Keeping your Eagle Scouts?

[Sentinel947]

Besides Eagle Palms, what ways are there to continue Eagle Scouts to stay and contribute back to the Troop? Or should they? I seem to be one of the few Eagle Scouts in my town who actually continue with the Troop into adulthood. Is it better to just let them walk than try to keep them on? I was wondering what some of the wise men here thought.

 

Sentinel.

[fred8033]

For young adults ... it's good to leave the nest. Even the scouting nest. Get out. Experience life. First learned that years ago from watching the 1970s TV series The Paper Chase. Got to admit though, I agree with it. And I've done it several times moving coast-to-coast for years at a time until finally getting married and having kids. There's something about cutting the umbilacal cord. Later, you can return to scouting fresh with more experience.

 

Then again, if you stay in as an adult, that's fine too. Each person experiences his own path.

 

For youth though, give'em adventure, responsibility, friendship, good experiences and respect. Some will stay. Some won't. Just be happy with eagle scout you have.(This message has been edited by fred8033)

[ScouterAdam]

They can be a JASM, Troop Guides or ask them what they want to do.

[Second Class]

If you have a fun and challenging high adventure program, they will want to stay until they have to leave.

[Eagle92]

Here's my $.02 worth.

 

#1. Instill in the Scouts from a young age the sense of "giving back" and helping out the younger Scouts. This may seem counter-intuitive, i.e. let them go out on their own, but I've seen it work several times over.

 

In my troop growing up, yes we had folks go away for a while; college, military, etc. But it seemed as if every time they had a chance to come back and visit, they did. Heck one of my best friends in Scouts was the official leader in charge of the troop at summer camp b/c he was 21 and home from college. Part of it was because from about Second Class onwards, we had them working with the younger Scouts: mentoring, teaching skills, etc.

 

In a troop I help start, at one point there were more ASMs in the 18-20 y.o. range than Scouts, because the college students wanted to give back. as well as...

 

#2 "Scouting is OUTING," and the program needs to be youth led and FUN! Having the youth create a program that suites their needs and wants will keep the program vibrant and alive. How do you think a troop with no feeder pack was able to survive for over 5 years, when another troop with a feeder pack, but also a very headstrong SM who ran things his way (adult led) fold once the SM left? Yes you need to cover the basics on campouts, but every opportunity for the older scouts to run things or do some things on their own, i.e. doing a more difficult trail than the rest of the troop, going a little further and having their own camp backpacking etc. you need to do it.

 

#3 Use the Patrol Method. Now I may seem to contradict myself from other posts when I say I do not like NSPs and same age patrols, preferring mixed age patrols, But I grew up in the era of the Leadership Corps and saw it work out successfully. Yes they were the "older Scouts" for the most part, but I remember getting elected into the LC ( troop rules: LC members selected their own based upon some requirements) when some folks older than me, and PLs longer than me, were still in their patrols. The LC did a lot of work, but they also had a lot of fun too.

 

EDITED: To clarify, by having the scouts work in patrols, they become a team, establish friendships and do things that they want to do. Up until last year, patrol scould do their own activities without adult leaders if they got approval. While sometimes adults would be there along for the ride, or in my case the adults were in the 18-20 y.o. range, the patrol could do their own thing.

 

 

#4 Provide HA and other opportunities to the older guys. Even if your troop doesn't do HA on a regular basis, establish relationships within the district and council so that you know what units are doing HA and may have spots available. My troop never did a HA trip while I was a member, but we had a bunch go to Philmont, Canada, Jambo etc.

 

#5 Did I mention HAVE FUN? (This message has been edited by Eagle92)

[SeattlePioneer]

>

 

 

That's probably good advice.

 

 

Larger troops may have or develop specialists for these kinds of activities.

 

Perhaps OA should be organizing activities like this that Scouts from around the district will find it attractive to join in.

[Beavah]

Yah, hmmm...

 

I reckon if yeh lose your older boys and Eagle Scouts, yeh have a weak program that needs some work. Odds are yeh are too focused on Advancement. Advancement has become da goal instead of a fun method along the way, and so when yeh hit Eagle yeh feel like you're done.

 

What is there for older boys? Leadership! That's da biggest draw, bigger than high adventure activities by far. Those are now a dime a dozen. Yeh can find climbing walls in many shopping malls. But Leadership, being treated like an adult and being trusted to put things together, to lead and teach younger boys, to be truly responsible - that's somethin' that is rarer than hen's teeth in da modern world of hovering over kids like they're made of glass. It's somethin' all lads crave.

 

Beavah

 

 

[Stosh]

With everyone worrying about the older boys leaving one has a couple of options:

 

1) Keep with the same old, same old so that the bored older boys are guaranteed jumping ship just as soon as they are able.

 

2) Have your Eagle take on PL of the HA Venture Patrol that is extremely autonomous and focused on a program designed by them for themselves. This is rather self-focused, but if it keeps the boys in the program it has some merit. I'm a 14 year old Eagle, but next year I want to go to BWCA, the year after Sea Base and the year after that Philmont before I turn 18. Yeah, there's a "problem" for you as adults! "That's going to cost a ton of money, but I bet if you help the younger boys with their program, I bet they will jump in and help out with your fund raisers...." There are a lot of options out there that the adults can offer up to assist the boys' focus on more than just themselves.

 

3) Have them run the whole show as top leaders in your troop with SM and ASM's sitting in the wings to assist. Instead of having a troop committee run everything have a "committee of boys" running everything. The troop committee of adults can sit back and monitor and assist with what the boys are up to.

 

Personally, I would shy away from option #1.

 

If one opts for #3, make sure you're boys have really earned their Eagle and are capable of doing what is expected of them as Eagles.

 

Stosh

[SeattlePioneer]

I think a good deal of the problem of losing older Scouts is that they have achieved what Scouting promised them when they joined.

 

That's first of all learning to be competent hikers and campers --- the Trail to First Class.

 

 

Beyond that, leadership and Eagle are programs a good many Scouts will take up and that troops are commonly able to provide.

 

 

For older Scouts, though, interest are a lot more diverse and it's probably harder to find a common program and expertise to lead meaningful programs on robotics, engineering, medicine or whatever.

 

Explorers made it possible to participate in some career fields in meaningful ways, as does Sea Scouts. But it's probably hard to provide programs of that kind within most troops.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Twocubdad]

All of the above.

 

But first of all, how old are these guys? If they're 17+ and Eagle I don't see an issue. They're getting ready for college and looking for new adventures and opportunities. The mission of the BSA isn't grow ASM, you know. If these guys are 14, 15 or young 16-y.o.s, that's another matter....

 

The pat, by-the-book answer is high adventure. Hmmmm..... I think that is more of a response from the marketing department than programming. Seventeen-year-old Eagle Scouts ought to be out camping and backpacking whenever and where ever they like. Why would the wait for a bunch of 11-y.o.s to tag along? HA in the sense of Philmont, Seabase or Northern Tier is far too sporatic -- yeah, it's a big carrot, but on a really long stick. A year-and-a-half of planning for a fairly expensive trip. That may keep them on the roster, but not necessarily "active". And programming HA for a large group is tough for a troop. You almost have to do everything. With our group of 6-8 older Scouts in our troop now, a couple are into backpacking; a couble into SCUBA; a couple biking. It's hard to satisfy the hard core and still attract the other.

 

See Beav's comments on Leadership.

 

Unfortunately, the third leg of the stool has been cut short -- advancement. That these guys are already Eagle you've lost one of your most important tools. Back to my question regarding age, if these Scouts are 14 or 15, THAT'S your problem. You fell for the baloney from national to push the boys through or let them run through to Eagle as fast as the wanted. Unfortunately, if this is the case you've lost one of your greatest motivational tools available. the best use of advancement to keep the interest of older Scout is starting with Tenderfoot, help guide the Scouts' along the flightpath so that the land in the Eagle's nest sometime their junior or senior year of high school. Otherwise, they better be focused on other elements of the program (such as OA)to hold their interests.

 

(And no, not many guys are going to be motivated to work on merit badges just to get a palm. My observation has been the Eagles who ALREADY have a bunch of MBs will put in the minimal effort to complete the palms, but guys aren't likely to go out and earn 5, 10, 15 more MBs just for the palms.)

 

My experience, both as a Scout and as a Scoutmaster, is one of the greatest factors in keeping these guys involved is friendship. If their buddies are in Scouts, they will be too. But that's like capturing a moonbeam. How do you do that? Yeah, you can work to patrol method toward that end. You can give the older guys the opportunities to do things as an older patrol. But either you are good friends with the the guys in the troop and want to go to Scouts to be with them or not.

 

(This message has been edited by Twocubdad)

[qwazse]

If your troop is doing all of the positive things above, then you need to ask yourself "what are Eagles here for?"

 

We just told these boys they are "marked men". That they will be called upon to do unique things in our community and for our country. So, a boy gets his bird, then what is it time for?

 

Junior firefighter, ROTC, EMT?

Counselor for the church youth group?

A mission needs to deliver medical supplies to a village accessible only by foot?

The conservation researcher needs volunteers to help with a year round survey of game lands?

The high school sports team is looking for captains with real leadership skills?

The start-up troop down the road needs some youth leadership to get rolling?

And, your troop could stand to have a 10th ASM/JASM?

 

Based on everything we've taught him, an Eagle will look to serve the greatest need that could use his talents. It's unlikely that he'll stick around and do what a bunch of 1st class scouts are doing well enough on their own.

 

[Sentinel947]

You guys make excellent points. and it seems to be systematic. Whether they get their Eagle at 15-17 the result is still the same. I was wondering how often Troops manage to hold onto their Eagles, and I seem to have the answer.

[jpstodwftexas]

I can only speak as to why I stayed in Scouting and returned to Scouting

 

The Core Values of Scouting...Those 12 simple words describe the people I want to be around

 

Doing a Good Deed Daily..and I still do..Manager at Walmart saw me simply returning Carts to the Cart Rack in Parking Lot. She Came over and asked Why I was doing it. I said out of Courtesy. A Few seconds go by and She Asks me "Were you A Boy Scout?".. I smiled and Said " Yes mam, I still am."

 

Friendship...Out of all the Programs I was Involved in Jr High and High School Scouts were the ones I bonded with the closest

 

Sense of Pride..I was never ashamed of wearing a Scout uniform because I am proud to represent an Organization that has a great history as a whole

 

Treated with Respect..Regardless of my experience I was always treated like an Equal..I was never treated like I was inferior..I never heard things like...Oh Let an Older scout do that because they are better at it..Oh Let a first class scout do that because they are trained for it..Your Taking to long let some one else do it that is faster...

School Sports and Other Programs your Participation is Based on Ability and they reject you if your Not in the Top Percentage or you get get to practice and Stand on the Sidelines will the "Stars" participate..

 

If a Troop is only Pushing Eagle on a Schedule I believe they will lose Scouts as soon as they turn Eagle..

 

Eagles should be Utilized in a Leadership Role..Teaching Merit Badges..Cooking, Pitching Tents, Writing Troop News Letters,

 

Keeping Eagles is no different than retaining an Scout..It is treating them with Respect

[Eagle92]

jpstodwftexas,

 

Must respectfully disagree with this part of your statement "Eagles should be...Teaching Merit Badges...."

 

Unfortunately national says only Adults 18+ can sign off on MBs. So a under 18 Eagle cannot be a MBC.

 

BUT they can teach the skills needed to show their MBCs to earn the MB

 

I remember the older scouts teaching me canoeing skills way back when, and prior to doing my canoe trip in Canada, helping the others in the troop work on and improve their canoeing skills.

 

And I wouldn't limit it to just Eagles. Anyone with the KSAs to teach a skill should be doing it. I was Life when I worked with others on canoeing.

[Troop185]

I do not know if there is a secret method to keep your Eagle Scouts around, but if you can, it sure is great for your troop.

 

Last May, at our Tenderfoot Weekend / Webelos Campout, a Webelos parents said to me, "I am really impressed with your older scouts!" I told him, "I would be impressed too."

 

This parent had just talked to two of our older, Eagle Scouts: Scout #1, 20 years old in college. His dad and him, despite now living 200 miles away, return every year for our Tenderfoot Weekend. This was his 8 year. This scout is also, working (his 3rd summer) at a Boy Scout Camp. Eagle at the age of 17 1/2.

 

Scout #2, just turned 18 and graduating from H.S. this year. [He spent a week on a wilderness canoeing trip in Northern Ontario, when he was only 9 years old.] Eagle at the age of 13. He was the older Boy Scout in charge of this parents, son's Webelos Den, for the Weekend. I told him, we will not tell tell the Webelos that you are already 18.

 

By the way, scout #2 has an older brother, who was the first Eagle Scout that I can remember, that stay with the troop after getting his Eagle at the age of 15. This scout is studing to be a priest at Notre Dame.

 

What parents would not be impress to have their son be around other scouts like these?