How fast/slow should scouts advance through the ranks?

[Horizon]

If your Troop is providing a good program, than a fully committed boy has every right to earn ranks as fast as the BSA allows.

 

Our typical schedule for February cross-overs.

 

First meeting - Patrol Leader checks the Scouts physical abilities for Tenderfoot tracking. Talks to the boys about starting to work on physical fitness, and the need to improve.

 

First month - Scout skills, focused on the upcoming Camporee at end of March. My Patrols try to get together every weekend leading up to camporee to practice the necessary skills of knots, fire starting, first aid knowledge, lashings, etc. At Camporee, the new Scouts demonstrate their skills to their Patrol Leader during the competition (if not before). Suddenly, I can see a lot of signatures in their handbook.

 

I have the police come by every Spring for a meeting to talk about various subjects depending on what is happening in the Handbook. The latest is the cyber bullying and cyber safety - my younger Scouts will sit through that. My older ones will be in another meeting to hear about sexting, alcohol and drug laws, and other appropriate topics for high schoolers.

 

We encourage all new Scouts to earn First Aid Merit Badge when they join the Troop, introducing them to one of our 4 physicians and one nurse who are all registered counselors.

 

We have a large Troop service project for Memorial Day.

 

We then hit Summer Camp. I will admit that all of our local Council camps are merit badge locations. We discourage Scouts from classroom badges, and instead encourage them to take outdoors badges. Swimming & Pioneering are the first two, with other sign ups based on desire. The youngs ones LOVE Wilderness Survival as well.

 

From bridging to the end of Summer Camp an engaged Scout in my Troop will typically have 5-6 Merit Badges earned. They will have had one car campout, one backpacking trip, Camporee, Summer Camp and several service opportunities. Tenderfoot before Summer Camp is pretty regular, and Second Class by the end of Summer Camp / Summer is common. That leaves them the rest of the year to finish up learning and demonstrating the skills for First Class.

 

After that, it is Merit Badges, Leadership, and passing on the skills to the next generation.

 

So this is what a fully-engaged Scout can do if they choose in my Troop thanks to great support from my Committee and ASMs, and the full buy-in from my PLC. My current SPL wants every Patrol to earn National Honor Patrol, so he is calling Patrol Leaders weekly to follow-up on their Patrol based activities so that they can earn the distinction.

[LanceEagle]

Thanks to all. Lots of great answers and it's clear that there is technically no right or wrong answer here when it comes to advancement. I asked this question though because our SM has made it quite clear that he prefers for the scouts to advance at a slow pace. Additionally, I know that in at least one instance he has intentionally held back a 14-15 year old (not sure of his exact age) Life scout candidate by not granting the SM conference because he felt the boy was too young. This is of great concern to me since I very much would like to see my son, who just crossed over from Webelos in February, achieve Eagle not later than sophomore year, so that he may be able to focus fully on school. I'm planning to talk with the SM and potentially the Committee to see about allowing for ongoing fulfilment of rank requirements and merit badge work over the course of the year, not just during summer camp and camping trips as is typically done in our troop. As a leader, I would naturally plan to make these opportunities available to all boys in the troop, not just my son.

[moosetracker]

Lance,

 

Number 1) This should be you son's goal not yours.

Number 2) Merit badges can continue through out the year, but don't expect it to be the duty of the troop to provide them.. Your district has merit badge counsilor lists.. Your son should be able to go ask the advancement coordinator of the troop for the Names of counsilors that do what ever MB he wants to take on.. The name should come with the town the councilor is from and the phone number... The BOY should make the contact by phone, and set up times to meet..

 

While my son was not of driving age, he may hand the phone to me to get the directions on how to get to where ever we met up.. And I had to be around so when times were worked out, I could say if it met my schedule or not.. But for the most part, it is the boys job to find the MB counsilor, contact the MB counsilor, and set up the appointment..

 

Word of warning the MB list may or may not be up-to-date, depending on the ability of the volunteer in the district who is taking care of it, he may have to call 3 or 4 places to get someone who is still a MB counsilor..

 

If you SON wishes to advance fast pace, he must have the ambition to, the troop should not spoon feed him in being fast paced. The troop has other things to focus on and is there for all the boys, other boys do not want to concentrate on advancement.

[bacchus]

"Number 1) This should be you son's goal not yours."

 

No offense intended, Moose.

 

Whenever somebody mentions their young son's intentions on advancement, this statement is immediately made. The statement sounds neutral enough, but its true translation is, "your son doesn't want to advance, and you should just leave him alone to play scouts."

 

I have noticed this is only an issue when a scout is perceived as being "too young" for advancement. When the scout is being pushed by his mother at 17 to finish up his Life requirements so he can start working on Eagle nobody seems to care that it's his mother's goal and willpower pushing him on.

 

I say if the youth does the requirements let him have his BOR.

[moosetracker]

No.. at least not my meaning.. A little kick in the butt is a good thing now and then. Parents / Scoutmaster / Advancment coordinator whatever.. At the beginning of the road, or at the end of the road..

 

Advice from a parent that meeting a early goal would be a good idea because of A, B, C.. Ok.. If the son, sees the wisdom in it and WANTS to do it.. Great.. But, if the boy doesn't want it, then when he starts getting into his rebellious years, and he is rebelling against anything the parents are pushing on him that he doesn't want.. Then Scouting will be on the list.

 

I am not against nudging.. But.. Parents in this mode early and the boy not being in the same mode, will tend to DO FOR.. "Let me help you with that report", "Let me finish this project for you." etc.. Can you then say the scout met the requirements?

 

By the time the boy is pushing 17 - you may nudge, nag, and push, the scout is going to do it his own way regardless.. By then he will also tell the parent "Hands off".

 

Also a new cross-over parent talking to the troop to tell them to alter their program to be focused on Advancement, because of your goal to see your boy fast track. Will be simply taken as advice from a parent who has not learned the ropes yet..

 

 

[Eagle92]

bac,

I actually got a different interpretation; let the scout decide what he wants to do when he wants to do it.

 

 

[Beavah]

Yah, LanceEagle, listen to da moose!

 

If yeh go the way you're suggesting as a new parent, yeh can count on any experienced scouter or parent in your unit to roll their eyes and quietly under their breath mutter "not another one of these snowplow parents who has to plow the road for their kid in order to fulfill their own dreams as parents.". Yeh aren't likely to get anywhere with that.

 

Sounds like your son chose a good troop with some good people in it who care about kids. Now yeh need to step back and support the lad from the sidelines, not be one of da parents who is out on da field telling the coach and the refs what to do.

 

And as an aside, if your lad focuses only on schoolwork from sophomore year on, you'll pretty much guarantee that he won't get either da admissions decisions or scholarships he wants. Colleges and employers are looking for a lot more than just schoolwork

 

Beavah

[Eagle92]

Something I forgot, you are crossing over form Cub Scouts. there is a VERY BIG DIFFERENCE ( caps for emphasis) between CS program format and BS program format.

 

 

CS has adults in charge and there is now an emphasis on advancement being completed at every meeting, unles you did FastTrax and then it's been around for a while. The adult den leaders had Program Helps, FastTrax Guide, and now the resource guide that tells you everything you need to know, do, and plan for a meeting. And of course everythgin is focused on advancement. Even the goal of getting X badge by May has been aroudn for a long time.

 

 

BS is completely different. Youth run the patrols and troop. Youth ar ethe ones that need to plan, organize, prepare for and lead meeting and events. meetings are focused on KSAs for the upcoming trips, not necessarily advancement. And while a good troop will give the scout the opportunity to advance to First Class within 12-18 months due to the activities planned and not necessarily due to the FCFY program, Once they master the basic Scout skills, they then need to apply them via being a leader and workign with the younger scouts, learn advance Scout skills via Eagle required MBs, and learn skills that interest them via the elective MBs. Star onwards is definately all about what the scout want to do.

 

 

My caveat, DO NOT PUSH THE SCOUT! (emph.) I've seen scouts who get Eagle and get out, not realizing the fun they can have b/c of being pushed so hard. I've aslo seen scouts who cause nothing but trouble and rebel b/c they are being forced to be in scouts. Kinda ruins it for the rest of us.

[LIBob]

Twocubdad wrote:

"We're in the process of examining the whole First Year/First Class theory in our troop. The push to First Class breeds a lot of problems, not the least of which is lack of time to adequately master T-2-1 skills. In the past we've always had a mad scramble for everyone to serve as patrol cook for the First Class cooking requirement. The way it worked meant that when you met the requirement was likely the only time you served as patrol cook. Our challenge to the boys now is for it to be the BEST time you served as patrol cook. So we're going at a little more slowly. Maybe we emphasize First Class/First 18-to-24 months.

 

The other negative effect of First Year/First Class is setting the expectation to blow through Boy Scout ranks like Webelos activity pins. Scout, Tenderfoot, Second Class and First Class in one year, but you want me to do Star, Life and Eagle over SIX YEARS?? There's a disconnect. . . .

 

A 12- or 13-year-old Eagle has not had the time for that sort of growth.

 

That's a very interesting post please keep us informed as to how it works out. The reason I say that is, as a boy my family moved a lot. EVEERY one of the three troops I belonged to raced the kids (myself included) to 1st class in year one and then slowed down, focused on giving the 1st class scouts leadership experience, and let them procceed at their own pace.

 

As you correctly point out there are good and bad aspects to that ideology, nonetheless I have never experienced a troop that did things any other way, so it would be interesting to read your your thoughts as your troop transforms from one philosphy to another.

[LIBob]

I keep thinking about the "1st year 1st class" thing and here are my recent thoughts:

 

Waaay back when I was a scout I moved twice and thus was in three different troops.

 

Each of the troops put a pretty heavy emphasis on teaching first aid and knot tying to new scouts.

 

That being the case, if the scout was a decent swimmer to begin with, the only thing that made "first class in first year" more difficult than falling off a log was the camp cooking requirements.

 

That being the case I am not sure 1st class in a year is such a bad thing. The only disadvantages I recall are

- it meant we had a lot of lousy camp meals and

- because nobody ever cooked more than a few times none of us really developed good solid camp cooking skills.

 

Of course all three were small troops maybe something (related to 1st class in first year) that prevented the troops from growing. Still if the kid is a swimmer and teh troop is doing its job, cooking is the only part of 1st class that requires effort.(This message has been edited by LIBob)(This message has been edited by LIBob)

[dg98adams]

I have read several posts that are similar to the way the Troop I serve monitor a Scouts progress.

 

About the only time an ASM will talk to a Pl or TG about a Scouts advancement that 1st year (or 2nd) is if he is either not coming on outings where opportunities to have the outdoor activities happen, or to see if he is just not bringing his book to Patrol meetings and getting stuff recorded on Troop Master.

 

The PLC/TG and Leaders get a monthly PDF printed report on Rank/MB advancement.

 

Usually it's more of the latter, as Scouts can easily pickup up most T-2-F advancement opportunities on our monthly outings.

 

Sometimes a Scouts other activities make those outings "catch-can", but they seem to always manage if they want to.

 

Advancement is not something we have to push, but we try to make the 1st year Scouts know about opportunities.