Eagle Letters... extreme recipients?

[SMT224]

Beavah - I understand and appreciate your comments.

Thanks.

[BSA24]

Show me in the Scoutmaster's Handbook, any edition, where it recommends that the scoutmaster is in charge of Eagle awards. He's not. The Eagle Scout Award is given by national, not by you. The boy will receive it whether you like it or not.

 

It's the Eagle Scout's COH, not the troop's. He is already an Eagle Scout. He already is entitled to the award as soon as National accepts the application and stamps it. That's it. He's done. He can buy the award on ebay and wear it.

 

Beavah is dead wrong on this one. I like how kindly he writes, but I don't believe that will reach you. You need to be electro-shocked out of your current practice of sending out letters.

 

The best SM's have boy-led troops. The boys plan the COH's, not the SM. The SM merely advises the SPL and prevents stupid, destructive plans or a lack of planning. The boys should be planning these ceremonies.

 

As for an Eagle Ceremony, the recipient should plan the event. It shouldn't be tagged onto a regular COH unless he wishes. He plans the date. He arranges the location. He can print some invitations, and he can invite everyone on Earth to it and provide snacks if he wants.

 

The image of you mailing out announcements to me is ridiculous. It smacks of everything that is wrong with a troop where the parents are heavily involved in everything and don't allow the boys to grow up.

 

Condescending? You're dang right I am condescending to you. You're making a boy's Eagle Award about you. Get over yourself and get back into the back seat where the SM belongs.

 

It's not your troop. It's the boy's troop.

 

Give the letters back to the boy, tell him it's his COH, ask him to kindly invite you to it, and tell him you would be honored to give him his badge if he will allow it.

 

Treat him like a man instead of just pinning a medal on him and saying it.

 

[SMT224]

Goodness BSA24!

 

Whats the point of your rant? That the Scoutmaster should not ever send an Eagle announcement? Fine, so dont. But dont turn your guns on me because I do so and because its the tradition and culture of our Troop. If you believe the Eagle should do it all, then by all means make that the tradition in your Troop. But dont do your mommy smothering thing on me because I believe otherwise. Back off! How you can link this to all that is wrong with kids today really is ridiculous.

 

How did this discussion go from me sending Eagle letters to me planning the ECOH? In our Troop thats entirely up to the Eagle Scout and his family. Since this was never discussed in my OP or subsequent discussion, I dont see how you made that leap.

 

And sending an Eagle letter makes the Eagle Award about me? Seriously? It means Im proud of his achievement and have no problem sharing that pride. Whats the problem with that? It hardly turns it in to my award.

 

How in the world do you think it will make him a man by asking him to kindly invite you to it, and tell him you would be honored to give him his badge if he will allow it. Sounds more like itll make him a spoiled brat!

 

Yea, its about him, but the ECOH is also about the Troop, his parents, and all the leaders who helped him get to Eagle. Plus it's about all the other Scouts in the Troop who helped him with his project and camped with him over all the years. It's not just about him, it's about him and everyone in the Troop who helped him make Eagle.

 

[NJCubScouter]

I think the first thing I would do is identify for yourself (and maybe share with us, though if part of this is a list of music acts that a current 17-year-old likes, chances are I won't have heard of them) the potential recipients that REALLY cause you concern. Politically extreme and rabid commentators? Everybody has their own definition of "extreme." You mean like someone who advocates violence? Or someone like Rush Limbaugh, who some people (including me) just disagree with all the time? Musicians with controversial lyrics? When I was a kid, "Let's spend the night together" was too racy for the Ed Sullivan show. (Though admittedly I was too young at the time to know what was going on with that, or what "spending the night together" meant, but I found out later.) I do realize that in the ensuing 45 years, there have been songs with lyrics that are truly objectionable, but what are we really talking about here. Again, are we talking about violence? You do say that some of the sports starts have been involved with "criminal or abusive activities." I guess the criminal part would concern me. You do not need to involve yourself in the glorification of people who are known for committing crimes and violent acts. But it sounds like the "list" is kind of a mixture of people to be legitimately concerned about, and people who you wouldn't put on YOUR list. But it isn't your list.

 

So then when I had the issue really narrowed down, I would have a talk with the Scout. Do you realize that X did Y? Do you realize that A is a symbol of B? Then see what kind of answers you get. Maybe if he says that you are trying to meet him halfway, the issue will take care of itself.

[SMT224]

Yep NJCubScouter, you are right. My own views are clearly part of how I see the names he put on the list.

 

So yes, I will sit down and talk with him (tomorrow night in fact) and hope to get a better idea why he wants me to send letters to these folks.

[Lisabob]

SMT I admit, now I'm really curious. Could you give a couple of examples?

 

 

 

 

[Beavah]

Beavah is dead wrong on this one.... You need to be electro-shocked out of your current practice of sending out letters.

 

Yah, hmmmm...

 

Of course, as Mrs. Beavah would say, I'm usually dead wrong about everything. I'm just one fellah expressin' one opinion.

 

In my opinion, though, there aren't really too many things that require electro-shock therapy. I reckon we can save that for folks who cover up Jerry Sandusky type behavior. It's probably a bit over the top to resort to electro-shock over requestin' a few congratulatory letters. What SMT224 describes is da norm for about 90% of da troops out there, so we'd be shockin' an awful lot of scouters.

 

It's the Eagle Scout's COH, not the troop's.

 

Nope, it's the troop's court of honor for the Eagle Scout. If yeh go back and read things like da SM Handbook and the Troop Committee Handbook and such, you'll find that the responsibility for Courts of honor belongs to the Troop Committee.

 

So to borrow da school analogy, the diploma is approved by the School Board, and presented at a high school graduation, where the graduate and his family are guests of honor. Then the family might have a party. The Eagle Scout award is approved by national, presented at a troop court of honor, where the Eagle and his family are guests of honor. Then, if they want, da family can have a (separate) party.

 

Now, the troop court of honor can certainly be planned by the PLC and boys in the troop, and personally I think it should be. It also should take into account reasonable requests by the Eagle or his family. But I reckon a boy planning his own award ceremony is a bit weird, eh? That sort of thing would be considered a bit gauche and self-centered for any other award.

 

Beavah

 

 

[johnponz]

I agree with Beav on this (all points). The COH is the Troop's. They are honoring the Scout's achievement as they honor every other advancement. This one is just a little more formal and a little more special to all involved, recipient, leaders, parents and troop.

 

Some troops have a reception afterward and some families have their own reception (party). I don't think that matters much.

 

As far as the letters, send them out. You might be surprised at some of the responses. It wouldn't surprise me too much to find out some of those "extremes" are also eagles. As BSA 24 likes to point out about other matters, Scouting is supposed to be fun.

 

In the past he has accused me of being of the uniform police variety (which I can be a little). However, I would never advocate electro-shock for someone wearing their OA sash on their belt.

(This message has been edited by johnponz)

[Trevorum]

Clearly, different troops have different traditions with regards to these issues. Probably none are right and none are wrong.

 

Our troop takes no part in planning or conducting an Eagle CoH, leaving that 100% up to the Scout(s)and his/their families. Unlike a regularly scheduled CoH, it is not a troop event although the troop membership is generally invited.

 

Similarly, our adult leadership does not send out requests to dignitaries and personalities for Eagle congratulation letters. The family of the Scout often does this. With regard to SMT224's original question, if your troop traditionally send out these requests to a standard list, I feel that the Scout should be responsible for sending out any special requests.

[johnponz]

What sense is there in a Scout planning his own COH? What other award requires the person being honored to plan the ceremony. This system just does not make sense to me (tradition or not).

[fred8033]

I would be very interested to understand... Where the tradition of eagle scouts planning their own COH started? Where it started as a separate event from a normal COH? Where it became so much more formal filled pomp than all the other ranks?

 

Our troop usually does separate ECOH planned by the scout family. We had one recently that was just part of the normal troop COH. I much prefer the normal troop COH, planned by the troop and including recognizing the new Eagle scout. I'm not trying to diminish eagle. I'd just rather see it as a troop event.

[Trevorum]

To clarify, Eagles are recognized at out regular CoHs, the same as every other advancement.