wearing a trash bag in the summer.) Needs to be 100% cotton. There needs to be some easy way to attach some insignia -- maybe some system of a pocket-protector-type gizmo that clips onto the pocked and carries council, troop, rank and name info. Could be taken off for activities where it may get in the way.

 

[SR540Beaver]

Scoutldr,

 

Your kids must not have played baseball in little league. Varsity uniforms may be free and returned at the end of the season, but little league uniforms are not. The last season my son played, we had two uniforms and could make a third out of parts of the other two. A ball cap, a jersey, a vest, a t-shirt, socks and 2 pairs of pants set us back about $175.00. This team disbanded after the season, so you get to start all over with the next team. In three seasons of baseball (which included both a spring and a fall season) my son played for five different teams. That meant five different uniforms anywhere from $50 up to the $175.00. Add to that sliding pants, a supporter and cleats everytime they grow (this was between 5 yrs and 8 yrs) and you spend a small fortune. Oh yeah, there were the team dues too, which didn't cover all the expenses, so we had fund-raisers each season. We played on competitve teams, but the experience of the recreational teams was costly too.

 

Scouts are a uniformed group. It bugs me to no end to see the kids mismatched and sloppy. I went to pack meeting this week and saw all manner of dress. From kids who did'nt even bother to put any part of their uniform on to kids walking around with their tails untucked, their shirts unbuttoned over t-shirts, no neckerchiefs, neckerchiefs over the collar, under the collar and some tied on without a slide. Some wore belts, some did'nt. None had on uniform pants. Patches are a hodge podge at best. The pack we are in is in an affluent enough neighborhood to afford uniforms easily, even if the quality is poor and the prices high. These are the same kids who's parents don't think twice about paying $175.00 for baseball uniforms and wouldn't dream of letting their kid show up for a game half dressed.

 

Sorry, but the lessons scouting has to offer is 10 times more important than what any sport can teach....and I was quite a disciple about the lessons of sports. A scout needs to be proud of scouting and needs to show it partly thru his uniform. Uniform means uniform. Unifed in form. If they can't even dress the part, how can they live the part? If they are casual in dressing as a scout, they will be casual in being a scout.

 

Now, if only BSA would update the uniforms to something the boys like, make it rugged, usable quality and affordable in price, everyone would be happy.

[KoreaScouter]

Yaworski;

 

I'm not a dermatologist, so I don't have a solution to your problem...but for the 99.9% of us who CAN wear convertible pants, they oughta be an option!

 

I'm sure you're pulling my leg about "technical" clothing, but in case you're not, here's an example:

 

- Gore-tex parka shell, with removable polartec liner, taped seams, armpit vents, multiple pockets, detachable hood, sewn-in Scotchlite panels, shock-corded waist and bottom: Technical.

 

- Wool jac-shirt: not Technical.

 

I've said it before: A uniform isn't required in order to be a BSA member; unless/until it is, full uniforming will be a utopian dream, no matter how nice a dream it is. I don't know what BSA's afraid of...using the same sports league analogy we all like to use, the lads will wear a full baseball uniform even if they have to buy it, because the league REQUIRES it in order to play. If BSA required a uniform, they'd get one, too...or they'd quit.

 

KS