Cambridgeskip

In fairness to those who make the rules on your side of the Atlantic I guess it may be worth bearing in mind that we are talking about entirely different territories here. If we put the Scottish Highlands aside for a moment (which is serious wilderness!) the UK doesn't have anything in the way of back country like you have. I think our population density is something like 10 times yours. Here in the south east of England in particular you would struggle to go more than a couple of miles in any directions without coming into a town or village or hitting a significant road and that's without even counting farms and little hamlets. It's not quite as densely populated elsewhere but still nothing like the huge tracts of nothing that you have. Similarly we have no serious wildlife. There are no bears or wolves or properly poisonous snakes (we have adders but no one has died since the 1970s and that was an allergic reaction!) to worry about. The only wildlife advice we have to give is don't provoke wasps or hornets! That's not to say that we don't have difficult terrain. The Brecon beacons where the original incident above happened is notorious for changeable weather. The tallest hill there Pen-Y-Fan is used as a test to get into UK Special Forces. Run up and over it in full kit in a stupidly short time. They call it The Fan Dance! There's also The Peak District, Lake District, Snowdonia and others. Even on these though you would normally only be a few miles from a road or farm or village at any one time. But wild country makes up the minority of the country. Most of it is terrain where you would actually find it quite difficult to get lost! So I guess it's just easier for us to do it. The Scottish Highlands, particularly in winter but also potentially at any time of year, is a whole different level and it is pretty rare for groups of under18s to be let loose there without adults.

I don't think its a case of too much or too little technology, it's all about the right technology for what you're doing. If you are going geocaching then GPS is the appropriate technology. If you are going on a wilderness trek with nowhere to recharge anything and want minimum weight then a compass is the right technology. Smart phone v book - I think it's personal preference. Yes it's a good idea to know the knots you need but at the end of the day you have to learn them from somewhere in the first place, and why does it matter which you use? I think there is often a tendancy for scouting circles to turn away from technology when it actual fact we should be embracing it. In embracing it though we should also be acknolwedging and training our scouts in its limitations (weight, battery life, reception etc) and also training them in appropriate use in terms of courtersy. I am quite happy for my scouts to have phones with them on camp and indeed on a normal scout night. They know though that I insist upon them being used only in appropriate circumstances.

Ah the memories! I did once have a group of scouts doing their expedition challenge in Epping Forest phone me to tell me "we think the map is wrong". *facepalm*

Most explorer scout units (14-18 year olds) use DoE as part of their program. While the scheme is a non scouting award scheme it is recognised by the UK Scout Association. It can be worn on uniform and DoE Gold ticks of 6 of the 8 parts of the Queens Scout Award (broadly our equivalent of Eagle Scout) In terms of adults being involved it's a case of yes, no, maybe! Our program allows scouts and explorers to camp and hike unaccompanied. For camps it's called a "Nights Away Passport". I am not completely familiar with the requirements for mountainous areas, given that I don't have the right bits of paper to take scouts there myself I've never had cause to look at the requirements for whether I can sign them off to go on their own myself.

Thankfully the weather mostly cleared up. Short rain shower at the start but it stopped within half an hour. Over all a fantastic night. The scouts really pushed themselves and some found it quite hard. Not surprising given the distance! It was an incredibly heart warming sense of team spirit that kept them all going, especially two that were clearly limping in the last mile. They were determined not to let their mates down! This is a photo of those that crashed over in our HQ afterwards. The leaders did our annual ritual of serving them breakfast in bed, bacon sandwiches all round Thanks again to those kind enough to sponsor us, massively appreciated! It;s 9pm here and after the two hours sleep I got last night I am now hitting the hay. Good night all.....

Just over 3 hours till we start. This is what the weather is doing. In summer. https://twitter.com/debbiekaye/status/746748627213783040

Thanks Rick, very kind of you

Seeing as this is tomorrow night I thought I'd swing by and send it back to the top. Weather forecast is for heavy showers dying out as the night goes on.

Tedious means dull and repetitive! Your description of your summer camps as a kid sounds bit more like it. One of the best badge sessions we ran was when we had a student leader who was studying mechanical engineering. He had a second hand car that was so old and broken down that it was only being held together by the rust! He drove it to camp and let 4 of the scouts loose on it to do their mechanics badge. They loved it and finished covered in grease and oil. It was great!

A teenager memory..... As a venture scout I did a winter skills mountaineering course in Scotland. The accommodation was cabins with about 10-12 Venture Scouts per cabin, pretty cramped in. At the end of the course we did a 3 day/2night high camp above the snow line. Virtually everyone put on a thermal base layer the morning of day 1 and didn't take it off until late afternoon on day 3 when we got back to the cabins. 10 boys aged around 16. In one small room. Wearing clothes they hadn't changed for 3 days which they had done strenuous exercise in. The smell was extraordinary! We all ended up putting our thermals in a bin bag and dumping the bag outside.

the way you describe it certainly makes it sound a bit tedious! The High Adventure camps sound more fun though. As a troop we typically schedule some time where we run a selection of activity badges for the scouts that's typically half a day of the week. I think we're farely typical. We also try o have a day or two off site somewhere and give the scouts plenty of free time to do their own thing. Last year was particularly good in that respect. They spent a lot of time getting to know a group of scouts from a particularly tough bit of East London. Bit of an eye opener for my quite sheltered middle class lot.

Can't you go to one of these camps and simply self program?

We've got a public "Like" page and a closed group for parents and leaders only. The purpose of the like page is to simply be a public presence on Facebook page. It's a way of posting links to new material on the website, an occasionally photo posted from camp. We don't put too much on it, just a steady trickle to make sure we are there. The group is to really provide a forum for parents. Most importantly to help them arrange lift rotas to camps and the like. If we arrange the lift shares we have to put the parents in question through a criminal records check. A massive hastle. The closed group allows them to do it without our intervention. Most information still goes out by email or is posted on the main website.

I think you may be in danger of throwing the baby out with the bath water. Quite right from everything I've heard about what happened with you chaps in the 1970s it was a disaster. That doesn't mean that change, the right change, can't turn things around. True you don't want to go changing the core part of scouting. The patrol system, the outdoors etc. At the end of the day kids join up to do stuff outdoors with their friends. Start messing with that and you get into trouble. It's the stuff around the edges. Does the uniform need changing? Do you need different badges? Does the scout/venture scout age cut off need to change? How well does the PR machine work, nationally and locally?. I suspect that the 2019 world jamboree will do you the world of good. We had a massive spike in growth following the 2007 jamboree. One of my ASLs (what you call an ASM) has just turned 73. He's been with us since he was an 8 year old cub. Fascinating man to talk to. He's firmly of the opinion that kids themselves haven't changed since he was there age, what has changed is the choices they have. He joined cubs and then scouts because, frankly, there was nothing else to do when he was that age. Now the choices are huge, every sport you can imagine, every music or theater group you can think of, other youth groups. Whether you like it or not the scout movement in the western world now exists in a market place that wasn't there 50 years ago and was a hell of a lot less competitive even 25 years ago. I think BSA ignores that at it's peril.

Your nephew doesn't sound that unlike me as a kid. Introverted, bit of a temper, recharged by being alone. Scout camps though did me the world of good. It's where I developed my own self confidence and identity. Regardless of what badges or skills etc he may or may not learn or gain he will still get a lot out of being away from home with his fends for a week. It's where the bonds form and the memories are made. He should go for it!

Reading what he has to say and seeing the comments on the link I think a lot of people have missed the point of what he's saying. There's a lot of focus by commentators on the girls and God side of things. While they may be something under consideration I'm reading him as saying potential changes could go way beyond that and he's looking at a root and branch change of the whole thing. Him not having a scouting background is not necessarily a bad thing. Sometimes it takes a fresh pair of eyes to see what needs to change. You could be in for an interesting and hopefully successful ride over the next few years!

You're very welcome! (ditto the other thanks above) I should say though that most of the organising was done by GSUSA at RAF Alconbury. We just turned up and provided some labour! I have a feeling that with Alconbury due to close in the next few years we may be being lined up to take over from them on this as it's a regular slot that they have each year.

Our award scheme had a bit of a shake up last year and one of the trickier bits added to the Creative Challenge award was "show how to use social media in a safe and creative way". Doing that for the whole troop sounded a bit tricky till the PLs came up with the idea of producing training films for our new scouts on various useful things. It has proved quite fun! The first three (putting up a tent, lighting a fire, remembering the Scout Promise) are now ready and on our website here. They are not quite Steven Spielberg yet but given that other than a bit of assistance on editing from yours truly they were produced 100% by the kids themselves I am quite pleased with them. Just thought I'd show them off a bit here! They are planning future productions on packing a rucksack, putting up our heavy weight tents, using the various gas stoves we have plus we've got loads of material for a bloopers reel at some point.

Wasn't allowed to post this till now... we got involved in with your memorial day this year. There are American Girl Scout at the air base at Alconbury and each year they clean up headstones at the American military cemetery just outside Cambridge in advance of Memorial Day. This year we got asked if we would help them out. Photos here. We weren't allowed to put anything up until now as the local TV news came down to film it and asked us to embago photos until the piece had gone out!

This thread is quite fascinating to see how other countries do it. Although not completely unheard of it's pretty unusual to have any camps included in what we would call "subs". They typically cover everything that goes on at regular weekly meetings plus maintenance of buildings or rent for this using church halls or school halls. It also normally covers what we call capitation and what you call registration each year. For my group that means £90 a year paid per academic term £30 each. Camps are normally paid for separately. My group receives all money for subs, camps or anything else that might need paying for by direct debit (ie bank transfer) which is arranged when they sign up for anything which is all done online. Saves a lot of time when you don't have to go to the bank! Our fund raising is typically either used for capital expenditure (tents etc) or to subsidise major camps.

Worth remembering that the Chief Scout position Bear occupies is a figure head one. He acts mostly as a chief ambassador for TSA and has more or less no input into any decision making process. The equivalent position to Robert Gates is split between the UK Chief Commissioner (Wayne Bullpit) which is a uniformed volunteer role and The Chief Exec (Matt Hyde) which is a full time paid non uniformed role. It is the two of them who do the most to run the organisation. Bear's job is to look good in front of the cameras!

A coupl of years ago I had a pair of sisters who were English-French bilingual but who spoke French at home. If things ever got heated between them they would slip into French. It wasn't deliberate, they didn't even realise they'd switched languages! To this day I have no idea what they were calling each other, my French is terrible..... One them is now a YL with scouts and the other with our beavers so hey both turned out OK

I think it's all about context. Swearing around or to a young person is not on. That said.... I remember helping some cubs put a tent on. I managed to hit my thumb with a mallet. Fact is that some Anglo Saxon slipped out my mouth. I'm sure most of us have been there. I also remember coming back from camp completely exhausted and finding our HQ had been burgled and thoroughly trashed from end to end. On that occasion I took a walk across the field out of ear shot while some robust language passed my lips. I'm sure we've all been there. So basically no it's not acceptable but neither would I hang someone out to dry who has been a bit snappy on a one off occasion when roundly provoked!

Durham is lovely and it was perfect for me aged 18. I'd also applied to Manchester, Nottingham and Sheffield. Looking back if I'd gone to one of those big city universities I would have sunk like a stone.

Sounds like a tasteless joke. If seen in the act best dealt with by a quizzical raise of the eyebrows. If found out about later a quiet word in his ear along the lines of "don't do that again sunshine". No great panic.