Double Eagle

Gotta disagree on the courts, police, and probation standpoint. Having a police background, I see it handled as it should for all parties. The eagle is small compared to a conviction. We all did dumb things at 18 or before. We like to enforce the intent of the law not necessarily the letter of the law. Rolling through a stopsign at 4:30AM has a slight risk than the same offense at 4:30PM. With that said, this could have been $20 - $2000. The issue was he stole, then felt sorry (after being caught, not before), and should he be accepted as an Eagle. No, but the courts would probably do the same thing as the troop with sentencing being probation. I've seen robbers get 5 years of probation for holding up a store. It would tie up the courts, police and probably scare the rest of the scouts into thinking what if they do a dumb thing too. I like the thought of the troop keeping the human dimension piece as the "how to handle" solution.

Boy, can this get long. Keeping it short. No everyone deserves to be an Eagle Scout. Usually the rank is an after-affect after scouting and learning. Do we scout for the prestige and rank or skill, values, and citizenship. I think I would let the BOR know of this event after the SM conference took place. I'm interested in how it was paid back (Parents or him, with your money or his). How many youth know, what was his position in the troop. As a board of review member, better it come out there than wait afterward. How it was handled by the youth is my biggest concern. If not caught, what would have been next, an eagle stealing from a scout, troop, school, or parents. In nature, some young eagles never reach maturity, they fall from the nest, fall to predators, or just never have the will to live. Here we are questioning whether scouting's highest award to go to a scout that steals from his scouting family without addressing the need for the money. If for emergency medicine, starving family, or something like that, I could see good intent, poor execution. For personal reasons (too lazy to work for it), my feathers would droop that day.

Was the APL appointed or elected. If elected, how about the mature one being his APL for the camp. If appointed, you may want to ask him whether he feels up to the charge. If he says yes, let him lead. We adults see youth in a different light than youth. Who we want to lead is often not who the youth want to lead. I've seen this many times in OA elections. The leaders like a scout, but he doesn't know how to work with his peer group. Bottom line: If he is APL now and can lead outside of camp, he will learn a lot more with additional responsibility. He also has the support of strong PLs. My experience is the SPL has the most involvement with camp staff for troop info. Let the APL step up, otherwise he'll always think "could I have ...." Leaders don't get to pick their times to serve, good or bad they inherit issues and signs of the time.

Take a break, read some without replyng. I've been a member of this forum for over 4 years and have felt the same way, watch some enforcers bully users, and I only have a few posts compared to some. I pick and choose topics after some forethought. Don't sign off, just sign out for a while.

Don't know who made them. I have two and love both. I use them more for heavy camping. I use garden tools more on light packing camping. Cold steel's would be my first option if I couldn't locate the BSA ones. The BSA were worth the price, unlike many BSA products. If you are going to do some car/truck short distance camping, a small shovel about 2' or more is great. Just don't skimp on quality, a bent, broken, or cheap shovel will make you miserable in the middle of a campout. I've used mine as a skillet, steel with flint for starting a fire, plate, alarm clock (with a fire bucket), talking shovel (like a talking feather) in a pinch, totem, and many other cool stuff.

Some tips. Get an ASM, troop guide, OA Rep, or a new scout mentor to work with the PLC to offer advancement opportunities to 1st Class in the 1st year. The skills in that year to make 1st Class will prepare them for the tougher trail to eagle. Not all 1st year scouts will take it, better to offer it than have a scout say I wish we did that stuff. Don't wait for summer camp or 1st class weekend to get it going. Empower those 1st class and senior to help others as they were helped along the trail. We lose too many to boring campouts and stifling of enthusiasm. I made 1st Class out of fun and adventure and thougt the rank as secondary until I realized you could be daniel boone and earn a badge too. The skills were important, not the advancement. Maybe I was reading too many mountain man novels as a kid..

I know D-A from my days of a youth. I was part of the Blue Water Council. Considering the horses and fishing, I can't tell you another camp I would like. An option is also that a troop that had reservations now have first dibs on that same date or weekend (within reason if dates fall in the week next time) next year. This may help with predictability and keep troops coming back year after year. If a troop wants to switch with another troop, both units have to say "aye" to the council. As Silver Trails Scourt Reservation closed for summer camp, the BW Council now attends D-A. Reopen STSR and lessen the overbooking.

My take is tent or stars. In a building is like sleeping in your home in a sleeping bag. Kinda miss the rocks, sticks, noises, rain, broken zippers, snooring, and inclined sleeping. My recommendation is for each troop to compare their outdoor program to have more than enough camping nights to meet the minimum time required for eligibility. Keep a camping log when they first start, it will come in handy on the trail to eagle.

Have you seen the length of blade on the long kitchen knife in a chef kit? GTSS reps and suppliers need to talk. Someone really needs to explain why we want to aviod large,fixed blade, locking blade, or sheath types. The knife isn't the problem, its the person using it. I have a few machettes and haven't lost an arm or leg. We have to educate and upgrade with experience. Like buying a car for teenagers (start with a beater up vs. mercedes).

I recommend a lock blade that the blade is no longer than the user's palm is wide. The lockblade will ensure the blade doesn't close on fingers before wanting it to. The three things a scout does with a knife, 1. Sharpens it. 2. Cuts theirself. 3. Loses the knife. This is said with humor. #1 is good, 2 & 3 can be prevented with training and a bright colored retention cord.

Do it at the meeting, make it quick (skip the song). The kids get recognized at meetings in front of everyone, so should you. Just remember, it is important to you, but the kids will tire of talking quickly.

A good place to look is www.majorsurplusandsurvival.com for dutch ovens. They are cheaply priced and delivery is good. They seem to be a little thinner walled than lodge but good just the same. They are not seasoned but no biggee. A trivet is great for inside baking or underneath to keep the oven from crushing burning coals. Replacement of coals under a trivet is easier too. After owning 4 D.O. for years and using them every chance, my suggestion is to start small with the basics and play with ideas. Then determine your plans for increased or discontinued use.

On another note, I wonder how many of the adults have service tattoos or their wife's name or patriotic themes. I wouldn't kick them out for having tattoos. Tolerance and diversity make this a great organization and country.

a few years ago, an eagle candidate had a problem with hair length. I was on the OA dance team and had below shoulder length hair, I still was able to make eagle. I've learned that you have to give some identity to young men and if all they have is a ring, good going. Their are a lot worse things that could be encountered. Let them have their identity without overpowering them.

Wear each ONE with pride. Each one has it's merits (pun intended). No one badge is more important than another. Whether one or fifty, each badge holds memories, experiences, and work that the scout earned the badge. Many times I'll ask eagle candidates which badge they liked the most and most times it is one of their first. It was what interested them. It was their first choice.

If its the Jon-E kind that takes liquid fuel, the best thing to do is take off the top half of the warmer and let it burn faster. You will have to let it burn the fuel out. As an extreme, you could always dunk the element in snow or water. I don't recommend it.

Per my lodge officer guidebook, its one year. If there were extraordinary circumstances why the candidate couldn't attend any ordeal, you may take this up with the top 3 of the lodge. It will be scrutinized. Why didn't/couldn't they attend any ordeal?

I'm all for a philmont crew. The second time I went we had one. Many of us were from the first time and knew each other outside philmont. We had a great time. The seasoned crew can be used to share their experience with inexperienced crews. If they give resistance, compromise by keeping the patrol for their aid with the other crews.

I don't take corners. I usually reinforce the rules and ask for their help with other scouts too. Putting them into the next training session. Having a law enforcement background, I wouldn't cut corners off your drivers license for speeding. A fine or harsh verbal warning is sometimes the right action.

The problem is when a poor sheath is worn improperly it creates a potential stabbing for the wearer. Suggest a knife blade that is no longer than across their palm and is a lock blade. It won't fold back on small fingers and will be a managable size. I still love them but use them away from scouting events. A folder can be just as dangerous as a fixed blade. Education and proper use is the key to being safe.

The price of training can be part of your camp budget. The syllabus covers what is required for camp, you'll get at least two 2" binders of stuff. Many cub day camp directors attend these and its a great way to network with other scouter that have the camp type programs in common. This is not for the usual troop, crew, or pack member. Mostly directors. It is good for 5 years.

Check with your local council office. I'm sure they have it on their calendar. If you live on the border of another council, try them also. Don't let imaginary geographic lines hold you from the training. Many times they are held in January. Good Luck

Sorry for your loss of your parents. I applaud your thoughts. That little strip of cloth and metal are one way to relive the memories of you with them. I feel the same with the loss of my father and how much sctouing we did.

CBW, Welcome. I grew in the thumb area with the blue water council. I visit it from time to time and visit Silver Trails Scout Reservation and D-A Camp near Detroit. Enjoy the forum and don't let strong personalities stop you. Most of the posters are full of experience and their bark is worse than their bite.

You can also rent packs at philmont for about $20. Not a bad deal.