SM refuses EBOR

[Lisabob]

I think it might help to take a hard look at whether your discomfort with a certain BOR member stems from your own personal dislike, or whether they really aren't qualified. In the first case you have to set this aside ("it's for the boys" right?). In the second, if the BoR is chaired by a qualified person then let them know your concerns. They should be able to enlighten the entire BOR as to their responsibilities. Important though it is to do it right, it isn't rocket science.

 

As for the question about the neighbor - I don't necessarily see something wrong with that. We've had non-Scouting adults on EBORs before (teachers, clergy, community members, etc), often with excellent results. They frequently bring insights to the process that we, who are so wrapped up in Scouting, might miss. They can also add a "real world" atmosphere to the discussion, by which I mean that the scout realizes that Eagle is not something that is recognized only within the scouting world, but has lifelong implications in many other venues.

 

Again, I would hope that the EBOR chair would take a few moments at the beginning of the EBOR (before the candidate arrives) to make sure that this neighbor, or any other non-Scouting adult, knows what the process is, what's reasonable, and what the boundaries are. They should of course be told to keep things confidential. Better yet, the chair could contact these people prior to the day of the BOR to make sure they're clear on expectations, and then the chair could follow up with a brief reminder to all BOR members at the start of the BOR.

 

So it sounds to me like a friendly chat with the chair of this BOR would resolve several of your problems.

[Hunt]

I'm still not sure I understand the question here. I think maybe usetobeafox wants to tell the EBOR something negative about this scout outside his presence, and is concerned that it won't remain confidential because a member of the board is too friendly with the candidate. If that's the case, it seems to me that it would be better for the SM to tell the scout that he doesn't support his Eagle candidacy.

But it's not clear that this is the situation.

[Gunny2862]

I hate to ask you yet another question, or in this case series of them but it seems that there are several possible issues here and I don't know/can't tell which one/one's you want to deal with.

 

Is it that you don't want to appear before the board and still not prejudice the board(about the Scout) either way?

 

Is it that you don't want a specific or several specific individuals to sit on a board because you see possible impropriety with them on the board? Or that they are not knowledgeable of what they should be doing on a board?

 

Or is it that you don't fell like you can make comments to a board without having them kept confidential?

[Beavah]

Yah, foxy, like others I'm still confused, eh?

 

I think talkin' to your DAC is probably the way to go.

 

Personally, I don't have any problem with an EBOR asking a few questions of a SM. In fact, it's sorta nice to bring a SM in first, tho' I don't do it myself. I've at least found it particularly helpful to know about a special needs boy, so that the board could adapt its questioning style a bit. Bringin' a SM in first would be one way to do that.

 

In terms of specifics...

 

If yeh don't think a boy should be Eagle, you don't sign the application. Givin' the board dirt under the table isn't fair. If yeh sign the application, you're there to support the boy, period.

 

As SM you don't have any official say in who sits on a board. Two district members, a COR, and a CO member who is a neighbor of the boy is a perfectly reasonable EBOR on the face of it. If you've got issues with a particular board member that are serious (because he's a jerk and won't be fair to the boy), then yeh speak up in advance.

 

Lots of CO/CORs "don't have a clue what's going on." They trust the CC and SM quite a bit, eh? If there's somethin' they need to be clued in about, yeh need to make an appointment with 'em and sit down and have a chat. That should have nothing to do with a boy's rank progression, eh? Not the boy's fault if there's adult communication issues, and not da CO's job to be involved in that level of program detail.

 

Readin' back through your old posts, it seems that you've been more or less in continual conflict with your TC and CO. That can really damage a troop, eh? I think yeh should leave the boys out of that, and then either make a choice to keep pluggin' with a long term view or pull the ripcord and go find a better place to contribute. Maybe yeh want to start a thread and just share all your issues with your CO/committee?

 

Beavah

 

[nldscout]

Before I speculate, I would like to know clearly what the issue is here. Hard to give clear advice without understanding what is wrong.

[EagleInKY]

Scoutldr -

 

"It's the district's responsibility to put together the board."

 

Maybe in your council. In my council, the unit CC schedules the boards, then asks for a District rep to be present. The district advancement chair has a pool of people to call, and he sees who's available for that night.

 

------------

 

You are correct, I should have stated, "In our council, it's the district's responsibility". In any case, I do not believe it the SM's responsibility.

 

[GernBlansten]

nldscout, Ancient Chinese philosopher once said, "Before seeking enlightenment to a quandary, one must Get A Life" ;-)

[acco40]

1) A Scoutmaster may refuse to "do anything." He is a volunteer after all. So yes, a Scoutmaster may refuse to participate on an EBOR depending on who sit on that board.

 

2) By signing an Eagle application, a Scoutmaster is implying that he feels the Scout in question is deserving of the Eagle rank.

 

3) If one is a Scoutmaster and only a Scoutmaster (i.e. not a committee member) an Eagle BOR is the only BOR he may participate in as a member of the Board. However, he may only do this for units that he does not serve as Scoutmaster (i.e. if I'm a Scoutmaster for Troop X, I can serve on the BOR for a Scout from Troop Y. Unlike any other BOR, for an EBOR, one does not have to be a committee member to serve on the board).

[donert]

Can an Assistant Scoutmaster sit on an EBOR?

[John-in-KC]

http://www.scouting.org/boyscouts/resources/mbc/rank.html

 

Boldface simply means a direct quote:

 

"Unit leaders, assistant unit leaders, relatives, and guardians may not serve as members of a Scout's board of review."

 

The quote above is a highlighted textbox in direct context of the Eagle BOR on the webpage. I suspect others can find similar quotes in Advancement Committee Policies and Procedures, BSA #33088.

 

Simple question, simple answer.

[frank10]

" Can an Assistant Scoutmaster sit on an EBOR? "

 

From your other post above I'll take this as attend rather than sit...

 

In which case - (IMHO) a SM may ask his Assistant to fill in to any thing that the SM wants.

 

[John-in-KC]

To go to wingnut's post...

 

If I were sitting your Eagle Candidate's board, and I knew the Scoutmaster was evading the board, I'd be asking some very tough questions of the Scout.

 

IMO, sending an ASM in your place to an EBOR, when you are available, is damnation by faint praise to the Scout.

 

If I were the COR, and sitting the Board, my question would be "Why am I chartering this man as Scoutmaster, if he is unwilling to sponsor a Scout to his EBOR?"

 

You certified the Scout on his Eagle Application. Have the courage of your convictions to stand with the Scout at his EBOR.

[donert]

I am going to speak to the Advancement Committee Chair to let him know I feel that their are concerns about confidentially with some people on the EBOR. These concerns may not be true but what that has been said to me in the last outside conversation before the last EBOR I did makes me suspicious.

[LongHaul]

If the concern is that there are people on the BOR that do not understand the BSA program and are therefore unable to evaluate the Scout in that light, then the DAC needs to be informed.

as to confidentiality "Never say something behind a man's back you wouldn't say to his face."

LongHaul(This message has been edited by LongHaul)

[Beavah]

I feel that their are concerns about confidentially with some people on the EBOR

 

Yah, Foxy, I'm still confused, friend.

 

Ain't nuthin' confidential about an Eagle Board of Review. It's a public thing. It ends with a public award, or a letter directin' a scout what steps he has left to finish up. The committee members are supposed to report back to the whole committee and the CO about the content and outcome of the EBOR, which helps the committee help the program. Some of the committee members are from the broader community. It's not really a spot for confidential conversation with a boy.

 

Every now and again an EBOR ends up talkin' a bit about some personal stuff with a boy which people should be courteous about, eh? Yah, and of course the recommendation letters are confidential. But that's about it, eh? It ain't a grand jury .

 

Maybe if yeh let me know in a PM what yer thinkin' needs to be kept confidential I can be more helpful.

 

Beavah