AKdenldr

FOS -- In our area, I've not understood why FOS is not done in direct appeal mailing to the database (perhaps there isn't one?) of scout families and alumnie at their homes? A mailout could not cost much. Maybe not in DEs job -- but worth considering. Return phone calls and emails of volunteers (really, have a system and method to take care of this), or they will not have time to help you in your goals in the future. Remember, that brand new tiger cub leader might be involved in scouting as a volunteer for the next 12+ years. Good luck in the new job -- AK

It was very common in the beginnng years of our pack for the Wolf den leader to be challenged by this requirement. We didn't have indoor flags, let alone an outdoor flag pole. (And most adults reading the requirement don't think the boys will enjoy it as much as boys end up enjoying it.) Wolf leaders start the wolf badge with the start of the academic year and we were way into the cold weather before we got to that requirement. As time when on, we made an indoor flag set, and an outdoor flag pole (portable.) At pack campouts we learned to use the rope over a limb. A few den leaders coordinated with the school janitor to raise the flag before school (an early morning). We became more familiar with the opportunities at the council level day camp to address this requirement. (If your boys are not picked for flag ceremony do it again during the lunch break!) Many wolf den leaders are beginning volunteers figuring it out as they go along. Scouts is a learning experience for more than just the boys.

Seattle, Working with tigers there is an elective for sew on a button. This is a challenging task to do in a group setting with the age group. (Usually there is some sewing in the first grade year. My sons sewed a large (2 inch wide) button onto burlap with thick embrodary thread. This was a challenging task for Tiger aged boys.) Perhaps you could do this elective while parents sew a patch on their son's shirts. (BSA patches with all that stuff on the back are hard to sew.) (At day camp we sewed dog booties with dental floss which is what the mushers use to make repairs and very easy to see.) By the Bear year we made red patch vests out of felt, using the sewing machine. Felt is a very forgiving fabric. IMHO 4th / 5th grade is when some real sewing can take place. (Webelos craftsman.) I've had my new crossovers come over to my house to do their new shirts on the sewing machine. All their work, just my supervision. About 45 minutes per boy. I have to echo everyone else -- no badge magic. -- AK

On thesewing machine use clear nylon thread on top and scout tan oe cubscout blue in the bobbin. Use a heavy duty needle. Hold with straight pins. For tigers we had some success having a volunteer do all the shirts for the den at the beginning of the year with the basic stuff. After they are awarded the bobcat or tiger do a well announced uniform inspection. Some parents have to be taught that sewing on the patch is part of them honoring their son's accomplishment. Some parents truely do not think they know how to sew. Some parents are willing to run the shirt to an alterations shop to avoid this small task. -- Ak

I mentored the first 2 den chiefs for our Pack this year. They were 7th graders who walked up from middle school for our den meetings after school. Even though transportation and conflict with troop meetings and activities were not an issue, school and sports were a big issue. We had to be extremely flexible. The tiger den was not great experience, too many extra adults for the den chief to feel useful. Scout completed his POR (6 months) and is done. But, the Bear den leader did a terrific job using the den chief for her den. He's been invited back after his 4 month POR to assist with Webelos. The den chiefs do need an adult mentor besides the DL. We did not have training available locally, so scouts needed to be "trained" by the advisor. When I do it again I will focus on having the boys do the activity coordinator piece of the service award as a focus for their service. If you led 5 games, 5 songs, and 5 activities you are really learning leading. (and contributing to the meeting) Our 'approval cycle' was just an FYI email.

An additional thought that worked for us. We have the boys sit by dens on den blankets at the front close to the action. Den leaders are with the den on the blankets. Webelos have earned the right to sit together in chairs. This takes care of a lot of motion and behavior issues. First graders at school are reminded before an assembly how to behave. This also might work for your den. Rewards and praise for what goes well. And yes, revamp the event to fit the boys.

Lots of good ideas on this thread. Main thing with newly bridged scouts is having fun and getting to know the guys. Second is scout skills. Anything outside of that is far down the list. As a MBC, I encourage my scouts to be organized. About middle school ages they are getting a lot of this also at school. Your son can search BSA binder on youtube and find a good system that works for many scouts. You can coach and mentor him in this. (I have heard many stories of older scouts starting and restarting and restarting merit badges because of disorganizaton.) You can also coach your son on phone manners (my sons need to write down what they are going to say). My new scout is working on reading MB this summer (has to read anyways for school). That will be it except riflery etc at camp in the afternoon after the new scout program. IMHO, some merit badges lend themselves better to a worksheet than others, scout son (and you) should follow the MBC's lead on this one. Pushing worksheets might undermine the main thing. -- AK

Joining requirement is 11 years old. Troops need to have a way to explain the complicated process to ALL boys and parents, not expecting either earlier scouting experience or that the cub scout experience prepared parents or sons. Every boy has different talents, attentions, skills and experiences. So too with parents. -- AK

Started them with my Bear den, so successful that the whole pack now uses some form of them. My guys would be denner about 6 weeks. They love the denner cords. We would make the transfer a part of a closing den activity. Assistant is the next guy up. Mostly I needed denner to call everyone to remind them of the meeting and any extra details. This was actually a new thing for most boys -- talking on the phone and covering all the details. To prepare for this we made a phone roster and secured it in every boy's handbook (front inside cover). Thankyou notes were also part of the denner responsiblity. An email went home to parents to cover what the duties were at the beginning of the position. Also, who was denner was printed on den schedule. We elected for the position, but if I were to do it again, I would assign. In the meeting I would increasingly use the denner to get the scouts to do the tasks. ('Denner can you get someone to pass out the snack?') Other dens have other duties. But I highly recommend a denner system. -- AK

OTN-- I don't think our situations are alike.... Well, under my "what if" if the big civics organization sponsored pack wanted to provide all the planning etc for a big pack experience great we might participate. We are magnet school that pulls across a large area. Parents like the after school meetings and pack events in the evening are limited. So I wouldn't know if families would really want to participate in a pack evening program somewhere else. We've had really strong den programs -- but recruiting an active CM and committee on the long term has been problematic. Usually Bear and Web den leaders push the pack program also (recruit special event volunteers, do advancement for their den, write the pack meeting script, set camp dates, plan summer hikes, recruit tiger dens, write the budget.) Getting rid of all the pack administration issues would be terrific! But, is there an advantage to the receiving pack? Taking on 20 extra families? But.... isn't there a discussion right in the forum now about troop sizes getting too large for the typical volunteer skill set....? Wouldn't this also correlate to packs? Anyways, we've seen no action or communication from our council or district about getting rid of friends of in the last 2 years. And, I have heard new DE is having a lot of trouble trying to find a sponsor for the Pack he recruited during fall round up at the school a few blocks down. -- AK

Okay, we have an 8 year old 5 den pack of 25 or so boys at a local public school. This is a "Parents of Pack". Approaching the parent organization at this school will likely create a huge discussion of G and G (and G) -- with the end result being "no". Off the cuff solution -- not recharter -- take our 5 dens to another pack sponsored by a civics organization -- change out pack numbers and continue on as we have (den meetings at our school, 5 den pinewood derby on our track, 5 den planning, 5 den pack meetings, 5 den pack campouts, etc...). End impact for us -- a little more communication with other folks. End impact for district -- DE has one less unit. Boys might end up changing districts (we're on a boundry line). What do you think?

It is a choice as to weither to transfer the diamonds to the tan shirt or wait for the Webelos Oval when earned. See page 34 Webelos handbook. Our pack long ago chose to celebrate our boys' previous accomplishments by going with the diamonds on the tan shirt. (Nothing like a chest full of diamonds and arrowheads to wow those younger scouts!) Once the Webelos is earned it can be awarded as a diamond -- but replaces the tiger. (I don't make the rules, if I did it would replace the bobcat.) We seem to be in the minority around here, however. Most Webs we saw at camp went the Oval route.

blw2, Regarding Tigers, In my limited experience parents are also learning in the program -- as time goes by they expect more of their son as an Akela before they sign off. The cub scout standard is "do your best". By Bear year the pencil whipping problem is gone. In Webs the leader signs off. Then in Scouts the boy leaders (hopefully). As a leader I would informally ask each boy some questions about a few achievements done at home. This gave him an opportunity to share and reinforced expectations. (Other boys got motivated.) One way to model behavior for other adults is to discuss how terrific the "watch the weather" family activity was with your tiger, or the Character Connection on honesty, or how well the chore chart worked out for your wolf scout. Remember that Cubs is a family based program that also has goals around building good families. Some adults just haven't gotten it yet, but many eventually will get it by being involved in the program. -- AK

1.) how often do you meet, when and where 2.) what do you do (really, they already know the answer to this.) 3.) what are my responsibilities? (asked in different ways.) around 4th is "how do you handle God?". In our recruitment group, inclusiveness and home approach to this is the answer that the parents are listening for. -- AK

I forgot to say, 'welcome and you came to the right place!'

lisawe1215, Well you didn't say how many tiger boys you have, but I hope you don't quit. It is really fun and rewarding, sounds like things just got off to a rough start that can be corrected! Call up the CC/CM and tell them you need more support now. Make them meet you for coffee or lunch and go over your concerns. Get the schedule for the leader meeting. Get some mentoring (usually the Bear and Wolf leaders do this in our pack for the tiger leader.) If they can't help you with this, you do need to move on to another Pack. (They can help you brainstorm how to set up, etc, usually they can't attend the meetings.) Cancel the next tiger meeting and have a parent meeting in the place of the meeting to set expectations with the parents. Look for someone willing to be a registered, and trained, assistant den leader next school year. If no ADL, no wolf den. Sounds like emails or written word is not working for these parents. Use phone calls and in person conversations until those communications are working. Make it clear that when they get an email or call from you you need them to communicate back. It might be that once this framework is up and running you will be a happy leader! But if not, move on. -- AK

We have the Web I den come up first. They are recognized for their accomplishments and remain standing on the left of the "stage". Then the bears become webelos thru the necker (or Tan shirt) upgrade, one by one they walk over and join the WebIIs. In the end they are all Webelos together, even if the dens are not combining. Boys seem to like it.

This is a really refreshing thread. answer is no, and for a while we felt really bad about that. (We thought we were the only ones that didn't do 9 pack meetings a year.) We haven't had the gung ho CM that we need to pull off more. We have 3-4 a school year. But like 5year we have many pack wide events that serve as pack meetings (many of them even have awards at the end). (We can gather up more energy for special events from our non-den leader volunteers.) -- AK

Well around here you have a choice in gender. But I wonder if the moms are signing up to counsel this merit badge because it is a way to contribute back to the program even if their scoutcraft skills are not that strong. Its a big merit badge if done right and this conversation is just one of many. MT I like your approach on counseling the badge.

Well, we got lots of things that had to be discarded: opened rice, whole potatoes, an entire pantry. If you work at a food bank warehouse a common job is sorting thru donations and discarding the items that are dented, vastly expired, or "not food". I think this is typical of donation drives. I wouldn't let it get you down. Focus on the positive. What are the boys learning by being of service?

Thanks Nike for letting us know the rules. And all the resources are terrific. I have no influence with current G.S. leader. She seems stressed and overwhelmed. She takes any parent questions as criticisms. My former cub scout moms are gathering information and waiting until she departs. I'll put some bugs in some ears about adult coverage so girls are safe. On the positive side, I've run into several of the girls this last week and they all are looking into summer camp with great excitement! -- AK

We MAKE AOL arrows displayed with leather lacing not a plaque. Cost for the first set where I had to buy supplies (paint, paint pens, sinew, etc) $ 6 a piece. I made them for the last 3 dens crossing over. Pretty sure the tradition will continue but plaques may be added as the Carpenter Eagle Dad gets to that level. Just saw one on display in someone's living room. Certificate detailing the colors still attached. -- AK

Thanks SSS-- That does bring up another question, how does the whole bridging thing work with multi age troops? Are the bridging girls forming a new troop if one does not exist that they can join? Can the remaining girls and leaders establish if they will accept new girls from the lower grade in their troop? Bridging season (is it usually end of the school year?) might be a good time to correct any size issues. -- AK

Thanks Nut and Nike, I was asking because size becuase we sense that it is also part of the issue. Size wise it is 2-3 cub scout dens with one leader, no assistant or co-leader, and one rotating parent volunteer who may or may not remember to come. The space they meet in is not conductive to active games with that many children. I'm amazed how well the girls behave, my cubs could have never done that well. At that age we always had 3 adults (for 8) and we needed them. -- AK

What does the current Bear den look like? Could the pack plan be that the WI/WII dens join forces boys could bridge when they are old enough and have earned the AOL? Also is your troop receiving cross overs at any time? Some in our neck of the woods have a specific time they receive cross overs (so that new scouts are welcomed well and ready to camp in warmer weather.) March is the main time around here -- so the boys have time to get used to the troop before boyscout camp. -- AK