who can sit on a tenderfoot board of review?

[5yearscouter]

Well I've seen the file at council where the advancement reports get put after you turn them in at the scout shop to buy your badges. Nobody looks at them further than to see ok it's troop 123 and there are signatures as needed.

 

There is no place for names, only signatures, so unless council persons can identify which chicken scratched signature belongs to which troop committee person, there is no real way to check this except at the troop level.

 

In this instance, it was actually 1 registered troop committee person, 1 troop parent who used to be a registered scouter but isn't currently, and 1 borrowed from another troop SM who sat on the board of review.

 

other available adult at camp was a SM or ASM for the scout's own troop. This was an out of council small camp that didn't have that many personel available and well they weren't all that friendly to help out for a BOR. Could have probably begged someone to do it, but it still wouldn't have been persons registered on the scout's troop committee.

 

like I said our troop is ASM heavy right now, with about 11 of them (3 are 18 year olds)

And we don't have that many active registered troop committee people, and only 2 of them went to camp this year, others had been recently changed to ASM's.

 

our troop gives rank badges immediately at the end of the troop meeting after the BOR. Merit badges and rank cards and parent pins are given out at the next CofH. Internet advancement forms are uploaded before each CofH, individual advancement forms(using the old 3 part form) is filled out by the 3 persons at the end of any BOR, so there are signatures of the persons actually performing the BOR.

 

 

For more interest to this scenario, the BOR forgot to sign the scout's book. They signed the advancement form. 2 can sign the book, but who should sign instead of the 3rd person from out of council who lives 6 hous away? I think the troop advancement chair should perhaps sign the book?

[Oak Tree]

You don't really need three people to sign the book. One (the BOR chair) should be enough. In our troop, like yours, we normally have three people all initial it, but I can't see how that's necessary or even useful in this case.

[Hal_Crawford]

Simple solution for the future. Ask all parents who go to camp who are not already registered scouters to register as committee members. Its not really a big deal. Any parent engaged enough to spend time at camp will probably not mind filling out a form and paying a membership fee. Many troops cover adult membership fees out of unit funds.

 

 

[John-in-KC]

In my Council, if you go to camp, you become a Scouter. Period.

[bnelon44]

Oak Tree, by BSA policy no rank badge or merit badge can be given to a Scout until the advancement form is turned into your council office.

[wjturner]

And of course everyone always follows BSA policy. (Just like all successful experiments are continued.)

[BadenP]

What a bunch of trivalizing and ludicrous nonsense over something so unimportant and quite frankly unnecessary. This is for Tenderfoot, not Eagle, the first rank of boy scouts and you guys are worried about who is on the BOR, personally I think there should be no BOR until at least 1st Class or higher. As who should be on it, any competent adult leader or committee member meets the bill, and it wouldn't hurt to have his SPL and/or PL sitting on it either since they know the boy and his skills better than anyone else. Quote the procedure book all you want but there is the intelligent/logical way to do something or just throwing together whatever you can to meet some ridiculous BSA policy. Unfortunately the second choice seems to be the method of choice here.

[wjturner]

Add to that, BadenP, here as in almost everywhere in life, policies rarely follow the intelligent/logical way to do things, especially when they are created by committees. Too many cooks, etc.

[Beavah]

Oak Tree, by BSA policy no rank badge or merit badge can be given to a Scout until the advancement form is turned into your council office.

 

Yah, this is one of da more ridiculous absurdities, eh? In da BSA we believe in immediate recognition. The lad should get the badge as soon as he has earned it, so he can wear it with pride at the next meeting or outing. He shouldn't have to wait until someone mails paperwork to a council office 3 counties away and then orders a badge to be shipped and arrive two weeks later, after the boy has already gone to camp wearing his old rank.

 

Most good troops recognize a lad right away, usin' an in-troop supply. Paperwork is just paperwork, eh? Kids are important.

 

Making boys wait for BSA paperwork is the tail wagging the dog.

 

Beavah

 

[moosetracker]

I am sure that "no rank is awarded..." crap came because scouts were given their ranks to wear proudly, but the paperwork never did get turned into council, leaving a scout ready for Eagle with 2 or 3 ranks missing from being recorded at council as every having receieved them.

 

Let's face it, we are all bad with that evil paperwork non-sense, unless something forces us to do it.

 

Beavah - It would be nice to award right away, but hard for units to have those spare patches on hand anymore, when they can only buy them with paperwork showing that the council did get the paperwork.

[bnelon44]

There are a lot of ways of cheating and getting badges to stockpile because you don't like following the policy

 

We should remember that all of us stated under our own signature that we would obey BSA policies when we signed up to the program (and renew every year.) We didn't say we would only follow the BSA policies we agreed with.

 

We need to remember why the program is there, and it isn't to circumvent (aka cheat) a policy or teach Scouts how to cheat a policy.

 

We all need to remember that we teach the Scouts more by our actions than our words.

[Beavah]

It would be nice to award right away, but hard for units to have those spare patches on hand anymore

 

Nah, moosetracker, it's easy, eh? If for some reason yeh lost some of your stock, yeh just have current members buy extra patches for additional uniforms and donate 'em to the supply. Members who currently hold the rank can always buy extras, and often have to for a second uniform for NYLT or Jambo, or a lost uniform, or...

 

We need to remember why the program is there

 

Absolutely! And we need to really understand da relationships and policies, eh? A scout being trustworthy and all.

 

Da "policy" bnelon44 mentions is an internal policy that applies only to Scout Shops. Scout shops are asked not to sell restricted items without havin' some documentation in the system that a lad somewhere merits having the patch. That "policy" is not directed at units or volunteer scouters, and they aren't bound by it.

 

What we sign on the adult application is an agreement to follow the Bylaws and Rules & Regulations of the BSA. Those are specific documents, eh? A small set of things that apply to maintaining the BSA's brand image and corporate property. Adult leaders did not agree to follow every piece of BSA program literature, and tellin' folks that is just playin' fast and loose with the truth. Da real truth is that the BSA's mission is to support organizations and volunteers in their youth programs. We offer resources, eh? Friendship and guidance. We don't expect everyone to use or need everything, or do everything the same.

 

Now, if unit volunteers are tryin' to do a good job offering the BSA program, then they know from reading BSA program materials that it's important for lads to receive recognition immediately. Most scout units are not within easy driving distance of a scout shop, eh? For some, the nearest scout shop may be half a state away or more. And we all know council folks are worked pretty hard, and turnin' around paperwork gets delayed at times. So for most there's not even an option of "next week" even if there is a meeting next week that the lad was going to attend.

 

I admit I'm an old-fashioned, put-kids-first sort. I think a lad who has worked hard and finally earned a rank should be able to wear it right away. If he earns it at the meeting on Tuesday he should be able to wear it proudly on the outing that weekend, eh? That's how we show him and others that hard work pays off with recognition. If it's a camporee where he's competing with other patrols his uniform should say "I'm a First Class Scout!". He shouldn't have to explain that his uniform says "Second Class" but that he's really First Class except his badge is tied up in paperwork or the mail.

 

So again, most good troops and caring volunteers keep a stash of badges and reward a boy immediately after his BOR because that's the way the BSA program really works. It teaches boys the proper moral lesson, eh? We care about people, not things. We do what's right to help those whom we serve, not what's convenient for organizational bookkeeping or what makes us feel important and controlling. And most especially, we put the needs of those who are most vulnerable and in need of support ahead of those who are strong and well-resourced. Kids first.

 

Yah, yah, I reckon we've all seen some district and other grey or even a few yellow-tabbers who have forgotten, and start in about a moral duty to paperwork or program. Those are folks who have lost their ways as scouters. It's a sign it's time to get out of grey- or yellow- tab work and back to working exclusively with boys in the field.

 

Beavah

 

[BadenP]

bnelon

 

I have to say your highly sanctimonius and highly innaccurate post was so absurd it was laughable,it also lacked any real credibility. Look most scout leaders are not always trying to find ways to circumvent BSA rules, but trying to find ways to deliver a quality program to their youth. Most scout leaders are honest honorable people, and those that are not exsist in every aspect of our society and usually spoil things for the greater number. So get off your high horse already because you sound like a broken record.

[John-in-KC]

Can someone do an IP compare to confirm bnelon is not Bob White?

 

This is a franchised youth serving educational supplement, not One of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

[Eagle92]

Someone mentioned a Scout that has earned rank and it was never registered at the council office.

 

True story that happened to one of my Scouts. Didn't realize that he was still a First Class Class until after his EBOR and council rejected it b/c he never earned Star or Life.

 

Luckily we had copies of the adavncement reports.