Eagle Board of Review Question

[Trevorum]

Depending on context, the question could well be both rude and/or coercive. A much better approach to the topic would be along the lines of, "Have you considered how you will vote this November?"

 

In general however, I feel that politics is not an appropriate topic for a BoR. While the topic is closely interlinked to civic duty and patriotism (which are great topics for any BoR), with politics there's too much room for subtle power issues by the adults in the room. This is very close to how I feel about the religion vs. reverence issue we discussed in a recent thread. It's fine for an adult to ask a fellow how he shows reverence, but the direct question, "Do you believe in God" should be avoided because it has too much room for unanticipated misunderstanding.

[evmori]

Why ask, Gern? Why not?

 

It seems we are too worried about invading someones private space! Yeah who you are going to vote for is a personal matter. So if your religious beliefs. So are many other things. Just because these are personal, does that mean they are off limits? I don't think so.

 

If the Scout answers "it has no bearing......." to the who question, he's gonna probably answer the same way to the other renditions of the question. And if I was sitting on his EBOR, I would request the Scout to "Please tell the members of this board why you feel this way".

 

The question "Who would you vote for?" is not rude or invasive or coercive.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[GernBlansten]

Why not ask what the scouts favorite color is too. Both questions have no bearing on the decision of the board nor his fitness to be an eagle scout.

Are irrelevent questions appropriate ora waste of the scouts and the boards time.

 

[evmori]

Ahh! The favorite color ruse!

 

Think citizenship Gern!

 

From Citizenship in the Nation (emphasis mine)

 

7. Name the three branches of our federal government and explain to your counselor their functions. Explain how citizens are involved in each branch. For each branch of government, explain the importance of the system of checks and balances.

 

Voting is one of the most important ways we are involved. Whether it is voting for people running for office or referendums on ballots, it is our right as Americans to be involved in this!

 

BTW,, my favorite color is Kelly green!

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

 

 

[RangerT]

I have to agree with Gern here, "Who are you going to vote for?" versus "Do you understand the importance of voting in being a good citizen?" are very different, one invades personal guaranteed rights while the other addresses being a good citizen. Sorry ED but you are way off base here. Which of these questions is the most appropriate and which has no place in an Eagle COH, I think any rational person can see that for themselves, it is fairly obvious.

[evmori]

Well, RangerT, you might feel I am way off base. I don't.

 

Asking a Scout who is up for the highest award the BSA has for a youth member a direct question should be expected. We are to help prepare boys to make moral & ethical decisions. Glossing over tough topics doesn't do that. And asking anyone "Who would you vote for?" invades nothing.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[Trevorum]

Picture this scenario:

 

Your boss calls you in for a conference. He has lots of experience and is very knowledgable and is sorta intimidating to you. You're up for a raise and really want to impress him. He looks at your file soberly, and asks you some questions. You handle these questions easily. But then, he asks you who you'll be voting for in the election! You don't see what this has to do with your raise, but you know you must give him an answer because he's your boss. You have no idea what his politics are and you certainly don't want to offend him if he is prickly about these things. You don't know for sure that he'll deny your raise if you like a candidate whom he can't stand, but you really don't want to take the chance. What do you say? Dang! Why did he have to ask you a question about politics!

 

OK, now substitute "Scoutmaster" for "boss" and "Eagle" for "raise".

 

 

 

[RangerT]

Trev, I like your scenario. Ed you are way off base on this one and that question has about as much revelence as asking the scout if he is a virgin, both of these questions are none of your or anyone elses business and are totally inappropriate at any BOR. ED it would be like asking you if you ever cheated on your wife. I really hope you don't sit on any BOR's Ed because your sense of appropriateness and common sense is sorely lacking.

[evmori]

Not even close Trev! In my job, my politics has nothing to do with my job. Bad example!

 

Why do people have a problem with this?

 

I have sat on a lot of EBOR's RangerT & this question along with a lot of other direct questions were asked and I have yet to see a Scout or parent be offended.

 

So who are you going to vote for?

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[GernBlansten]

ed, a scout's politics has nothing to do with being an Eagle scout.

[Bob White]

Because the Eagle rank has nothing to do with politics either!

 

Scouting is about citizenship and you can ask him why he feels voting is or isn't important, but you are out of line when you ask him to tell you who he will be voting for.

 

Just because a board member is rude and nosey does not mean they can ask whatever they want to of the scout.

 

Having you vote for is none of your employer's business, and who the scout plans to vote for is none of the board's business either.

 

 

[dScouter15]

Ed -

 

What reason do you have to ask the scout who he will vote for? You say that the question is "directly related to [...] citizenship," but what aspect of the scout's citizenship are you looking to evaluate? How can this question be used to evaluate a scout's citizenship better than other questions, involving the HOW or WHY aspects of voting?

[vol_scouter]

I agree with everyone else. It is not appropriate to ask who the youth would/will vote for in the fall. It is OK to ask who are the candidates, what are some of their platforms (have to allow a lot of latitude because it is not clear at this time by listening to the news), how will you decide on who to vote for, and what do you think are the most important issues. Those questions allow a BoR member to assess if the youth is thinking of people and issues that relate to citizenship in the nation. I would hope that an older youth at an Eagle BoR would tell you in a firm voice "It is none of your business" because it is not! Before this election is over there could very well be a large amount of animosity between the 2 sides. It is not appropriate to ask anyone who is under you who they will vote for.

[evmori]

Looks like we will have to agree to disagree!

 

Asking direct questions is not rude or nosy or coercive. We don't need to make everything soft & fuzzy because in the real world it isn't.

 

We are not asking the Scout what party affiliation he would chose. That's asking about his politics. We can vote for whomever we chose in the general election regardless of our party affiliation! Asking a Scout who he would vote for is asking him who he thinks should be elected. And the conversation should continue bu asking the Scout to explain why. Nothing out of line.

 

Yes Scouting is about citizenship. The right to vote is part of our citizenship we as Americans are entrusted with and not enough of use exercise this right.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[packsaddle]

Folks, I think we've all made our points. Normally, if I was having this discussion in person with Ed, I'd try to figure out the detailed logic that he's using to support his view. But in this forum I think it is unlikely that any of us can communicate in that level of detail even if we want to.

It should be clear by now what Ed's view is and that those of us who disagree..well, disagree. But I'm getting the impression that Ed is feeling like Katie at the bridge, and set to resist no matter what.

 

Trevorum made a compelling example. The idea has been put out there for consideration. I think we're beating a dead herring at this time.

 

I think I'll spend the rest of the evening listening to the coyotes eating my neighbors' outside pets.(This message has been edited by packsaddle)