BetterWithCheddar

Our Pack does popcorn "show-and-sells" at two fairly large retailers. I think the families who sign up are reasonably successful; however, I'm uncomfortable asking people to pay $20 for $5 worth of popcorn (but I don't begrudge those who do). We'll hit our Spring candy bar sale pretty hard. No one seems to mind paying $2 for a candy bar and the Pack keeps $1 for every candy bar sold.

This is an extremely interesting premise because it seems to help explain many of the large cost spikes of the past 20 years (health care, college tuition, etc.). Maybe I'm just not following 100%, but are you suggesting that over time, wages seem to get dragged upward by industries experiencing high productivity growth (software development, for example)? But then how do you reconcile the fact that many politicians would have us believe wages have not kept up with inflation over the long run? (I'm genuinely curious)

That's hardly your fault. Everyone has a finite amount of money they're comfortable giving each year. Many on this forum have been positively impacted by Scouting and give a disproportionate amount of their funds to the BSA. But for your average parent, this is one of a half-dozen activities in which their family currently participates. You raise a good point. I hadn't considered the United Way impact. My council's annual report lists the United Way as providing 1% of total revenue. I'm sure that was higher at one point.

No doubt, that's the biggest driver. Over 25 years, it would be reasonable to expect Inflation to cause prices levels to double. Yet, the FOS amount in my council has tripled during that same time. I suspect membership has declined without commensurate cuts in professional staff or facilities (thus leading to a higher cost per scout).

I appreciate all of the replies. I was more curious about the nuances of the campaign (but I'm sure it varies widely by council). I plan on making a token FOS contribution (but probably not the full $401 the council requests). Our DE seems like a nice guy and has been very responsive. However, I already self-fund most of my Den's activities - at least I can be sure that goes 100% to program. When I review my council's annual report, I see roughly 8% of their income comes from FOS and 20% from Popcorn. However, the council also lists fundraising as one of its largest expenses (so it's not clear exactly how much they net from these two activities). I also think they deliberately obfuscate how much is being spent on staff salaries because they list "Management" as a large expense, but this number (~ $300,000) seems too small to cover a large professional staff. I think this is likely for Insurance, as well as Audit and Accounting Services. The staff salaries are probably hidden in "Program Services," which is by far the largest expense. But hey, I don't mean to knock the entire professional corp. There are a lot of good folks out there.

I'm a parent of a Lion and will be experiencing FOS for the first time this Spring. For the more tenured volunteers, can I ask a few questions? I have an FOS flyer from my youth asking for $129 (the cost to support 1 scout for 1 year). Mentally, I was preparing to make a donation of around $200. Now I see the campaign is asking for $401 (the cost to support 1 scout for 1 year in 2023). What the heck happened there? I assume the council has an FOS fundraising goal. Does that goal get pushed down to the districts and the unit level? If so, does that mean every unit has an FOS goal? What happens if the unit doesn't hit the goal? Are they assessed a lump sum?

I have a somewhat cynical view of the OA, but this is a perfect service they can perform to help convert Cubs to Scouts BSA. OP, have you considered reaching out to the Scout Troop your Cubs will be joining? Perhaps, they'd be willing to cover the recognition costs? My Cub Scout Pack has an OK relationship with a few local Scout Troops, but they seem to be more responsive when there are bodies on the line. 🙂

Child safety is a shared concern. My implication is that Millennial mothers drive household decision-making. (Including having final say on their child's participation in Cub Scouts). I always get a chuckle when I hear a story about a well-meaning girl who writes to a detergent company to complain about sexist advertising. She's assuming that women are often featured in detergent commercials because the company believes wives do more laundry than their husbands. While this may be true in some households, the company is featuring women in their ads because women are more likely to BUY THE DETERGENT (or at least choose the brand). Laundry in my household is split 50/50 (my wife would say 60/40), but she's the one who looks forward to the weekly Target run. In any case, I appreciate the dialogue. Rather than risk debating at nauseum, I'll concede my opinion on the matter is in the minority (but please understand it's not unique to me). All else equal, suburban moms would probably prefer that suburban dads are the ones to take their children camping.

Welcome. Great first post! Please let me clarify - Like most others, I have no concerns about a long-tenured, non-parent volunteer participating in overnight events, provided YP is observed. However, you don't have to convince me that Scouting is safe - you have to convince Millennial mothers. And right now, that's akin to convincing people to board a blimp right after the Hindenburg disaster. I'm not sure how my statement could be construed as sexist. It's a response to observed behavior (with about 82,000 examples, right?). Allow me to provide some insight into how a typical Millennial marriage works: If my wife wanted to quit her job tomorrow, she would be praised for putting her family first. If I wanted to quit my job tomorrow, society would ask - "what the heck is wrong with this guy?" My exclusive domain as a father is our investment portfolio, the lawn, and maybe how the basement is decorated. That's it. Mothers get final say on everything else. You could say that's also "straight-up sexist," but it's a common marriage dynamic of which the BSA needs to be cognizant. The NFL has been wildly successful in recent years, despite political controversy, safety concerns. and ever-increasing prices of tickets and merchandise. A big part of their success is that they know how to market to women (even though their product involves mostly men - not unlike the BSA!). Pink merchandise, pop concerts at halftime, and an emphasis on youth football safety - that's not a coincidence! Bottom Line: Use your discretion and observe YP when deciding who camps with your unit. Most units do this and most units have no problems. However - I implore you to consider the actual decision makers and how they may perceive the participation of male volunteers who are not parents.

I will tread lightly with my follow-up post. I am fully aware of the many contributions of non-parent volunteers (having been the beneficiary of them myself as a youth). This is my perspective as the parent of a Cub Scout: My wife and I are almost 40. We are politically moderate and live in the suburbs of a mid-size city. We have good jobs and sufficient disposable income to provide extra-curricular opportunities for our son, but our time is limited and we have to be selective about the activities in which he participates. You could apply this same description to the majority of parents in our community. By most accounts, we would all pass a "reasonable person" standard. Not long ago, my wife and I endured a nightly barrage of "Abused in Scouting" commercials as we were settling down for bed. Had I not been a Scout myself, there is no way my wife would have signed our son up for Cub Scouts. There are a dozen other age-appropriate activities in which our son could participate that do not involve a high-profile sexual abuse scandal. I know there are many long-tenured Scouters on this forum. Please place yourselves in the shoes of a new scout parent and ask whether you would be comfortable sending your son or daughter on a camping trip with adult men who are not the parents of Scouts. Those of us who have been affiliated with Scouting are likely to say "Sure, that'd be fine, as long as we know the person and observe YP, etc." - but what is a 40-year-old mom with no Scouting experience going to say? Last Fall, I took my Kindergartner to a 1-day event sponsored by our district. It warmed my heart to see so many volunteers I recognized from my youth. Many of them were parents of my Scouting peers who have stuck with the program in some capacity. One day, after my son is grown, I could see myself joining this district volunteer corp. However, I have no desire to chaperone overnight events that my son is not attending. First, that sounds exhausting. And, second, I would not want to put myself in a compromising situation where it could even be hinted that my behavior around youth was inappropriate. While I see merit in everyone's rebuttal, I implore you to think of the average Millennial mother who gets to decide whether her child participates in Scouting. She is the one deciding the BSA's fate right now. You may know that the 60-year-old man camping with your troop has 4 Eagle Scout sons, but she may not know (or care). Respectfully, Better With Cheddar

Unpopular take: This is 2023. Grown men without children in the unit should not participate in overnight activities. I'm fully aware this would exclude many terrific volunteers from participating in a key aspect of the program. By all means, they are welcome to volunteer in other capacities (staffing a day camp or training parent volunteers, for example). As a 30-something parent, I'd be highly skeptical of a male volunteering at the unit level if that person wasn't also a parent and I'm certain my wife shares my skepticism. And we all know moms drive the big household decisions (like whether kids get to participate in Scouting).

I'm halfway through my tenure as a Lion Den Leader. I've tried very hard to simplify everything from our calendar to the advancement requirements, but I've learned I've got about 10 minutes of "instruction time" before our den meetings need to give way to fun and games. If the Lion year were still in its pilot phase, I would enthusiastically recommend holding off until 1st Grade. I'm pleased my son and his friends seem to look forward to their meetings (and that alone has made it worth it), but it's sapped a lot of energy and enthusiasm from me.

I'm sharp enough to realize these types of situations exist, but the concept of the AOL award being perceived as a serious academic credential still baffles me.

The BSA has long permitted youth to earn Eagle in 18 months, so I do not see questioning whether new female Scouts have "fulfilled the letter and spirt of the requirements" as a valid critique of girls in Scouts BSA. We can debate that in the program at large. (And @Cburkhardt, I know that was not necessarily your opinion. You were just framing the discussion) I worry less about new 16- or 17-year-old Scouts earning Eagle in 18 months than I do about 12- or 13-year-olds earning Eagle in that same amount of time. I do not mean to suggest that all the younger Eagles are undeserving (surely, there have been a few outstanding youths to earn the award at the age), but most of us have seen an Eagle packet or two that has raised an eyebrow.

I know this is being re-hashed for the 5th time here, but I'll bite: Yes, this seems like a knee-jerk reaction from National that we all have to live with. Yes, there is value in the message, but it could probably be combined with other Citizenship MBs. Yes, kids get a lot of this same material in school and now a few more of their Troop meetings just became School 2.0. However, the situation is what you make of it. Find the right person to deliver the message and make it worthwhile for your Troop. Some of the best presentations I've ever attended were on subjects I initially didn't (and in some cases, still don't) have an interest in. A good speaker just found a way to make the material more appealing to me.

I never liked singing as a youth. I enjoy it less as an adult. The council camp I attended and staffed as a youth usually sang in the dining hall after lunch and dinner and that always seemed like a chore to me ... even when I was 11. The exception has always been a well-timed campfire song ~ Vespers, America the Beautiful, etc. I never minded singing those types of songs (still don't) and agree with other posters on those songs being a great place to start. One low key upside to singing (and why I think it still has a place in Scouting, despite my personal aversion) is that it builds confidence for youth. If you can stand up and sing a ridiculous song in front of your peers and their parents at age 12, you're probably going to be more comfortable making professional presentations as an adult than someone who didn't have that type of experience as a youth. Keep it short. Keep it simple. Make it fun or patriotic. It doesn't have to be a big part of your program, but there's certainly value in promoting it in small doses.

Regarding the discussion on the custom numeral strips: I was able to order a pair of strips through Scout Shop online without needing to order a dozen minimum. I distinctly recall needing to hit the minimum order size in the past, so this was a nice enhancement to the site.

I would not have appreciated this comment as much as a Scout as I do today as a parent. A weekend campout that requires less than 24 hours of my time is immensely preferable to one that forces me to abdicate my other home, work, and marital responsibilities for a full 48 hours.

Does the BSA still offer customized numeral strips? My son's Pack has a 4-digit unit number. Rather than buy and sew on 4 different numbers, I was planning on ordering a dozen customized 4-digit strips from scoutshop.org; however, I did not see that option available. I know they've sold them previously because I ordered them 20 years ago as my Crew's Treasurer. They look infinitely sharper than the 4 individual numerals. You've got to be a sewing pro to get those to line up perfectly.

I ordered several custom patches from Craig years ago. It was a great experience. I'd highly recommend visiting his site. He's the genius who makes square knots on green backgrounds to match Venturing uniforms. Honestly, who thought tan on green was a good idea?

You've got a capable young lady who loves Scouting - ordinarily, that wouldn't be a problem, except your Troop is experiencing some growing pains. In theory, a Troop exists with Scouts ages 11-17 in perfect harmony, but in practice, kids have different needs and interests. While I'd encourage older Scouts to take an interest in the development of their younger peers, it's unfair to charge them with that responsibility (no matter what the Handbook says). So, yes - it's normal. Even the best, most-involved Scouts follow a fairly typical evolution: Ages 11-14: Troop Life is the core of their Scouting experience. They earn their Life Rank and nearly all required merit badges within 3 years. The capstone of this phase is them serving as ASPL or SPL at age 13 or 14. Ages 15-17: They scale back their involvement in the Troop because their high school experience is more demanding and they've already been through the Troop Calendar 3 or 4 times. They connect and bond with other older Scouts through Camp Staff, OA, or High Adventure activities. Ideally, they return to the Troop to finish their Eagle requirements and provide support as a Troop Guide, Instructor, or JASM, but they should not be counted on as primary youth leaders. Ages 18-21: They still might make great seasonal employees for the BSA. Hold the door open for them if they ever want to volunteer or finish up any Venturing requirements, but it's time for them to shine outside of Scouting.

I grew up in what most would consider a great Boy Scout Troop. Without hesitation, the reason our program was so successful was our dedicated Scoutmaster. I cannot say enough good things about her. A secondary reason for our success was a high number of dads willing to go camping every month. While my Scoutmaster was the glue that held the Troop together, we were never short on parent volunteers. My father wasn't an active Scouter, but he was on the Troop Committee, helped with BORs, and chaperoned some events. Lastly, our district had a strong program. District camporees were staples of the Troop calendar and we often camped with neighboring troops. Also, here's an intangible I don't think most folks consider: The mix of Scouts. As leaders, we have limited control over the types of Scouts and parents that join our units. My troop in the late 1990s was made up of mostly decent, friendly kids. Interpersonal conflicts were rare. I'm 7 years older than my brother and he lasted about 6 months in Boy Scouts because the mix of kids around his age was more eclectic. He wasn't interested in spending time with them outside of school. You can put loads of time and effort into programming, but in my opinion, it still comes down to people.

I'm about 2 months into my tenure as a Lions Den Leader. We just had our first Den meeting on Tuesday. Most Scouts in our Pack are from the same elementary school. The school allows us to hold our monthly Pack meeting in the school cafeteria, but has limited meeting time / space for other groups. Fortunately, I was able to reserve a community room at our public library for Den meetings. This turned out to be a stroke of good luck because parents told me they liked having the opportunity to let their kids check out books before or after the meeting. Some families let older siblings tag along and browse the stacks while the Lion Scout and parent participated in the Den meeting. I was just desperate to find a reliable and convenient meeting location, but may have stumbled upon a winner. The theme of our first meeting was "Meet the Lions." We spent 10 minutes discussing the Scout Oath and Law so the Scouts could complete the "Lion's Honor" adventure and earn their first belt loop. The rest of the meeting was spent decorating their own poster board with drawings of 1) their hobbies and interests, 2) their families, and 3) what the hoped to do in Scouting this year. Afterwards, they had an opportunity to share their poster with the Den. I thought this went well. They seemed engaged and never got too silly. There was good interaction between Scouts and parents. Plus, all of the boys were brave enough to stand up in front of the group and talk about their posters. Interesting take-away: 4 of the 5 Scouts drew something camping-related for what they hoped to do in Scouting this year. The 5th Scout (mine) drew a bunch of badges because he's really excited to earn awards this year. I don't think this is due to a narcissistic high need for achievement, but rather a Minions short film where the Minions join the "Badger Scouts" and try to earn merit badges. Here's my dilemma: I've got 5 brand new scouts who want to get outdoors, but winter can be unforgiving in our region and it won't be reliably nice out again until May. I think I'll bring a small tent to our next Den meeting and challenge the boys to put it together as a gathering activity (just to give them a taste of the outdoors), but that may only satisfy them for another month.

Maybe it's just me, but as an adult, I'm not too keen on wearing medals. Save that type of acknowledgement for people who save lives. I'm still appreciative of recognition but would prefer a square knot and/or small desktop award. I do, however, share the OP's desire for consistency.

Thanks for making that commitment. You're probably the perfect person to provide continuity for your Troop, having already had the full experience with your oldest and another two in the pipeline. Good luck!