"Stalled on the Trail"

[mtm25653]

GernBlansten said:

"Yeah, every one of our "death bed" Eagle scouts weren't dedicated to the program. They were when they were 14, but lost it along the way. I'm coming to the conclusion that if you ain't Eagle by 16, you've lost the spark. "

 

I have 2 of those "death bed" Eagles, and potentially a third, and I take issue with your statement.

 

My oldest son was least interested in scouts, but he went on every campout except in the fall when he had a conflict with football. Due to summer academic programs, he missed going to summer camp with his troop for 3 years, but he went on his own provisional. He worked at cub day camp when he was 17, and was SPL his senior year. In the fall, I asked him why he didn't want to finish his Eagle, and he said he didn't want to earn it just to look good on college applications. In January (with a May birthday), after he completed college applications, he finished his last couple merit badges and project (a worship space with benches and a campfire in the woods at our church) and turned in his paperwork a few days before his 18th birthday.

 

My middle son turned his Eagle paperwork in a week and a half before his birthday, a couple of days before he left on a 2-week troop trip hiking 200 miles on the Appalachian Trail. Two summers before he went to Philmont. In 7th, 8th and 9th grades, he was Den chief to 2 dens of Webelos. In 10th, he was ASPL. His junior year, he was SPL and planned the district Webelos Woods campout, and he said to me he couldn't do his project at the same time. Senior year he took 5 AP courses and was captain of the basketball team and chair of the student council. These took up more time than he thought, so he didn't get to his project and last couple of merit badges till spring of his senior year.

 

My youngest is a 16 yo Life Scout. This summer he's working at Scout camp and going to Philmont. Last year he hiked the AT for 2 weeks, and the year before he went to Northern Tier. He goes on every camping trip. He works on cook crew for OA events. Last year he was ASPL and SPL; this year he is working with the SPL and PLC to develop their leadership (at the SM's request). He had planned to earn his Eagle while he was 16, but this past year decided to try to graduate high school a year early, so he may not finish his project in the next 8 months, while taking an extra math and English class, working at camp and playing basketball. So he may be 17 or even 17 1/2, a death-bed Eagle to you. But he, like his 2 brothers, has been active throughout his scout career.

 

I know a couple of boys who lost interest then made a push to finish their Eagle, but I also know several others who were like my boys, active and involved in scouts and other events, and earned their Eagle at 17+. They are mature and confident young men who well deserve to be Eagles.

 

Our troop is active and has a program that is still challenging to older boys. Don't give up on them, let them show leadership, understand that they have responsibilities outside of scouts (school/work/church/sports), and most/many of them will turn into Eagles you can be proud of.

 

[mtm25653]

duplicate posting removed(This message has been edited by mtm25653)

[GernBlansten]

MTM,

From your description of your boys, it sounds like with the amount of scouting they do and yet they still barely make it under the wire to Eagle, they are over committed. Plenty of opportunity to advance, they just can't fit it into their busy schedules until they reach the hard-stop.

 

In my unit I see eager, enthusiastic boys pushing themselves to advance until they are about 14. It trails off after that and after 16, it is all but gone. The few that make it to Eagle after 16 make it because of some threat of retribution from the parents.

[mtm25653]

I don't think it's that my boys are/were overcommitted, just that advancement to Eagle isn't their only goal. Remember Advancement is only one of the methods of scouting. They have put more energy/time into the methods of Outdoor Programs, Personal Growth, and Leadership Development and they live the Ideals of scouting in their everyday lives.

 

Why do you consider the lessons they have learned from those less important than earning advancement to Eagle by a certain age?

 

[Gunny2862]

Not enough experience to say anything truly meaningful, but the cent and a half I have for this one is...

The Eagles I have seen fall into two groups, those who appreciate that they did it themselves and were happy they didn't have to rely on external motivation to get there; and those who at first resented the "push" and later over time were gratified by the thought that there were others who cared enough about them to ensure that they didn't miss out on this capstone experience of Scouting.

Is one more likely to STAY involved than the other, yes, does the other "Eagle out" not to be seen for a number of years? It seems so to me at this point.

I really hope that my Parental experience will be with the first type, but I know that from my first career some folks needed a little push to get an accomplishment/experience they deserved and as an ASM I plan on being a kludge and doing a little gentle guiding.

[NeilLup]

Hello John,

 

Not sure if what I will recommend here will work, but I think it is what I would try.

 

Sit down with the Scout and with a calendar. Point out what the requirements are and by when he needs to do them. Then tell him that what happens next is up to him. Say that he wants you to bug him and remind him, you will be happy to do so and together, you will set the times for it. If he doesn't want you to, then you will not mention it again until and unless he brings it up.

 

But point out to him that it is HIS Eagle. If he gets it, it is his. If he doesn't get it, it is his Eagle that he didn't get.

 

And it is. It's not yours, it's not the Troops, it's not his parents'

 

And advancement is only one of 8 methods of Scouting and the Eagle is only a part of advancement.

[John-in-KC]

Neill,

 

I went to the young mans' home last night; sat down briefly with him and his Dad.

 

What you describe is almost word for word what I told him. I left what I told him in letters to both him and his father.

 

A minor complication is Dad is politically powerful locally. Dad can make non-Scouting lives miserable for the Scouters if he so chooses. Even so, Dad understands the concept of fair warning.

 

It's like Beavah said: If the young man is content with who he is, and doesn't need the label Eagle to be part of him, very cool. That's his choice

 

We'll see what happens.

[NeilLup]

Sounds good, John,

 

You said that his Dad understands the concept of fair warning. Does his dad understand (and accept) the concept of "It's HIS Eagle, not yours."

 

It may be beneficial, if possible, to privately tell the Dad the stories of kids who have refused to finish their Eagle just because their parents were pushing so hard or, worse, of the ones (I have heard of two) who were presented the Eagle, handed to their parents (Mom, normally) said "This is yours, not mine. You're the one that wanted it and you're the one that did all the work." And walked off stage and out of Scouting.