Looking for Piloting/ Charting/ Navigation Resources

[Eamonn 61]

I'm not doing a very good job of teaching the Ship members the joys of navigation, charting and piloting.

The sea Scout manual is OK, as is some of the material on the Sea Scout web site.

While the Scouts who seem to be academically well off, seem to just get it! The younger and not so clever Scouts are just not getting it.

I tried using Chapman's, but I'm still not doing a very good job.

I try really hard to make what we do as much fun as possible!

I think part of the problem is that the Scouts are intimidated by it.

Any ideas? Books? Web sites?

Would be much appreciated

Thanks.

Eamonn.

[Beavah 205]

Chapman's! Egad. Have yeh tried the American Sailing Association stuff? http://www.asa.com. I hear it's pretty good, very focused. USSailing might have some stuff, too.

 

It's tough to remember that kids don't have a lot of experience with maps and visualizing spaces, and it takes a fair bit of time for them to grow that understanding from scratch. Adults who come to charting come with more of the basics built in. Takes a fair bit of on-water time for kids to make the connections.

 

B

 

 

 

[emb021 16]

Get with the US Power Squadrons! We have a National Agreement with them, and you can get their courses either free or at low cost. I know in my area that several of the leading Sea Scout leaders are also involved with USPS. They are a great resource!

 

Also check out the US Coast Guard Auxilary. While they aren't allowed to charter Sea Scout Ships (unlike the USPS), they are also a good resource.

[CNYScouter 46]

The Ship hasnt gotten anyone near this requirement yet.

Currently we are getting ready to attend the regatta in Maryland on Memorial Day.

I dont know how many are going yet but at least a couple of us will there.

 

I think the Ship has this on the schedule for the fall.

 

Our Mate told us that one of her friends teaches this for the Power Squadron.

We are planning on using them or trying to get someone else from the local Power Squadron.

 

I am planning on taking The Squadron Boating Course which does cover the basics of piloting if it is ever offered close by again.

 

They also offer a Chart Smart course that covers a good deal of what you are looking for.

Again trying to find a local USPS who is teaching this is often difficult.

 

Get with the US Power Squadrons! We have a National Agreement with them, and you can get their courses either free or at low cost.

 

What is the National Agreement?

I had a long talk with one of their trainers (who was also an ex-Scouter and ex-DE) at the local Boat Show last month.

He didn't seem to have any idea about an agreement (or he at least didn't mention one).

I was also told I had to pay whatever everyone else does and they couldn't give the Ship any price break on classes.

 

emb021-I think its great you have support like this.

 

The local USPS president said to me that they support what the Sea Scouts do but don't count on getting any help fom them as she had enough trouble getting trainers to the few courses they scheduled much less getting people willing to help us.

 

[Eamonn 61]

Talking with other Skippers, it seems that the USPS and Sea Scouts seem to do well when someone from the Sea Scouts is involved in the USPS. I have contacted or tried to contact all the local Squads to no end, I wrote to the big Kahuna (Can't remember her title.) again with no result.

I met with the local USCG -Aux (who can if they want be CO's) In our area (Pittsburgh) the focus is on power boating on the rivers. - We have a few!!

The Skipper of SSS 46 (Sea Scout Ship Arcturus,Westover, West Virginia) serves on the National Sea Scout Committee and is very involved in the USPS and has in the past been able to help us out. But he is busy working on the new Sea Scout Manual.

Thanks Beavah, the American Sailing Association has a DVD course that I'll send away for.

Of course in these days of GPS and new high tech. Who knows in time it will become a lost art.

That would make life easier for me, but Sarah one of our Scouts would be heart broken. She just loves all this sort of thing.

This is turning out to be expensive! I just found Hand Bearing Compasses on sale! There goes another $60.00. The ASA course and DVD is another $65.00 and I haven't left the house!!

No wonder I'm poor!!

Ea.

 

 

[Beavah 205]

This is turning out to be expensive! I just found Hand Bearing Compasses on sale! There goes another $60.00. The ASA course and DVD is another $65.00 and I haven't left the house!!

 

Yah, like all hobbies boatin' can be addictive. Yeh know, you can upgrade that hand bearing compass to a set of binoculars with a built-in bearing compass for just a bit more dough....

 

You know, it's all for da kids....

 

B.

 

(seriously, though, you can get by with a Silva hiking/orienteering compass with a sighting mirror, if yeh want to save a few bucks. Just makes you think for a sec to avoid a 180 degree confusion.)

[Eamonn 61]

Truth is it was on sale 50% off!

So I ordered two!!

Eamonn.

[emb021 16]

Eamonn-

 

This is why you need to get in contact with Sea Scout leaders at the council, area, regional, and national levels. I just help out at council level with sea scouting and I know about a lot of this stuff, because I get on the lists, listen, etc. This is also why its important to get the Sea Scout Officer Specialized training by someone qualified to do so AND go to Sea Badge.

 

Get on the National Sea Scouting Mailing list. Go to seascout.org, the official national sea scout website.

 

Go here for info on all the Sea Scout.org mailing lists: listserv.seascout.org/archives/index.html

 

As to the Sea Scout & USPS agreement, there is an article on the main page of seascouts.org about the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) signed by the two groups.

 

[Eamonn 61]

I have send my application in for Sea Badge. With the $50.00 deposit.The course is in October.

Sadly the Sea Scout Officer Specialized training is not of a practical course.

I like the improvements that have been made to Sea Scout.org mailing lists, Bruce and his team are doing a fine job.

If you get a chance you can read what is being said about the USPS. I can't help feeling that the letter is for the most part window dressing.

Our big problem as well as being new is that there just isn't any other Ship's around.

We do belong to the Chesapeake Sea Scout Flotilla, the Skipper's and other adults are really knowledgeable and very giving sadly it's a 4 hour each way drive to do activities with them.

At this time we have sail boats, which we trailer. If we could find a Marina that wasn't too expensive, we might look into power boats.

Of course over time my hope is that we will find what works and what doesn't as well as hopefully finding ways of making things more interesting for the Scouts.

I know part of the big problem is me!! I really dislike "Class Room" Scouting. While the skills they will learn will be put to use in a practical setting, I don't think there is much alternative but to have them sit down and learn these skills without having classes.

The Scouts who like math and algebra enjoy this. We have one Sea Scout who hopes to work for NASA! Doing stuff like this is pure joy. But we also have Scouts who can't tell time. They can look at their cell phone and know it 10:45 but they don't know when it will be 11:00! This makes Time and distance a real challenge!

 

Ea.

[emb021 16]

"Sadly the Sea Scout Officer Specialized training is not of a practical course."

 

It's not meant to be. It's meant to educate people on the Sea Scout program. Period. You need to (and are expected to) take advantage of practical seamanship courses from groups like USPS, USGCA, etc. Why should Sea Scouts re-invent the wheel when its better to take advantage of what exists out there?

 

There is a reason the Skipper's Key and Scouter's Training Award for Sea Scouters requires that you complete a basic boating safety course from groups like the above.

 

And this is why you need to have SSOST be given by a Sea Scout leader who knows the program. This way you can be provided information such as this vs. getting some yahoo that just reads the course syllabus.

 

[Eamonn 61]

The Americas Boating Course offered by the USPS and the US Coast Guard Aux. Is a fine basic boating course.

It just doesn't go into what is needed to meet Sea Scout requirements.

I don't know about anyone else? But I found the Sea Scout Officer Specialized training title to be very misleading -Other than changing the names of the Officers it's just the same as the Venturing course!

For the first time I'm starting to get a feel for what a new Scoutmaster with no Scouting background must feel!!

I really don't need any more courses in Leadership or how we play this game, serving on the Area Committee, being a Member of the Council at Large and with my past experiences I think I know and understand how things are set up.

What I need is to find out the best way to pass this skill on to the Scouts in the Ship I serve.

Be cause of our location this isn't as easy as maybe it might be if we were someplace else. Kinda like training for high altitudes when you live in Holland.

Eamonn.

[Eamonn 61]

The Americas Boating Course offered by the USPS and the US Coast Guard Aux. Is a fine basic boating course.

It just doesn't go into what is needed to meet Sea Scout requirements.

I don't know about anyone else? But I found the Sea Scout Officer Specialized training title to be very misleading -Other than changing the names of the Officers it's just the same as the Venturing course!

For the first time I'm starting to get a feel for what a new Scoutmaster with no Scouting background must feel!!

I really don't need any more courses in Leadership or how we play this game, serving on the Area Committee, being a Member of the Council at Large and with my past experiences I think I know and understand how things are set up.

What I need is to find out the best way to pass this skill on to the Scouts in the Ship I serve.

Be cause of our location this isn't as easy as maybe it might be if we were someplace else. Kinda like training for high altitudes when you live in Holland.

Eamonn.

[emb021 16]

"The Americas Boating Course offered by the USPS and the US Coast Guard Aux. Is a fine basic boating course.

It just doesn't go into what is needed to meet Sea Scout requirements. "

 

The ABC course is a beginners boating course. You should look at further courses put on by USPS and other groups. Not sure what you mean by 'it doesn't go into what is needed to meet SS requirements'. AFAIK, if a Sea Scout completes this course, he will have met the requirements for Small Boat Handler. (am recalling this from a discussion on the Sea Scout mailing list).

 

"I don't know about anyone else? But I found the Sea Scout Officer Specialized training title to be very misleading -Other than changing the names of the Officers it's just the same as the Venturing course!"

 

As someone who has both completed and given BOTH the Venturing Specific Training (basic venturing adult training) and SSOST, I have to disagree. SSOST is a 3 hour (can be done in less) add-on to Venturing Specific for those adults in Sea Scouts. It spends ALL its time going over the Sea Scout program. There should be no repetition of the Venturing course, unless someone did a 'sea scout specific' version of Venturing basic. (it exists out there)

 

Its called "Sea Scout Officers Specific Training" because it goes into program-specific information. Thus it explains how a Ship is organized, who are the officers, what the uniform is, advancement, etc. As I noted before, its does not get into seamanship, because there are just too many excellent sources for that sort of training.

 

 

[Skipper54 10]

Eamonn,

 

I enjoyed both the book "The Annapolis Book of Seamanship" and the videos. Here is a link to the Annapolis DVD Navigation video.

 

http://www.amazon.com/ANNAPOLIS-SAILBOAT-NAVIGATION/dp/B000LXH5G8/ref=sr_1_7/002-4107224-6708806?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1175621727&sr=1-7

 

USPS also has a course called "Chart Smart" that may work. Even better would be make copies of the SEAL Navigation practice exams and get the whole ship to pass it.

 

Good Luck!

[Eamonn 61]

Thanks Skipper,

I sent off for a used copy !!

I have just started reading Small Craft Piloting & Coastal Navigation, by A.E. Saunders. The book is from Canada.

So far it seems that it does a good job of breaking things down into bite sized easy to understand pieces.

I gave Ray Derk a call and both Ships are going to spend some time working together on this.

We also have some Scouts attending the Piloting course in June on the NE-Region Training Ship.

Doug Yeckley is Skipper and I'm going as a stowaway!

The Power Point presentation on Dead Reckoning, that is on the Sea Scout web site,isn't all bad!! But our Scouts just didn't seem to get it!!

Once I get all my ducks lined up (Or maybe I should say if I get them lined up?) I hope to put something together that younger Scouts might be able to understand a little easier. I'll send it to Bruce and maybe he'll add it to the site?

I do have the SEAL tests and some of the older Scouts are looking at them.

Strange thing was that when I gave it to a couple of them, - You'd think I'd given them a special treat.

They only got them last Monday. I handed them out at the end of the meeting telling them we'd go over them next Monday. I'm kinda anxious to see what happens.

As I have said I'm just not having any joy with the USPS in our area.

Once I get this done we can move on to the joys of working with the sextant! As yet I don't own one!! I'm trying to find a good used one for about $350 -$450. I'm thinking that can be my winter project!!

Eamonn.