Eagle Project Nightmare

[scoutldr]

"My littlest guy in the troop is eleven and I watched him take his book to meeting after meeting trying to get rank sign-offs for a camping trip. Everyone was too busy to sign off at camp, and yes he tried to get them there. So when they came back, he carried that book to every meeting, only to be told over and over, "I don't remember you doing that.""

 

I will say what all the others have said...This is ABSURD and should NOT be happening. Your SM husband should stand tall before the Comittee and COR and DEMAND that this nonsense stop IMMEDIATELY...and be prepared to submit his resignation that same night. What in the H--L are these people (I wont' call them "Scouters") thinking???

[Eagle92]

Has anyone attended training and if they have can you send them to back sicne they obviously don't understand various aspects of scouting like advancement.

 

MOM,

Is it possible to transfer to the other troop you mentioned? It may be worth the drive. I know a minor regret for me was quitting Sea Scouts b/c my ship had problems and I didn't think the other nearest ship, 40-45 minutes away, would be any different. BOY I WISH I WOULD HAVE JOINED THAT SHIP! That ship had active advancement program, did youth led activities, and was not a babysitting service for the yacht club. This was evidenced by the number of Quartermasters coming out of the ship and the Nation Bosun that came form that ship. Fortunately I found the challenge with the OA.

 

[momof7scouts]

IT'S APPROVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The DAC reviewed his project with him today and said it was the most detailed project he had ever seen, a master's thesis! (He also said our troop is obviously broken and SM dad needs to fix it or move to another troop.) Son two is elated. He feels his work has been vindicated and he is excited to be able to move on. He is also more than a little irritated because he found out the proposal he submitted on a previous project should also have been approved. He would have had that one finished by now. Oh, well.

 

So Son two will move on and I guess SM dad has his work cut out. There are a whole bunch of other issues to deal with besides this one.

[NeilLup]

Congratulations to you and your son, MomofScouts,

 

I can understand his frustration. I can only suggest that he be reminded of the statement from JFK "Life is unfair."

 

The odds are that your husband should move to another Troop. At a certain point, one's effort is better spend places where the resistance is less severe.

[Eagle92]

CONGRATULATIONS TO YOUR SON!!!!! Now may he bust Butt and get everything over and done with for his Eagle so he can move on to a Venturing Crew and get away from this troop

 

Seriously SM dad may want to have a hat with the CC and COR about what's going on. Maybe have the UC involved as well to see how you cna change the unit. If it can't or won't happen, then I say move on to a unit that works properly or wants someone to help them get on the right path.

[Nike]

Well, it's about time. Here's to your son and his project.

 

[John-in-KC]

It'd be very nice if the DAC has one of those "heart to heart" conversations with your COR and CC...

 

Gist of message: This "Eagle Adviser" is an obstacle, not an enabler.

 

Congratulations to your son. Please let us know how the process progresses

[momof7scouts]

SM dad and I went to a committee meeting tonight and this issue was one of the topics. ALL of the people in this troop came in after this policy was in place and none was aware that this whole thing was neither a district or council policy. There is one boy who has had his project plan rejected 15 times, one who finished project but is sure his after action part will be disapproved after what he went through for initial approval (he finished project 18 months ago) and 11 life scouts that have been that rank for more than two years, many of whom, after having heard what others went through, don't feel Eagle is an option for them. The few projects that have gone through are literally sometimes about 50 pages long, some are revamps of the few previous projects that have made it through before! How's that for encouraging innovation.

Additionally, at district level there is one Eagle committee person (don't know official position name but he sits on Eagle BOR) and if it is not a construction project, he will not approve it. He tried to disapprove a "collection" project at the BOR. Took the boy over a year to get it to that point and his was one of the 50 page write ups.

SM dad is livid and said troop either changes or they can find new SM. Don't know what he can do about the one district guy though.

I am really grateful for all the help I got through this forum. Son two did not know what to do and SM dad was unsure how to proceed. We were fortunate that we had been in another troop and district so knew this was not necessary but just did not know how to proceed. So thank you all from the bottom of my heart.

Son two got the final signature at 10 am yesterday and by 6 pm was at a cub pack meeting presenting the project to get them involved!

[evmori]

Excellent! And kudos to your husband for making a stand!

[Eagle92]

MOM,

He is probably the a member of the district advancement committee. Once the eagle project is approved and executed, it is a done deal and the EBOR cannot deny the project. Again it does NOT matter what the district/council representative wants the project to be, it is what the Eagle candidate gets approved and executed that matters. If the Eagle candidate gets denied due to the service project, then follwo the appeals process. it pobably won't get that far IF the Eagle Candidate is well versed in official policy, and mentiosn the policy at the EBOr. Again I had a DAC try to deny me my Eagle over the service project and I had to remind him what the polisy is. I did not have to go throught the appeals process.

 

In reference to teh other life Scouts, someone othetr than the "Eagle Adviser" needs to have a sit down chat with them. as their situation is ridiculous. Since SM is NOT the father to these Life Scouts, he should have a chat with them along with the CC.

[NeilLup]

Hello Momof7Scouts,

 

From what you have just written about the other Scouts in your Troop, I would suggest that you or the SM meet with the District Commissioner, District Training Chairman, District Advancement Chairman or all of the above. Outline the problem and the backlog of Scouts who are non-advancing because of this problem. Suggest and ask that the District put together an ad-hoc SWAT team to come in and help this unit, do some quick training, mentor the Troop leaders as they meet with each of these Life Scouts and quickly get them back on the Eagle trail. (Perhaps your Unit Commissioner could do this but from what you have reported, I am assuming that you do not have an effective Unit Commissioner.) It should take only a couple of meetings but could make a big difference. Mention about the report of the rejection of non-construction projects. It sounds as if in this District, there are a couple of little kingdoms that need to be rooted out.

 

I would also note the Units of Supplemental Training on Scoutmaster's Conference and Board of Review on the BSA national web site.

 

http://scouting.org/BoyScouts/TrainingModules.aspx

[momof7scouts]

SM dad is already working on all of this, biggest concern is life scouts. He, the CC, and the advancement chair are meeting with the DAC to write up "official" new troop Eagle process. He is in the process of contacting the floundering scouts that have started the process and aren't progressing. He is going to insist that any scout that has been sent back a third time, goes to him not the EA, if they decide to even keep them. First task, fix the system. Second task, get the boys in the process moving. Third, get those not even started motivated. Again, the current crop of leaders had this thrust on them from the time they came into the troop. They did not know it was not BSA rules. All are very interested in fixing it. Neither of the EAs were at the meeting so I am not sure how they are going to feel about it, and to be honest, I don't care.

 

On another note, Son two is really moving on this. He has two big motivations, one positive, one vindictive. He wants to get as many of the filled backpacks to the shelter as possible before Christmas. He also wants to get entire project completed before January since the EA said there was NO WAY to even get it approved by then.

 

He has also had help pouring in almost faster than he can respond. He works in the office at the school he attends and the administrators love him. When they found out his project was approved, they announced it to the school, had him present his project at morning assembly, are handing out his shopping list to all students, and they had been collecting things for him without telling him! He already has some backpacks and three large rubbermaid containers filled and it was just approved Saturday!

[John-in-KC]

EagleSon's ELSP was out of the box, and most assuredly not bricks and mortar.

 

SM called ahead to the DAC, to make sure the concept would pass muster against Requirements #33215 and ACP&P #33088. DAC actually welcomed the project, he had been wanting to educate his people that Eagle projects are not just about construction.

 

As it happened, it was very cold, and had been snowy, the night in 2005 when he went to RT for approval session. The DAC had his other guys sitting around my son, listening to the conversation.

 

Sometimes, you can take 2 birds with one stone

 

For Eagle92: Recommend you re-read ACP&P: There are provisions to reject ELSP project execution as part of an EBOR. Of course, then we start talking the appeal cycle...

[shortridge]

momof7scouts: That's fantastic that your son's project is under way, and moving rapidly. This is a season when many more people than usual are going to need help. He's got his hands full, but it sounds like things are well under control. Kudos and congratulations to him.

 

Be sure to suggest to him - if it's not part of his project already - not to forget to contact local newspapers, radio stations and TV stations to drum up awareness and interest. That could help spur even more offers of assistance.

[momof7scouts]

Ya'll are going to love this. SM dad has presented an authoritative e-mail to some of the people fighting for the 60 page dissertations. He has quotes from BSA, council, and even some from all of you! Trying to get it through to them that it is not just HIM that says this is over the top.