Last minute eagles

[allangr1024]

Thanks for the responses, everyone. I took over SM job after an absentee SM stepped down. Since then I have taken steps to bring the PLC back into a decision making role. That is difficult when the current leaders have never had to actually lead.

 

We did have a venture crew, started by a former ASM. He had to move for his job shortly after I took over here. I know one of my 17 1/2 year old eagles were with him, and came back to us to finish his requirements.

 

My big concern is this: Can I require such a boy to attend our meetings (at least half of them), and go on at least one campout per quarter, to fulfill the scout spirit req. We are signing their eagle application, and declaring they are part of our troop, when they are not really participating in the life of the troop. Our past adult leaders were not concerned, but I want the younger scouts to know that the benefits of scouting come through our troop.

 

On the other hand, they were active in the past, did the requirements for POR and service hours, and are now back to finish Eagle before they turn 18.

 

 

 

[Ohio_Scouter]

I know it's a tough call, alleng1024. Since this scout was previously active in the troop and completed all the requirements for POR and service hours, if it were me, I would be inclined to let him ride and not levy any additional requirements. As soon as possible thereafter, however, I would enhance my program so that younger scouts wouldn't leave the troop prematurely.

 

[FScouter]

"Can I require such a boy to attend our meetings (at least half of them), and go on at least one campout per quarter, to fulfill the scout spirit req."

 

It would be useful to read the pages of the Boy Scout Handbook that talk about Scout spirit: 47, 108, 164, 170.

[OldGreyEagle]

this is how the Scouting Handbook defines Scouting/Scout Spirit in the various ranks:

Tenderfoot, Scout Spirit  Defined p 47

Scout Spirit refers to the effort you make to live up to the ideals of Scouting. The Oath, Law, Motto, and Slogan serve as everyday guidelines for a good life.

 

 

Tenderfoot, Requirement  #13 p60

discuss scout spirit with your scoutmaster and with older boy scouts in your troop. Ask them for examples of how you can demonstrate Scout Spirit . You will likely hear examples of the Scout Oath and Law as ways to show your Scout spirit

 

Second Class Requirement #9  p108

Most requirements for Scout ranks can be measured by other people. When you set out to swim 50 feet for the Second Class swimming requirement, anyone can see that you have covered the distance. How well you live the Scout Oath and Scout Law in your life, though is something for you to judge. You know when you are being kind, when you are helpful and a good friend. You know when you are trustworthy. and reverent. You alone know how you act when no one is around to witness what you do. Do the best you can to live each day by the Scout Oath and Law. You might look back on some of the decisions you've made and wish you had acted differently, but you can learn from those moments and promise yourself you will do better in the future. And dont be surprised that when you use the scout oath and law for guidance, others will recognize those values in you and respect you for it. Set high standards for yourself and strive to reach them. No one can ask anymore of you

 

First class  Requirement #10 p164

At troop and patrol gatherings you've recited the Scout Oath and the Scout Law dozens of times. The words come easily to you, but do you know what those words mean? The Scout Oath and Scout Law are not just for reciting at meetings. They are not just to be obeyed while you are wearing a uniform. The spirit of Scouting that they represent is every bit as important when you are at home, at school and in your community. The Scout Oath begins with the words, "On my honor. . ." Your honor is your word. By giving your word, you are promising to be of good character and to keep your reputation untarnished. Be trustworthy in all you say and do. Extend friendship to others. Be thrifty with your time and resources. Be tolerant of others, regardless of their differences, and celebrate the great diversity that enriches our nation and the world. Express reverence in accordance with your beliefs. Offer a helping hand because you want to, not because you expect a reward. The standards set by the Scout Oath and Scout Law are very high Strive to reach them every day, and you will find that they become as natural for you to live by as they are for you to say.

 

Star/Life/Eagle p170

BY NOW, DOING GOOD TURNS should be a regular part of your life You are always on the lookout for ways to help others.

By now, Be Prepared should describe your efforts to make the most of educational opportunities, get along with others, and take part in outdoor adventures. By now, the Scout Oath and the twelve points of the Scout law should be the guidelines by which you direct your actions in your family, community, church, school, and nation.  Living by these high standards is always a personal choice and something only you can fully measure. But by now, many other people should be seeing qualities in you that make it clear you are choosing 

 

"Your standing as a Scout does not depend so much on the skills of your hands or the badges an your merit badge  sash, as an the spirit in your heart on what you are willing to do for others, on whether you are doing your very best to live the Scout Oath and Law:'

Read that last paragraph. Ask the scout how he is following the above

[Beavah]

Yah allangr, sometimes yeh just have to go with da flow, eh?

 

If yeh accepted a lad as a member who is a refugee from a defunct crew, I think yeh just help him achieve his personal goals. Your scouts can understand being compassionate to someone whose unit folded on him. In the future, if yeh don't want to do that, don't accept the application. Or at least have the conversation about expectations before you set the expectation.

 

A good rule is that the expectations should never change on a lad between when he gets Life and when he gets Eagle. So if you're new to the SM role, I think yeh finish up the "old" lads and then set your expectations for Star and Life in a way that will change the way Eagle is looked at down the road.

 

And for heavens sake, in the future don't keep inactive boys on your charter! If yeh want a good excuse, your council uses that in count of youth served, which is presented to donors. Claimin' more kids than are actually participatin' is fraud.

 

Beavah

 

[Stosh]

If the boy was active in the Crew it counts towards his Eagle requirement. A boy less than 18 years of age that joins after FC can still earn his Eagle while a member of a Crew he doesn't even have to be part of a troop. If the Crew goes defunct, it is no reflection on the boy and should not be penalized for it. If the Crew fails and the boy joins a Troop to finish his Eagle, no problem, he just continues on. If the troop adds to the requirement, the boy should then find a troop that adheres to the requirements of the BSA.

 

If a young man was finishing up his Eagle, and his dad was transferred to another state and the boy had to find a new troop to finish we wouldn't even be having this discussion. The process is no different if the boy had to transfer between a Crew/Troop in the same town or two troops hundreds of miles away.

 

Stosh

[gilski]

My son finished his Eagle Project and has one last requirement in Citizenship in the community which he has dragged his feet on. He rarely attends troop meetings now that he full field his POR for 6 months.

 

His time is spent working at his job, church band practice on Tuesday evenings (scout night), playing in the worship services at church twice a week. He is trusted and counted on by adult leaders in the above venues.

 

Has he shown Scout spirit? Is he worthy of Eagle?

[Stosh]

It is always difficult to be honest when it comes to subjective decisions/opinions especially when it involves one's own son. From looking just at the wording of the post, here's my take on it:

 

"My son finished his Eagle Project and has one last requirement in Citizenship in the community which he has dragged his feet on. He rarely attends troop meetings now that he full field his POR for 6 months."

 

It sounds as if he has "moved on" from Scouting and his interest and heart are no longer in the program. From the pattern described here, one will see a last minute rush to finish up his requirements so he can get an Eagle Award. It will be basically a dodge so he won't need to feel regrets about getting close and not finishing later on. This push will most likely come from the parents, not the boy.

 

"His time is spent working at his job, church band practice on Tuesday evenings (scout night), playing in the worship services at church twice a week. He is trusted and counted on by adult leaders in the above venues."

 

It sounds like other things in life have taken a higher priority than scouting.

 

"Has he shown Scout spirit? Is he worthy of Eagle?"

 

If one has to ask the question, I'm sure they have doubts about the answer. If a parent needs to ask this kind of question, they need to be directing it at and discussing it with their son, not the SM, CC or a forum.

 

Just my opinion for what it's worth.

 

Stosh

 

[OzarksOsage]

From what I've seen, the boys who get the most out of scouting are those who reach Eagle around 14 or 15. Earning the rank at that age opens the doors to other opportunities like working on summer camp staff, leadership beyond the troop, and so on. Those who become inactive for a few years then come back to squeak the deadline are most often the guys who are looking for something substantial to put on a scholarship application or are looking forward to building their resume. I would hope that boys would earn Eagle early enough so they can enjoy the privaleges while still scouts. It's a shame that many never sew the badge on their uniforms because their last official activity as a scout is their Eagle court of honor.

 

OzarksOsage

[Venividi]

OzarksOssage,

 

I find it interesting how things differ in various regions around the county. In our area, a scout does not have to have earned Eagle to work at summer camp, and it isnt a factor leadership beyond the troop. Sounds like scouting is highly effective in your area.

 

venividi

[scoutmaster52]

Ive always wrestled with the thought: Is Scout Spirit something a boy only shows at Scouts or is it something they show day in and day out? For example have had a "twilight" Eagle who at 17 started to drift away towards the Fire Dept and Rescue Squad. EMS training was on Scout meeting night. Does this boy show Scout Spirit in his daily life? Yes is my answer.