BetterWithCheddar

I could not agree more. I have yet to attend an overnight event with my 8-year-old Cub Scout. I don't think we'll attend our council's 3-day summer Cub camp either. The thought of being saddled with someone else's kids is overwhelming to me. I struggle to maintain order at Den meetings. 10% of the boys cause 90% of the problems and I don't want to be there when something really bad happens. For my son to get the most out of the program, I know I'll need to take a different approach when he joins a Scout Troop, but as of now - it's not worth the trouble IMHO. I really hate to admit it, but it's true.

Thanks to all who have provided feedback and support over the past 2.5 years as I've returned to Scouting as my son's Den Leader. I really enjoy the comradery of this message board. Happy Thanksgiving!

The fact that there is virtually no recourse for a falsely accused Scouter contributes to the BSA's current doom loop. A person could: A: Accept the conclusions, resign, and hope that's the end of it (it might not be). B: Appeal to the BSA's kangaroo court to clear their good name (with limited success and all while calling more attention to the situation). C; Mount a vigorous (and expensive) legal defense with a slightly higher probability of success (again, while calling more attention to the situation). I'm glad to be a leader as long as my son and his friends are having fun; however, once he's done, I can't see myself continuing to support the program in any way that involves direct contact with youth. For every bad actor, there is probably an equal number of awful families who wouldn't hesitate to jeopardize a volunteer's reputation over a perceived slight. Granted, I believe the vast majority of people in this world are good and decent ... but it only takes one.

This was my first thought. My wife and I see a local attorney every few years to revise our will and POA docs. We do OK professionally, but I'm not sure how many couples our age (~40) could afford basic legal services, much less be able to vigorously defend their reputations in court. A prominent venture capitalist once remarked (I'm paraphrasing): "Single digit millionaires don't have access to the legal system." He funded Hulk Hogan's successful civil suit against a tabloid magazine because he and Hulk Hogan (a single digit millionaire) shared a common enemy in the tabloid. Hulk Hogan, whose net worth had been reduced to "only" a few million after a divorce and other legal issues, could not afford to sue a tabloid without the backing of a billionaire who also had an axe to grind against the same tabloid. Good luck, Mr. Falsely-Accused Scouter.

Although I was a Boy Scout myself, my son is still in Cubs and my perspective these days is more from a Cub parent. We're fortunate to have a good group of parents running our Pack; however, there are many instances where I would go about things differently than other leaders (but settle for good enough). I understand the calculus changes a bit with Scout Troops. For now, the work is getting done and the kids are having fun, getting outside, exercising, socializing, etc. I'm not going nitpick my fellow volunteers. I'm just thankful for the support we do receive.

Respectfully, I feel like that enough parents with average skills could still put on a good program. The biggest problems occur when a small number of average leaders are over-burdened by a high number of drop-off parents and/or poorly behaved kids. I would settle for a culture of Very Good. If you have enough leaders/parents willing to take kids outside or plan a fun unit meeting, there is a good chance that your program can be sustained.

This definitely ranks up there with the top problems, but what are you doing to do? As much as we claim Scouting is a youth-driven program, we all know it's parent-driven. A program is only going to go as far as volunteers are willing to take it. As a Den Leader, I spend lots of invisible hours and dollars (my own money) to help the Pack. And I'm just one guy - we're fortunate to have a good group of parents that help with our program (but it can be exhausting). One of the reasons why travel sports have grown in popularity vs. Scouting is that they are less work for most parents. Sure, they cost 4x as much as Scouting, but I get to just show up and be a dad.

Since this is a Catholic-specific thread, I think it's important to also acknowledge that participation in organized religion has also decreased during the same time period. The number of self-identifying Catholic adults peaked in the US around 2005 at ~81 million. While there has not been a steep decline (there were still ~73 million self-identifying Catholic adults in 2023), church membership has not kept pace with population growth. Since churches have historically been big supporters of Scouting, this may help explain a portion of the membership decline. Fewer families going to church ---> Fewer kids in Scouting Faith Survey | American Catholic Statistics (1965-2021)

My district held its annual Fall Cub Day Camp yesterday. We're fortunate to have a great group of volunteers that put this event together every year. Best I can tell, it's staffed mostly by older adults whose children have long since aged out of the program and whose ties to local units have dissolved. We're also fortunate to have a DE that was an Eagle Scout in this same district and who makes everyone feel like the most important volunteer in the council, even though he himself is the one working long, odd hours for what I'm sure amounts to ~$15/hour. The Fall day camp is a great way to get Cubs outside before the crummy winter weather in our region limits our options. I was even able to piggy-back our monthly Wolf Den meeting onto the event and complete an Orienteering Adventure. The only downside: several activity stations were closed on short notice due to what our DE cited as "recent changes to the national guidelines for the operations of range and target activities." I'm not too familiar with the G2SS, but we were unable to have archery, slingshots, or paper rockets ~ all of which had been offered in previous years and were popular among Cubs and parents. This will hardly be a surprise to many forum members, but it feels like the national organization is making Scouting marginally safer at great expense to the program. Honestly, I was more concerned about someone catching a hook in the eye at the fishing station yesterday than I would have been about launching a homemade paper rocket using an air compressor operated by an adult.

I don't disagree, but most kids get 40+ hours of mixed gender interaction each week through school. I'm not sure a 1-hour, single-gender Scout meeting each week leads to unacceptable social norms. In fact, I think it may be complimentary in that it gives them a reprieve from constant social pressures. I'm not looking to re-hash old arguments. I've been generally supportive of the membership changes from the past decade. Coed Scouting works fine for Cubs and the Senior Scout programs; however, we're denying kids a development opportunity if we don't at least offer them the OPTION of single-gender Scout Troops. Middle school is rough.

My son's Pack held its first Pack Meeting on Tuesday. Officially, we had a kick-off and informational meeting in September, but this was the first one with a true program. We elected to cover the Bobcat Adventure in its entirety since it's required for all grades. In hindsight, this was a terrible idea. It felt like night school. To compound the issue, we had two failing Packs rolled into our own healthy Pack - this brought our total Scout Count from 45 to 85 and our leader count from 8 to 9. My son's Wolf den, which had averaged 6-7 kids during Lions and Tigers, now stands at 20. Mercifully, one of the new parents offered to assist in an unofficial capacity.

Scouts: "We promote conservation." Also Scouts: 'If we sell this camp, we can put in new toilets at our other camp!"

"Cub Scout Pack" vs. "Scout Troop" is the cleanest delineator today, IMHO. When I'm talking with the Cubs, I may say something like "When you're a little older and join a Scout Troop, ..." I'll often refer to the BSA/SA as the "national organization."

Thanks, but I'm not sure that really helps. The BSA moniker is no more, yet we still brand our flagship program as "Scouts BSA?" (never mind the fact that "Scouts BSA" wasn't a particularly strong re-brand to begin with).

In defense of those parents, I don't think the BSA (SA?) has done a particularly good job of branding itself in the public sphere, considering those of us closer to the program still struggle. I still do not know how to refer to the classic Scouting program formerly for boys ages 11-18. We used to distinguish between "Cub Scouts" and "Boy Scouts." Then it was "Cub Scouts" and "Scouts BSA." Now, I guess it would be "Cub Scouts" and just "Scouts?" That's confusing because Cub Scouts are also Scouts, are they not?