adjourning a SM conf without signing

[NJCubScouter]

I have to mostly agree with BobWhite's post of 9:44:57. Highcountry, it seems to me that your biggest issue is not who advances to what and when. Your biggest issue is that your troop seems to need an armed NATO peacekeeping force to restore order. Or, failing that, it needs the SM and troop committee to take action to protect the boys who belong in the troop from those who don't.

 

The next time I am at a troop or committee meeting and become frustrated at some crazy situation or irritating person in our troop, I will think back to this thread and thank the Great Master of all Scouts that we do not have any boys whose weekly schedule includes a visit with a parole officer. Thanks for that, anyway.

[Stosh]

4 pages of objectivity on a subjective topic. Gotta love it.

 

1) There's a ton of untrained leaders out there doing a somewhat passable job with the program. Tradition goes a long way of passing on (rightly or wrongly) some of the basics.

 

2) Every leader that wishes to take it up a knotch gets the basic training, and can operate for a time with quite a bit more quality in their program.

 

3) Add on Roundtables, University of Scouting and WoodBadge, and things begin to change and mature in the units over time.

 

4) Sit and read every bit of BSA literature, study it so that every iota of law can be fully critiqued? Nope, not in my lifetime. I understand the program, but when all is said and done, the BSA does allow and often times encourages the leadership to actually do what's best for their unit!

 

If I were to actually adhere to the letter of the law, 1) I would not have my Venturing Crew, nor would it have continued successfully now for 10 years (it is amazing how many "laws" had to be re-written by national to make room for such crews), 2) the council would not be going out of their way to invite me to lead jamboree contingents (post-2000 WB leaders only), nor 3) address University of Scouting and various roundtables to teach my version of "boy-led, patrol-method" because of the success of such an approach.

 

If one has the gist of things and remains within the confinement of reasonable, mature and legal, they shouldn't have too many problems. If they do, they have the administration of BSA to help guide them.

 

If I'm facing a particular problem, and I approach a group of people for help and all they give me are legal quotes where I have not followed the rules and have erred along the way, then I'm going to find another group to ask, and I'll keep asking groups until I get the help that is needed. I have found that most people do have a pretty good idea of WHY they are in a sticky situation and don't need anyone telling them that, they have already crossed that bridge, what they need now is HOW to get out of it.

 

So, when all is said and done... yes, if in my opinion, I think it's in the best interest of the boy not to sign his SM conf requirement, I'll do just that with a complete explanation as to why. On the other hand, I do so many SM conferences with the boy prior to his advancement, he's usually got a pretty good idea where he stands and 99% of all SM conferences are merely a formality where I can be the first to congratulate the boy on his accomplishments before the obligatory signature and the advancement BOR.

 

Stosh

[Bob White]

Well jblake if nothing else you have established that humility is not your bigest problem.

 

You need to be very careful when you try to use your personal credentials to prove your knowledge of the scouting program. For one thing yopu have ten years of experience the BSA has nearly 100. 2) You promised to use their program and not visa versa. 3) While I understand how happy you are with the jamboree trip, the speaking opportunities etc, (I am am happy for you as well) there are a lot of scouters out there who have done far more for far longer by simply following the program than you have trying to change it and you don't see them using their personal credentials to try and impress folks, they just use the scouting program.

 

Something to consider. If you think you are right due to your credentials, then that must mean that anyone with more credentials than you knows even more than you do right?

 

It's better to make the BSA the authority on the BSA program, don't you think? That way you don't need to try and prove more than others just that you know the BSA program has all the credentials they need to deliver a strong Scouting program.(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Beavah]

Beavah the rule you refer to relates only to the active membership requirement and not to the leadership requirement so it is not relevant to the topic of the thread.

 

Yah, well, sorry about dat. Someone had gotten talking about "active." Here yeh go then about POR, from da Patrol Leader's Handbook:

 

What is expected of me?

While you are a patrol leader, your troop and patrol are going to count on you to live up to some clear expectations. They will look to you to:

 

* Represent the patrol at all patrol leaders' council meetings and the annual program planning conference.

 

* Keep patrol members informed of decisions made by the patrol leaders' council.

 

* Play a key role in planning, leading, and evaluating patrol meetings and activities.

 

* Help the patrol prepare to participate in all troop activities.

 

* Learn about the abilities of other patrol members and fully involve them in patrol and troop activities by assigning them specific tasks and responsibilities.

 

* Attend troop junior leader training and continue to work on advancement.

 

* Encourage patrol members to complete their own advancement requirements.

 

* Set a good example by having a positive attitude, wearing the Scout uniform, showing patrol spirit, and expecting the best from yourself and others.

 

* Devote the time necessary to be an effective leader.

 

* Work with others to help make the troop go.

 

* Live by the Scout Oath and Law.

 

* Solicit ideas and concerns from patrol members so they have input to the planning and operations of the patrol.

 

Beavah

 

[Bob White]

Seems pretty clear when you use the official resources of the BSA doesn't it?

 

 

Now to balance that, what are the responsibilities of the Scoutmaster in helping the Patrol Leader fulfill his duties?

 

[evmori]

Now to balance that, what are the responsibilities of the Scoutmaster in helping the Patrol Leader fulfill his duties?M/EM>

 

Off topic! That question has nothing to do with the initial post in this thread! Could we please stay on topic!

 

 

[highcountry]

evmori, I know my post was long and full of typos so sometimes they get a bit hard to follow. I mentioned "Scout A" was removed from the unit, in fact it was almost a year ago.

 

When I took over the previous SM made an agreement Scout A had 6 months to keep his nose clean which he did. He also however missed many troop meetings and activities so his opportunities to "Mis-behave" were somewhat limited. This was also the same time period I was trying to "right the Ship" and get the CC out of the troop that was such a problem. After teh 6month time period was up he made a few more meetings and activities but kept his "mis-behavings" low key. I got reports afterwards (sometimes weeks delayed) that he would look and talk intimidating to the young scouts, things like that. It wasa Spring campout where he got so bad rough housing (He tried to disguise his bullying as rough fun) that my one son put him down with no uncertainty. I was not on that campout but heard about it afterwards. He then was inactive for 2 months but came to summer camp and was pretty good there. It was a September camporee where he peed on the tent and he ws immediately suspended for the October campout and given the final warning. He was allowed back to a one nighter campout in November where he was clearly warned he was on strict probation. Despite that he peed in the kids water bottle and when I found out ablut it I informed other adfults in the troop and he was informed he was out of the troop for good, we also let teh UC and DE know.

 

That is how it went down and the reason things got delayed. Had I been SM when he pulled the knife(And probably long before that) I would have cut him off then and not made any deals with Grandma. Unfortunetalt I wasn't in that capacity and I was not part of the deal that happened.

 

Hope this clears up the what and why about a pretty serious situation happened and was handled.