Guide to Advancement - What Needs to Change?

[Beavah]

I haven't heard you suggest any changes to advancement either or represent anything that lowers quality. I believe everyone on this discussion believes in holding scouts to high expectations, learn skills, grow as a person and develop a strong moral character.

 

Yah, hmmm...

 

What it comes down to is this, fred8033. Most of us feel that a First Class Scout should be able to handle food storage and preparation properly and safely. We believe that is the only rational way to interpret "the requirements". We believe that is the only way that other lads, like 5yearscouter's boy and Lisabob's son, will respect the awards and be willing to pursue them as goals.

 

Bnelon44 has stated clearly that in his view, expecting a First Class scout to be able to handle food storage and preparation properly and safely is adding to the requirements. I have a few decades on Bnelon44 and probably more international contacts, and I say that in the BSA program as well as the international Scouting movement, that interpretation is entirely wrong, and is in fact subtracting from da requirements and violating the Rules & Regulations of the BSA.

 

You think we have gone "rogue", and the rest of us would say that you have "gone rogue" and are hurtin' the image and usefulness of the advancement program for all of da rest of us who actually know how to use it.

 

And that's where we're at. The BSA doesn't care one way or another, eh? They're happy to take money from any of us. Some parents like your & bnelon's approach, because they don't want their little darlings to every be "grilled", "denied" or "flunked", and their focus is on "the requirements" and the credential. Some parents prefer our approach because they want their child to build some real skills, not just in outdoor pursuits but in how to learn and achieve and live independently, and they figure advancement should reflect those skills. They don't mind their little darlings being challenged to their ability level and occasionally discoverin' they need to work harder than they thought in order to succeed.

 

I support both kinds of troops, eh? Good people in each. I help folks think about how to do FCFY well if they want, or to do da madcap badge race if that's what they're into. But if yeh ask me which has better outcomes for kids in terms of what I personally care about for outcomes, it's da second approach, eh? The approach that makes Lisabob's son proud to stay fully involved and active as a teenager.

 

Beavah

 

[bnelon44]

Beavah

 

How you tested when you were active in the program is fine as long as it is done at the testing phase and you are testing what the requirements are asking you to test.

 

The only problem I have is when people stack other obstacles in the Scout's way that are not in the requirements and not sign him off because they "expect a First Class Scout to know _____" fill in the blank.

 

It has pretty much always been the process in the BSA that during the learning (preparation) phase the Scout learns by doing. The skill is explained to him and he is guided through it. Usually multiple times and given multiple opportunities in the field to exercise the skill. Then he is tested

 

Once the testing phase is done, and he is in the Review phase and sitting (not standing) in front of a Board of Review, the Scout is not retested.

 

That is the current process and the same process Bill Hillcourt presented in 1936.

 

As I pointed out, B-P was more lenient than Hillcourt. As I pointed out B-P said how much a Scout tries should be taken into consideration as to his passing the test or not. That is the BSA standard for Cub Scout advancement, not Boy Scout advancement.(This message has been edited by bnelon44)