Introducing the Guide to Advancement

[Beavah]

The frustration is that he was FAILED number one

 

Nah, he was told that he had not yet fulfilled all da requirements, and by your and his own admission, that was the case. So by your own and his admission, he was not yet ready to advance. We might agree that da scout badge is "trivial" compared with first aid, or not. . No matter how yeh cut it, not being ready is not a "failure", it's just not being ready. Failure only happens in schools where there is a time limit on learning.

 

Again, as a parent, I think this is da right time to teach your son about personal honor. He wasn't ready, he admits that, and he should have worked as hard on the scouty stuff as on the other items. Help him be the guy that is thorough and nails all of da expectations, not the parent that excuses being lax in some because they're "trivial.". You'll like the results better.

 

As a troop, yeh may have a point, eh? But that's other people's jobs to deal with. Yeh might let 'em know, politely, about your perceptions, and then give 'em time to work on it. Or yeh might step up and volunteer to help out in some way. Of course if yeh think that things are so awful that your son is losing ground in terms of his development by being involved, then yeh should find something else for him to do.

 

Beavah

[trainerlady]

Moose - yes POR elections are next week. Troop rules are you have to be first class (what he was trying for last night) to have a term in a POR count for Star. If you start a POR as a second class and move to first during your term it doesn't count, don't know why, just another the way we do it thing - too hard to count time served for each boy if they move ranks during a POR???. Also son won't be going to summer camp this year as we are spending a few weeks out of the country on a once in a life time globe trot courtsey of the late father-in-law. The troop has a policy that if you aren't going to summer camp you can't hold a POR over the summer term.

 

We don't live in the country, but our troop is the only one to meet on Sunday nights. Only one troop in the area meets on a night other than Monday and it only has 6 kids, 3 of whom are active. Monday is not an option for the family at this time. So there really isn't another option available to us.

[Eagle92]

Trainer,

 

Now you and I both know that what your troop is doing in regards to POR is incorrect and is appealable for a BOR. Sorry ot hear that there are no other options for troops.

 

Sometimes you have to adapt and overcome. Sometimes when folks through obstacles in your way, go right through them.

 

Good luck.

[Beavah]

 

Now you and I both know that what your troop is doing in regards to POR is incorrect and is appealable for a BOR.

 

Nope. No appeals anymore for T-2-1. Star and Life are appealable, but only to council.

 

Trainerlady, no time in a POR before First Class "counts" in any way. Yeh have to serve "while a First Class Scout". Expecting a lad to be First Class to serve in a POR is a common expectation of larger troops and troops that use FCFY.

 

B

(This message has been edited by Beavah)

[moosetracker]

Beav - I believe what Trainer Lady is saying is that if he gets elected to a position 15 minutes before he has his BOR, then the whole 6 months of doing that position does not count for his POR at FirstClass working to Star Rank.. Which is odd, because it is on the same night.. Even wrong would be if they held elections next week and he got a position, then the following week he had a BOR.. By rights he should get credit for the 6 months minus the one week that he held the job while at first class status..

 

Also if he was in a position for 6 months 3 of them at first and 3 of them at Star, then 3 should count for first class (if needed) and the other 3 count at Star rank working toward his Life.. But if I am correct with how this troop operates, the POR will not be credited at either rank, because it was not performed 100% in one rank or the other..

[Eagle92]

Actually if memory serves, only 4 months POR is needed for Star while a First Class Scout. Again the rule is adding to requirements, and appealable.

[Jay K]

Prove to me that a Scout (And I have a very high opininion of just about every Scout) CANNOT demonstrate a skill one month after passing a requirement. I have seen that nearly 100% Can.

Any Scout in my Troop can sharpen an axe after seeing 1 five minute demonstration, and then doing it himself. I never sharpen my axe. I pick a Scout to do it, and WOW! They still know how! I'm shocked. They can still ride a bike, too. They can even pass a Swim test every year. I noticed a reference t a Sheep Shank. It isn't required.

[BartHumphries]

The Pioneering merit badge requires you to run through the Tenderfoot through First Class knots, then tie a few more knots including a sheepshank -- that might be where the confusion is coming from, Jay K?

[Eagle92]

Jay,

 

Either you A) must have a strong OUTDOOR program, GREAT FOR YOU!

 

B)You have told your scouts what the expectations are, i.e. mastery of the skill or to use today's GtA they are able to do the skills, they truly learn and retain the skills, and the Scouts and leaders signing off on the requirements make sure the expectations is met, again GREAT FOR YOU!

 

OR C) all the above.

 

I'm leaning towards C with ya.

 

But unfortunately I have met scouts who do not know the skills. One of whom wore an Eagle badge and medal, as well as his sash, who couldn't tell me anything about some of the MBs he earned when I asked about them.

[BartHumphries]

Well, in his defense, that happened to me. Some of the merit badge icons aren't the most intuitive icons, especially if you haven't looked at the actual badge image for a couple years. For instance, I usually remembered that the green cross was the stuff that the Red Cross teaches, first aid, but the white cross was... (Safety). Swimming is pretty obvious but the one with the broken tree with three separate fires lit under it was... (Wilderness Survival). Then there's the Recycling? merit badge... I mean the Environmental Science merit badge (well, it looks like a big recycling symbol).

 

I eventually used a black sharpie to write the name of each badge on the back of the sash where it was sewn.(This message has been edited by BartHumphries)

[trainerlady]

Son got through his SMC last night. He and 2 other boys got proper SMCs last night not the previously mentioned interrogations. The 2 other boys had been signed off for 1st class requirements for over 1 year but hadn't gotten the SMC done because they were afraid of the SMC and getting interrogated. They are twins and one has moderate to severe learning disabilities and he just gets massively flustered with the improper SMCs that had done before. In 4 months the boys should be Star (they has almost all of their Eagle requireds done and each won a POR in the election). The twin without issues hadn't advanced out of loyalty to his brother, they were doing it together.

 

Seems the SM and the CC had a change of heart on doing their own thing when they were called on running an inappropriate SMC when they knew better. We'll see how long it lasts. I know of 4-5 more scouts that have been dodging SMCs for the same reasons. Maybe now we'll see some kids that should have advanced long ago get to where they belong.

[Eagle92]

Trainer,

 

1) Glad the interrogations are over.

 

2) Any SM worth their salt will know their scouts, and work with them,not against them, at their SMC. My oldest has some speech problems, and I know how he can get at times when he gets nervous. Again a good SMC knows his scouts.

 

3) Think the outdoor program will improve to reinforce those skills.