Den Chief for Star, Life & Eagle?

[fgoodwin]

I agree an SM and SPL might want to counsel a young man who wishes to hold the same POR for Star, Life and Eagle.

 

But as Bob said, there is no requirement that the POR for each rank be different -- making it so would be a disallowed addition to the requirements.

[Bob White]

Actually it is not up to the Scout and Scoutmaster to work out. It is up to the advancement regulations of the BSA, which do not require that the scout hold different positions, only that he meet the requirements.

 

 

[acco40]

If a Scoutmaster, who is in charge of the advancement program within the troop, does not want a Scout to use Den Chief for a particular POR for any reason they have a simple way to stay within the bounds of the program and keep their desires met. Don't approve said Scout for the position. Just like Scribe, QM, Librarian and Historian, those position are not elected but appointed and the Scoutmaster has a hand in those appointments.

 

I agree, don't approve a Scout for a position and then later state that "it doesn't count."

[Bob White]

If you follow the BSA program then the only appointment to a POR by a senior patrol leader that requires the consent of the Scoutmaster is the role of juinor assistant Scoutmaster and no other. That is if your intent is to follow the program.

 

 

 

[NJCubScouter]

Bob, what is your source for stating that the SPL appoints the JASM? This training presentation from the BSA site (http://olc.scouting.org/resources/TLT.ppt Slide 30) says that the JASM is appointed by the Scoutmaster (which makes sense.) On the other hand, while I have seen the statement that the SPL appoints other youth leaders with the consent of the SM, the same presentation (Slide 18) says that the SPL makes the appointment with the ''advice and counsel'' of the SM, which is not the same thing.

[Bob White]

The Scoutmaster Handbook, and The Senior Patrol Leader Handbook.

 

Each says that the Senior Patrol Leader selects all troop positions of responsibility unless otherwise indicated. The ONLY positions that are otherwise indicated is the Assistant Senior Patrol Leader which says that the SPL appoints then with "the approval of the scoutmaster", and the junior assistant Scoutmaster position of which the handbooks say that the SPL selects the individual with the "advice and consent" of the scoutmaster.

 

It makes no such conditions for the Den Chief or ANY OTHER position of responsibility.

 

 

[NJCubScouter]

Hmmm. It's kind of curious that the BSA web site says the SM appoints the JASM but the handbooks say the SPL makes the appointment (even with the consent of the SM.) They ought to fix that.

[CubsRgr8]

Slightly off-topic, but still in the ballpark, does each POR need to be done after achieving a rank? For example, scout serves as den chief for 12 months and then earns Star. Does he need to serve in another POR to earn Life? Also, our Bugler is Tenderfoot (and boy, is he good!), does this count towards Star, or does he have to serve in a POR after achieving 1st Class?(This message has been edited by CubsRgr8)

[NeilLup]

Hello Cubs,

 

The POR is required during the period of time that the Scout holds the rank, which begins with passing the Board of Review. So, for example, for Star Scout, the POR must be held after passing the 1st Class BOR.

 

There is a common misconception, though. The POR (and tenure) do not need to be completed immediately prior to the BOR for the new rank. This commonly comes up for Eagle Scout when someone makes Life Scout, completes his 6 months tenure and 6 months, etc. and then is lured away by the siren song of cars, girls, etc. If and when he returns, he does not need to complete those requirements again; they have been completed. He does, of course, have to display Scout Spirit.

[mikecummings157]

As many others have pointed out, the Den Chief is a very important position and good ones are hard to find.

 

Bottom line; the Scoutmaster can't add additional requirements to this if the book allows it.(This message has been edited by mikecummings157)

[evmori]

I think the confusion with a JASM is he is actually an ASM!

 

The junior assistant Scoutmaster serves in the capacity of an assistant Scoutmaster except where legal age and maturity are required. He must be at least 16 years old and not yet 18. He is appointed by the Scoutmaster because of his leadership ability.

 

In the Troop organization chart, he is above the SPL & equal to other ASM's.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10