CA_Scouter

A CAT stove? Creative, but wouldn't PETA get upset? :-)

Years back, when I worked for a military contractor, we learned very quickly how to write a proper specification ( or 'rule' ) for manufacturing an item. The wording was always 'shall be', not 'will be', 'should be', 'might be', 'may be'... etc. There is no ambiguity in 'shall be'.... So why did the BSA not do the same? Perhaps an oversight, or perhaps an attempt not to alienate good scouters who had this one bad habit. Who knows... I know that our current scoutmaster, who I'm taking over for at the end of this month, finally got the message to quit smoking when he had his second heart attack last summer ( he's only 49 ). When he was still partaking of the habit, he always walked off away from the boys, but still got razzed when he came back... But we have no more tobacco issues now, so thank goodness!

We completely banned Yu-Gi-Oh from our troop because we consider it to be a form of gambling, and because we had two boys square off at a campout in a dispute over ownership of a card that one of them had lost in one of the games they play. There were also many heated arguments between some of the boys, so we really considered it to be inappropriate at a scouting event. We also temporarily suspended poker, because we had an incident with some scouts refusing to participate in activities planned during a campout. We may consider lifting the ban if I can get leadership to propose an acceptable plan on use and responsibility. But I haven't seen Yu-Gi-Oh in a while. Thank Goodness!

Eamonn, I've seen your posts all over the place, and am very impressed with your dedication and insight into Scouting. I've been ASM for about 18mos now, and will be taking over as SM at the end of this month. I am so unbelievably excited about being the SM, that I just can't stand it! HOWEVER, I can see how one can step too close to the whirlpool, and get sucked in pretty deep. It looks like you are handling a lot right now, and are not getting the postive feedback you deserve. You deserve a pat on the back. Hopefully I can do a decent job: So let me say, that your posts ( though lengthy at times ;-) ), are always informative, to the point, practical, and above all, non-judgemental. I enjoy reading them, and have learned plenty from them. Thanks for your effort. I agree with Semper...you need a rest...take a vacation from Scouting for a little while and recharge your batteries...

oops, sorry, I fat-fingered the last post.... I'd like to break this down into two sections: 1) AS A BOY SCOUT The most important thing I learned as a Boy Scout was to be self-sufficient. I had several very good scoutmasters, and very active Dad, who taught me all the skills that I continue to use every day in my adult life, from practical things like tying knots and first aid, to emotional and professional skills, such as patience and leadership. 2) AS A LEADER The most important thing I learned as a leader is restraint. As much as I want to take over and show the boys the most efficient way to do things, I've learned to hold off and let them work things out at their own level. I/we try to give the boys guidance, but then we back off and let them have at it. We ( all the SM/ASM's ) feel this is the best method of learning. This also holds true with dealing with committee members. I may have an idea or five :-) about how some things should be done, but ya know, I'm better off leaving them to handle their own assignments as they see fit...

OK, you Deutsch challenged scouters, here is a rough translation: Leader: Ich bin ein musicale vom der Vaterland! English:I am a musician from the Fatherland. (unknown word) SPIELEN! English: Play! Orchestra: (unknown word) SPIELEN! English: Play! Leader: Spielen der viola! English: Play the violin! ...and I played the accordian for 6 years in my youth, so I can oom-paa-paa with the best of 'em. Guten Abend! ( good night! ) :-)

Our troop has only 5 older boys (14+), with the remaining 9 all 11-12yrs old. The age difference may not seem like much, but there really is a significant difference in maturity level (ok, I know that's stretching the meaning of the word a little :-) ). We also may have up to 10 Webelos crossing over this spring, making us a very young troop. I'm concerned because we lost several older scouts last year for various reasons, and I need to keep my remaining older scouts active and interested, so I don't lose any more leaders. We are considering doing a variation of a 'Venture' patrol, where we try to involve the older scouts in more high adventure activities than perhaps the younger scouts aren't quite qualified to do yet, things like longer backpacking trips on rougher terrain, cross-country skiing, etc. So our thinking is that we would have a 'high adventure' type group for the older scouts, but at the same time, have the older scouts remain as leaders for the younger boys. This way, the older scouts get their more exciting activities, but they still remain involved and active with ALL the scouts in the troop. We haven't yet implemented this yet, but are leaning strongly towards doing so soon.

We do not permit parents to sign off on any rank advancement. Only the SM or ASM's may do so. Furthermore, we have an informal policy among the SM's to not sign off anything for their own child. This has worked well for us, in the regard that nobody has questioned whether a boy has done the work that is required of him. Regarding MB requirements and rank advancement, we do review the information in the rank advancement with the Scout even though he passed the MB. We just think its good practice to do so.

Yup. We sure do, every Feb. We spend the preceding meetings discussing layering, equipment, hypothermia, food, etc. Great subjects for Skillbase. Last year, we went to Grover Hot Springs State Park out here in Calif, where after a chilly night, we got into the pool facility where they have both a hot mineral water pool and a regular swimming pool ( heated all winter ). Kids had a blast.

The SM of our troop is retiring next month, and we would like to give him a nice send off and a meaningful gift. He's been involved in Scouting for 16 years now as a Committee Member or Scoutmaster and has obviously devoted many hours of his time to the cause. I would like to solicit ideas from the forum on ceremonies, gifts, speeches, etc. that we can use to give this great guy a proper 'thanks'. Anything ideas involving the boys would be of special interest. Thanks much.

We set a limit of $5/day for food, so a typical weekend trip is $10. Patrols submit menus to the ASM's the final meeting before the trip, and a scout is for each patrol is assigned to do the shopping. The shopper has to stay within budget, or eat the overage. If they are under and they pocket a few bucks, no big deal, its only a few bucks anyway. We do, however, actively discourage hamburgers and hot dogs because it seemed that that's all the boys ever wanted. We let them still do it now and then, but we also at times require that they cook a dutch oven meal, or something that takes a little effort and skill, so they learn how to actually cook a nutritious meal. We've created a library of dutch oven recipes from which the boys can choose.

Arrow of Light Eagle Scout PL, SPL, QUARTERMASTER, JASM currently ASM, will take over as SM in 2005

We are one of those troops that likes to experience different summer camps each year. Generally, our camping chair and/or an ASM will research several scout camps and make a presentation to the boys, who will then vote on which camp to attend. For some camps, they will mail you a video describing their program, facilities, etc. so the boys have a good description of where they may be going ( we send the video back when we are done ). This works well for us.

This story isn't exactly about Scouts, but its pretty close, and definitely applicable. When I was a kid, we used to go camping with this other family now and then. On this occasion, the sun was setting, so my Dad and his buddy were attempting to light the Coleman Lantern, probably after a beer or two. Well, they managed to tip over the Coleman Stove, spilling fuel over the picnic table, which landed on the plastic table cloth, after which the whole thing lit up like a bonfire. Dad and friend quickly doused the fire before too much damage was done, but in the end, had succesfully lit the lantern. What's so funny about this? My dad was my Scoutmaster at the time. His buddy was also involved in Scouts with his son. My dad was also a fireman. His buddy was also a fireman, and eventually retired as the Assistant Chief of the San Francisco Fire Department!

Thanks, yes we did specify the behavior and expected areas of improvement, but did not write it up into a formal document. This would definitely help us to guage the boy's progress, and him too! Thanks

Our adults don't have a patrol per se, its just that we use the phrase to refer to all the adults on the current campout. We are known as the "Rocking Chair Patrol" and/or the "Council of Elders". We did the Council of Elders thing at summer camp last year, and one of the ASM's carved a staff upon which he attached whatever shiny stuff we could find, then we ruled by decree... 'yada, yada, so saeth the Council of Elders'... we yukked it up pretty good, those poor kids groaned and rolled their eyes everytime they saw us coming...

This discussion has morphed a bit from my initial post. Please note that I never indicated that having these boys together in the same patrol equated to 'trouble'. We've not seen any problems with them in the same patrol, our concern was based on the dependency of the younger on the older. After reviewing the various comments, I think we'll just let it work itself out at this point. It seems as if we might be making much ado over nothing..

In answer to a few questions: Yes, we have had a parent conference where we indicated what was, and what was not acceptable behavior, and we indicated that he would not advance until it improved. He actually DID agree that his behavior was not acceptable, so that was good. We have seen some improvement, and that's been acknowledged and encouraged, but there is still plenty of room for additional improvement. The scout has no medical conditions. He was formerly a Den Chief, but was relieved of his duties due to bad behavior ( see my previous post ). thanks all

Due to my attempt at brevity, I was probably too vague about the problem. I would like to clarify a few things... I should first state that our troop tries very hard to focus on the positive with all our boys. We all agree that encouragement is the basis for good scouting, but that we sometimes have to set a standard for good behavior, and that is where this scout is a challenge. We have, and still do, always complement this boy when he is exhibiting good behavior. In short, he's a poker, meaning he needles other scouts to get a rise out of them, which he then escalates into a verbal shouting match ( complete with foul language ), which he blames the other scout for starting. He also has a tendency to throw things, and has whacked is brother a few times while on outings. In one case, as Den Chief, he was leading his young charges during a campout, where they watched him pick a fight with another scout, again using foul language, which escalated into a pushing match, then was belligerant and combative (verbally) with our SM. He has had other, less serious, fits of bad behavior, all of which we have discussed with him and his mother. Our wish for him to assist with First Class trail was for the purpose of showing leadership with the younger scouts, and to give him the opportunity to redeem himself in the view of the SM and ASM's. Our 'requirement' here, we felt, was in line with the "Demonstrate scout spirit by living the Scout Oath (Promise) and Scout Law in your everyday life." item in the Star Scout Rank Requirements. We have discussed the applicability of the Scout Oath and Laws to his rank advancement requirements, and that is what we are monitoring very closely. I appreciate the comments from EagleinKY - we've done some of those things, but not all, so we'll work along those lines to get this situation turned around. Good idea, Eamonn, about explaining Eagle Scout in detail to the mother, I don't think she quite has the grasp of how much work is involved and how the desire has to come from the boy. Thanks all for your insight.

We have a boy who has fulfilled all the technical requirements for Star scount, but has so far shown a distinct lack of leadership and Scout Spirit. He's had to be disciplined a couple of times now for poor behavior, and he continues to be someone we must watch over constantly, to be sure he doesn't get out of line. We have declined to promote him for our last Court of Honor due to these issues. We've put conditions upon him to participate more in assisting the younger scouts during First Class trail advancement, and to behave in an appropriate manner at all times. If he satisfies these conditions over the next couple of months, we'll reconsider signing off on his advancement. Complicating the issue is his mother, who is pushing hard for him to become an Eagle Scount. I'm concerned about advancing him when we have this continuing discipline issue confronting us. Question #1 - is do our conditions for appropriate behavior make sense? Question #2 - would appreciate any comments on motivating this 'boy' to become a 'young man' and live up to the ideals of Scouting...

We have a situation with brothers assigned to the same patrol, where one is 13, and the other just bridged over from Webelos this year. Momma insists that the boys must be in the same patrol, but we, as scoutmasters, feel that the younger one depends too much on the older one for guidance and assistance. We feel the younger one would best be served by integrating more with other scouts, so that he can learn some independance and leadership skills. Would appreciate comments on this situation. Thanks much.