The Blancmange Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 The archery MB thread brings up an interesting question. In general, what level of proficiency should a scout demonstrate in order to earn a MB? Clearly he shouldn't need to be an Olympic qualifier, nor is merely sitting through a classroom session enough. I don't know enough about archery to know whether these new scores being discussed are too onerous. To me, it seems that the requirements should allow an average scout, who puts forth reasonable effort, to earn the badge in a reasonable amount of time. I don't think either the published requirements or a counselor's discretion should require what I'll call an expert level of proficiency. Swimming comes to mind as a good example to illustrate this. For an inexperienced or non swimmer, the requirements are by no means "easy." In fact many scouts struggle with them. But absent a physical or mental impairment, a scout, who really wants to earn it and who works diligently over the course of a week at camp, maybe with even with some extra instruction, should be able to earn it. Are there any other badges where the actual requirements or interpretations commonly held by counselors that make the badge particularly difficult to earn? I realize that a much more common problem is counselors, particularly at camp, who set the bar to low, but I'm just curious if the opposite is ever true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 With regard to archery, I have had a couple of bad experiences at camp in which two left-handed boys became totally demoralized by their lack of ability. So I stopped by to see if there was something I could help with. The solution was easy. Let them use a left-handed bow. The slouch running the range had no idea 1> that such a thing existed and 2> that it would make a difference. I was not pleased with the level of 'proficiency' displayed by that counselor. OGE, notice I did not use the 'B' word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beavah Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 To me, it seems that the requirements should allow an average scout, who puts forth reasonable effort, to earn the badge in a reasonable amount of time. I don't think either the published requirements or a counselor's discretion should require what I'll call an expert level of proficiency. Nah, we're never talkin' "expert" for a MB. I'd just say "competent", eh? Or to use da BSA language, "proficient" at the basics. To earn swimming MB, yeh have to be a competent swimmer, or proficient in all the basics of swimming. Another way to think about it might be good enough that they can be trusted to do it on their own, eh? If a lad earns Cooking MB, he should be good enough to be trusted to plan and cook a variety of different healthy meals on his own. Not be a Top Chef, nor be "did it once with help and forgot it." A boy who earns Canoeing MB should be able to canoe on his own or with a buddy, handlin' everything himself. Not be an Olympic paddler, nor have only unswamped a canoe once with an adult in ideal conditions. Generally speakin', I think if a lad starts at camp for the very first time, he should not be able to finish a badge at camp. A brand new, never-in-the-water boy is not goin' to be able to earn Swimming MB in a week. Same for most of the other badges, with da exception of a few low-hangin' "throw-away" badges like Fingerprinting. Beavah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bnelon44 Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 The competency expected is that you do what the requirement says. Nothing more, nothing less to satisfy the requirement. If you can do more, that is icing on the cake but doesn't count for advancement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortridge Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 Generally speakin', I think if a lad starts at camp for the very first time, he should not be able to finish a badge at camp. A brand new, never-in-the-water boy is not goin' to be able to earn Swimming MB in a week. Same for most of the other badges, with da exception of a few low-hangin' "throw-away" badges like Fingerprinting. I wish more Scouters understood this, and took the task of MB screening and pre-coaching seriously. I have never been as frustrated as I was while teaching Pioneering at summer camp and having to start from scratch with brand-new Scouts who'd only learned to tie the square knot that morning, while also trying to get experienced knot-tyers working on their lashings and projects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oak Tree Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Most merit badges do not have a clear proficiency test the way Archery does. I think I'd respect them a bit more if they did. Athletics had a standard for a long time but they recently got rid of that. Hiking, Cycling, Backpacking, Camping all require a substantial effort, but pretty much anyone can do them. My experience at summer camp is that everyone passes Rifle Shooting, some have trouble with Shotgun Shooting, and everyone has trouble with Archery. Snow Sports and (Ice) Skating are two that can't be done by just anyone with some minimal practice. Probably Water Sports too. Lifesaving is more serious, but usually only the good swimmers even attempt it. I've never had another merit badge be a big issue where a counselor was holding a higher standard than the Scout could meet. I've seen it with Swimming. I've seen badges where the counselor had a much more extensive idea of what "discuss" meant than the Scout did, but that mostly involved the counselor talking the Scout to death about what it means to be an American. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beavah Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 The competency expected is that you do what the requirement says. Nothing more, nothing less to satisfy the requirement. Yah, that reminds me of da fellows who come drifting over a town in a balloon. Having gotten themselves a bit turned around, they shout down to a fellow below, "Excuse me, sir! Can you tell us where we are." "Yes, of course I can! You're in a balloon!" The balloonist turns to his buddy and says, "That fellow must be a council scouter. His answer is perfectly accurate and totally useless." What The Blancmange and others are talkin' about is interpretation of the requirements, eh? So when First Aid MB says "prepare a first aid kit for your home" (and display and discuss its contents), does that mean the lad can put a couple of bandaids in a zip lock with an alcohol wipe? When later on the requirement says "Explain what action you should take for someone who shows signals (side note: signals??) of shock" does that mean the lad can just say "I'd raise his legs"? Or does it mean that the lad has to know enough to recognize what type of shock and respond appropriately? After all, raising the legs of someone in neurogenic shock from a brain injury might worsen the problem. When it says "show the steps that need to be taken for someone suffering a severe cut on the leg" does that mean he's expected to demonstrate exposing the artery and properly placing a vascular clamp? Yeh can go on and on with this stuff, for almost any badge. The requirements offer an outline or guide to components that make up basic proficiency in a skill, eh? But they really aren't an actual standard of performance, eh? That's left to the MB counselor. Beavah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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