Wait Time Between Lower Ranks

[evmori]

It is possible for a Scout to complete all the requirements for T to 1st at the same time. And the Scout might be the one who wants a BOR for all three at once. As far as I know, there is nothing that states all three BOR's can't be on the same date.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[Gunny2862]

Bob White said, "While it is possible for this situation to happen it really shouldn't. A unit with a PLANNED program can see that the scout completes the recognistions in order even though he is able to complete work in any of the three lower ranks."

 

I'm not sure what you mean by this? Are you saying that even if he completes the work out of sequence he's not awarded the rank except in order, if so, I agree.

 

If not,

At the possibility of being accused of having an unplanned program - oh well.

 

The boy drives the accomplishments he chooses to complete all of the way through the 1st three ranks - not us.

 

(Note:For the discussion below when I say "Tenderfoot SM conference" I mean the one we think of as the "job well done for this rank/goal setting conference for the next" conference that is usually done just before the appropriate BoR. It does not preclude other SM conferences to see whats going on.)

 

While not awarded this way - it is entirely possible for a boy to finish the requirements in what we would think of in reverse order (1st class requirements, 2nd class requirements and Tenderfoot)- with the possible exception of the SM conferences for 1st and 2nd when he hasn't had a Tenderfoot SM conference yet - also I'm not doing a first class or second class SM conference for a Scout who hasn't had a SM conference for Tenderfoot. I'll probably have a conference just to see what he's thinking.

But around here my "problem" is that they won't take advantage of opportunities to do requirements from 1st class while a tenderfoot or second class even if we aren't doing an activity that would make it easy for them to advance in that requirement for six months to a year from now. Oh, rats, I DO have a planned program.

 

But if they (almost - no SM conference)complete in reverse(or any other) order they are still going to be awarded and recognized in order - but I don't have any problem recognizing and awarding all three ranks on the same night if put in this situation.

Now for us normally, we could have several weeks to do separate BORs probably with SM conferences either in between or doing a marathon SM conference too- but put in the CoH is next week bind I would either have one long grueling BOR or three separate ones addressing each change and in the case of the three separate ones avoid the "What did you learn during this period of time?" question either after the first one or until the third one.

 

For me it's an issue of the rules say they can do it that way and nothing says we should slow down advancement for those ranks.

 

On the issue of courtesy to the Board members, what is the difference between seeing the same boy three time for three advancements or seeing three boys for one advancement each? If they know they'll be doing x number of boards then what does it matter if they are seeing the same boy three times or not?

And while I agree that advancing three ranks at(almost)once is not ideal - the program is set up to allow it.

[mlg0171]

When we have a boy complete two ranks at once (or even three) I don't think the BOR is much longer than a normal one, if at all. We're not re-testing the material. We're having a conversation to find out more about him, what he enjoys about the program, what he'd change, what meaningful experiences he's had so far, whether the SM helped him set goals for the future, whether he's aware of how the whole system works...

 

None of that changes in a BOR for two ranks. I can't imagine how the scout would benefit from doing that three times in one night or one month.

[Gunny2862]

In the interest of truth, full disclosure and to show I do have a tenuous grip on reality.

 

As a Scouter who has less than a year of career scouting, even though I'm our SM, I'm not going to be able to prescribe how our other Adult members/ Committee Members - mostly Eagles with 25-40, some with 50+ career years of Scouting experience and former SM's or ASM's do business unless the BSA rules clearly prescribe in detail the minutiae of any given event. Especially a BoR. And if the boy sets himself up for three in a row - well then he'll advise the next one to do it T-2-1 rather than T21.

 

And so, they do check the performance and quality of the program by testing a boys knowledge during a BoR - but that portion is not to to pass/fail the Scout but rather to evaluate ME and my delivery of the program. Which I think IS part of the BoR, but I could be wrong.

[Beavah]

None of that changes in a BOR for two ranks. I can't imagine how the scout would benefit from doing that three times in one night or one month.

 

Yah, but I can't help thinkin' that a lad that gets one short BOR for T-2-1 has been somehow shortchanged compared to a lad who completes the ranks progressively and gets 3 times the adult contact, the experience "interviewing" with adult strangers, etc.

[mlg0171]

Yeah, Beavah, but it's the exception, not the rule, so I don't think it's a big deal. The alternative (two or three BOR's close together) just seems like jumping through hoops to satisfy our sense of order.

 

Interesting, though, your use of the term "stranger". I realize you are exaggerating, but our committee members aren't strangers. It's common to see some of them on campouts and at meetings. Maybe we're lucky to have that level of involvement.

[John-in-KC]

Gunny,

 

Each Scout is an individual, and brings different perspectives to a BOR. I'll be honest, though... when I've done 3 BORs in an evening, I have to have a break between the 2d and the last. Done right and well, I invest in the kid, and that's mental work.

 

When a Scout asks for 3 boards in a night, he's getting the same questions over and over again. He doesn't get different adults perspectives, he doesn't have to listen to another adult expresses himself... and responds to his/her question.

 

My thoughts Hope all is well down in your part of the State

[Gunny2862]

Thanks John,

so far we've avoided any weather related impacts.

 

Being a smaller troop we tend to only have a few boys ready for a BoR at any given time, then we try to drag in every available person who can sit a BoR in order to spread out the exposure to any given interviewer for any given boy. And will rotate the boy among two or three BoR boards if he advances more than one rank at a time - this is most likely to occur, for us, at camp or after a non-Philmont HA trip. While this does give him some repeated questions, most of our older Scouters are cognizant of what's going on and quite frankly ask what I consider to be some oddball questions anyway - "But, Scoutmaster I was just trying to make the boy think."

A plus to this is that they do tend advance together, a negative is that a boy will not usually get an independently scheduled BoR to fit his schedule, at least for the T-2-1 ranks.

I agree multiple BoR's can be grueling for us, i can only imagine it must be exhausting for any Scout who puts himself in that boat. I've not yet seen three ranks at once but two is pretty common.

 

 

[kittle]

I haven't read all of the replies but want to add my opinion anyway. My son has one requirement left and he will be first class. This requirement happens to be a Tenderfoot requirement. If he is held back even farther by the committee because they do not want to do all ranks the same night, I will tell them a thing or two that they do not want to hear. In my opinion there is no reason to hold the boy back after he has already done the requirements. Obviously he has been active or he wouldn't have them done.

[achgindamen]

IMHO there is nothing wrong with a single BOR for T-2-1 if the youth finished a Tenderfoot requirement last. We tell the boys that they can work on all of the T-2-1 requirements in any order (or at least we should!), why should we not expect some of them to do things backwards?

 

I also recently read that the BOR should be made available when a youth is ready and requests it. (I think it was on http://www.scouting.org/boyscouts/resources/mbc/rank.html but the URL is currently giving an error)

 

This implies that having scheduled BOR's may violate the guidelines (and will certainly delay a youth's BOR)