David CO

I saw the movie last week with the grandkids. I wouldn't have gone to see it except for my wanting to spend some time with the kids. I didn't like it at all. All the things you say about the tone of the film is true. One thing you didn't mention is the film's anti-religion sub-theme. The film implies that religion is the cause of all strife, and that the only solution is to abandon the old religious writings and customs. Yes, I do see a parallel with BSA.

I'm glad to hear it. I wouldn't want my unit going to camp Beverly Hills.

That statement does not mean a Cubmaster can do anything he wants, just so long as his aim is to help the boys. For example, he still has to obey federal, state, and local laws. Nothing in that statement relieves the CM of his civic responsibilities. He is still a volunteer for the CO. Nothing in that statement confers ownership of the unit, or any part of the unit, from the CO to the CM. He is still subordinate to the COR. Nothing in that statement changes the chain of command. It is a nice statement, but it does not say it all.

OK. Now what's the downside?

Since you didn't say if troop 2 has an strong and active CO, I have no way of knowing if it is a hypothetical perfect troop.

You need to understand that my CO is the Athletic Department of a school. The policy was originally designed for coaches. We didn't want people coaching two teams in the same season. If we applied your hypothetical, Mr. Smith would not be allowed to coach an older daughter's 8th grade volleyball team while coaching the 6th grade boy's basketball team. The policy was written to apply to all extra-curricular activities, including scouting, so no one would feel that they were being singled out. A CO's policies may not always seem to make much sense if you look at them in isolation, narrowing your focus on the unit or the individual scout. The reasons may become more clear if you look at the bigger picture. The CO owns the scout unit. It is reasonable for the CO to expect the unit to fit in with its overall policies, objectives, and goals.

I don't think Mr. Smith is being disloyal. His son chose the troop. My unit has a policy against its leaders holding more than one scouter position at a time. This would be true regardless of whether the second position is with our unit, another CO's unit, district, or council. I wouldn't characterize this as "firing' the leader. We would ask him to choose. There would be an odd wrinkle to this hypothetical situation if the scouter happened to also be a teacher at my school. The diocese requires Catholic school teachers to send their children to a Catholic school. I don't know if they would also expect the teacher to choose the Catholic school's scout unit for his son. It's possible.

I have a very different speech that I gave to all of my athletes and scouts. I told them that, in 5 years time, if any of them still cared one iota about any of the victories or losses they experienced in school, I would be very disappointed. All youth awards should have an expiration date on them, for those who get them as well as for those who don't.

You picked out three things that scouting is not supposed to be.

The CC/COR cannot mandate where individual Webelos go, but they can mandate where a Webelos den does or doesn't go.

It is worth whatever you feel it is worth, no more and no less.

Fine, just so long as it is clearly understood that it is an arbitrary standard. There is no valid scientific reason to choose that as the starting point. CO2 levels have not been level through most of human existence. It has gone up and down.

I don't think boys should view advancement as either a goal or an achievement. It should be something that just happens sometimes during the course of a journey, like finding a really neat shiny stone while strolling down a path.

The problem with the whole climate change question is that no one seems to know what the ideal environment would be. Are CO2 levels currently higher or lower than optimal? Nobody knows. All we know is that they are slightly higher than they used to be. It may turn out to be that higher CO2 levels are a good thing. Future college students may be complaining about declining CO2 levels.

Hey, no fair! I'm a teacher. The boys see me every day at school.

I was going to compare (many pages ago) the recent trend to avoid physical contact to BSA's long past decision to ban nude swimming (my point being that times and sensibilities change), but then I thought better of it. I would rather keep the thread out of YP. I agree that it may be time to let this thread go.

...and this whole discussion on wood badge belongs in the wood badge forum.

There's an idea. Maybe they should change the title from COR to PG.

There is a big difference between unseen and uninvolved. If the IH and COR are doing their jobs right, most of their work will be unseen by most of the scouters, parents, and scouts. The SM and CM are the front men of the units. They have the most visible roles of all the scouters, and rightly so. The public should see the SM and CM as the primary leaders of the units. It is understandable that parents and lower level scouters might feel that way (uninformed and interfering) about the IH and COR, but the SM and CM must never do so. The SM and CM should be among the CO's most loyal supporters. If they're not, it is a big problem.

No offense taken. You said it exactly right. I came on this forum nine years ago precisely because of this. Most unit scouters don't seem to understand the proper role of the CO and its representatives, the IH and COR. By adding my voice to the discussions, I had hoped to make scouters more aware of our existence and of our important role in scouting.

That's why I feel so strongly about scouters showing some respect to the active CO's who are trying to do it right. They should be put up as an example to emulate, not as a target to attack.

I disagree. The biggest issue is leadership. How can a CO recruit new boy scouts when its own registered leadership is unwilling to support the unit.

Funny you should mention that. I actually started my unit by registering a bunch of my Lone Scout friends in my troop. The council did have a few raised eyebrows when they observed that some of my scouts lived hundreds of miles away, but they let it slide. I never intended to use paper scouts as a long term solution. I was just priming the pump.

True. The troop couldn't have rechartered last year with only 2 registered scouts. The paper scouts might have aged out. Obviously.

Are you serious? If one of our units failed to recharter on time, it would not only be the biggest issue, it would be the only issue.