CalicoPenn

I'm not sure there can be just one ultimate question. The question would be different depending on the audience (the person being asked the question). For instance, to a youth member, the question might be "Why are you a Scout". For an adult unit level leader, I might ask "How are you making a difference in the lives of your Scouts". For an adult District or Council level leader, I might ask "What satisfaction do you get from volunteering at the District (Council) level". For community members at large, I might ask "What do you know about the Boy Scouts of America" For a non-member youth, I might ask "Why aren't you a Scout". Or perhaps I might consider there to be one ultimate question - to be asked of anyone - Scout, Scouter and Non-Scout alike: "If there was one thing you could change about Boy Scouts, what would it be?" Calico

The Eagle Courts of Honor that have stuck in my memory have been outdoor COH's. The usual scripted ceremonies can be adapted to the outdoors in many ways. Instead of lighting candles, light torches. Is your son active (and I mean attends chapter meetings, help with ceremonies and elections active) in the Order of the Arrow? One young man I know arranged to have some friends from his chapter ceremonies team wear the typical guide outfits for our area (shirt, breechclout, leggings, roach, mocassins and minimal face paint, and carrying lit torches) and act as escorts for the speakers, parents and the Eagle himself. I was at one COH, held at the location of the project, where the new Eagle Scout, whose project was to clear and replant a section of a hurricane damaged wood lot belonging to an organization that helped battered women, handed a sapling to each person attending and directed them to a pre-dug hole where the person was to plant the sapling (which really demonstrated his committment to continuing a life of service - the last time I spoke with him, he was joining the Peace Corps - it's been a long time since I've heard from him). Campfires are just about a must at an outdoor COH. One COH Ceremony was timed to end just about when the cobblers were ready to come off the fire. Be creative, and go ahead and have an outdoor COH. BTW - the pledges and affirmations are not required for anything, though many people like them. If you don't like one (or any) of them, you don't have to have one. At my ceremony, we didn't do an opening or closing prayer or benediction. Heck, you don't even have to have a ceremony at all if you don't want one (though its nice to do). And yes, your son can start wearing his Eagle Badge the moment the sign off is completed at National. He doesn't have to wait until a COH to receive the badge. National should approve it long before June and he can wear it on his uniform (if Staff is allowed to wear rank badges) at the camp. One last thing - Congratulations to your son, and to you! Calico

7 leaders couldn't handle 19 members (assuming 2 of the 9 leaders were dealing with 1 injured member). I can envision a few different reasons why your group couldn't gain and keep control. The first is that there is no one "supreme" adult leader that the other adult leaders defer to in times of crisis, either that, or s/he was dealing with the injured member rather than delegating that task to someone else and taking charge of the main body of the group. In time of crisis, there should be one person who is in overall charge and everyone else defers to that person - or in the case of Scouting - 2 people - one adult, and one youth, though that youth member still defers to the adult - and those are the Scoutmaster and the Senior Patrol Leader. The ASM's and other adults follow the directions of the Scoutmaster, and the SPL relays the directions of the Scoutmaster to the PL's and gets the unit organized - there is no real reason for an ASM to start hollering commands to a group of Patrol Leaders - even in an emergency, the PLC is still the proper chain of command to go through - the difference now is the Scoutmaster now steps into his rarely used role of being the "ultimate, buck stops here, I'm making the final decision, let's get to it" role. While there is a natural reaction to being "lookie-lou's" at accidents, it can be overcome quickly with decisive, and coordinated action by the leaders. Another reason the leaders may have lost control is that the leaders lost control of themselves. By this I mean that instead of acting in a calm, cool and collected manner, they went into panic mode. I don't know your situation so can't say that this was the problem - just tossing it out there as something to watch for. When the leaders panic, the youth will panic, and it will take some time before a panicking youth can come under control again, if they're dealing with an adult leader they just saw panic themselves. Another possible way for the adult leaders to lose control of themselves is if they go into screaming mode to get the youth's attention. Once that has happened, youth tend to be impossible to really properly control - they've seen the screaming, and they laugh at it. What is needed is leaders to take control in a calm, and authoritative manner - that doesn't mean yelling, it means making a declarative statement with an expectation in one's voice that it will be done, there will be no questions, and there will be consequences (unspoken) if the directions are not followed. It souldn't be a "You Will" statement, either, but an "I Need You To" statement, such as "I need all of you to follow Ms. Smith and Ms. Jones to the other room, right now." No please, no thank you, no begging - just a factual statement of your expectations. The time for thank you is later when the situation has calmed down and you can take a few moments to tell everyone that Mary or Bobbie will be ok, and to thank them for being cooperative. Once it got beyond control, though - it's just about over. The solution then is to drop your planned program, contain their rambuctiousness as best as you can to a small area, and have as many of the other leaders as you can start making calls to their parents to come pick up their chldren - just tell the parents that there was an accident with one of the other children, that person is fine, but the meeting is cancelled for the rest of the night. Just my two cents. Calico

BSA advancement policy is clear - Parents, if they are a registered merit badge counselor, are allowed to counsel their own children in the merit badges they are registered counselors for. BSA policy is also clear that Councils and Units can not add to, subtract from, or change any National BSA advancement policy (or any other National BSA policy for that matter). National Policies are not optional. A Council or Unit doesn't get to decide that the National G2SS policy on firearms isn't realistic so it can be tweaked. The same is true in this situation. The procedure for earning a Merit Badge does not include getting a Scoutmasters approval for a Scout to work on a badge, or for a Scoutmasters approval of a Merit Badge Counselor. The Scoutmaster signs the "blue card" as an acknowledgement that s/he is aware that the Scout is working on a specific merit badge. The Scoutmaster provides a list of merit badge counselors for a merit badge that the Scout chooses from - the Scoutmaster can steer a Scout towards one counselor or another, but can't outright ban a Scout from using any particular counselor. If the Unit's "bylaws" are in opposition to BSA Policy, then BSA Policy wins. Calico

This comes right from the horses mouth (so to speak) - National's own website: Be a boy who is 11 years old, OR one who has completed the fifth grade OR earned the Arrow of Light Award and is at least 10 years old, but is not yet 18 years old. (emphasis on the Or's are mine). In your situation, the key OR is "earned the Arrow of Light Award AND is at least 10 years old" Note that it says "at least 10 years old". Not 10 1/2, not 10 and 4 months, not 10 and 2/3. It says clearly "10 years old". So, if at any time you have a 10 year old that has earned the Arrow of Light, he is eligible to join a Boy Scout Troop immediately - with no waiting period. (If he is 9 and has earned the AOL, he will have to wait for his 10th birthday, or will have had to complete the 5th grade - rare, but could happen if he was skipped up a grade). At anytime after a boy's 10th birthday (it can even be on his birthday, or the day after), if he has already been awarded his AOL, he is eligible to join a Boy Scout Troop. So if they are 10 and have earned the AOL, and you're worried about losing them if they have to wait, go ahead and bring them over - you don't even have to do a crossover ceremony (its a nice thing to do, but its not a requirement, and it looks as if you experienced the loss of eligible boys before just because the pack and troop couldn't get a crossover ceremony together - don't let the ceremony stand in the way). If ScoutNet won't accept the registration of a 10-year old who has earned the AOL, you'll have to figure out a way to override Scoutnet - or just turn the registrations in by hand to the Council Service Center and let the figure it out. If they have all reached the 10th birthday and have AOL this fall - bring em on over! Calico

In this day and age, a stranger shouldn't be calling a former Scout, or his parents, to ask questions of/about the Scout. It might be nice to think that it couldn't do any harm, but in an era where parenting by helicoptering is common, its just not worth the risk of having an irate parent call the police. If, while going through the recharter process, the unit can fill out the "lost boy" report with information they may already know, then perhaps we can remember that a Scout is Courteous and we fill that out. If we can't fill it out completely, then perhaps we should remember that a Scout is Courteous and that a Scout does one's best, and we don't make an issue out of it not being fully filled out. Calico

The answer to the question of whether a service project counts if it benefits the BSA at SC, Star and Life is in the requirement. The requirement simply says that one must "take part in service projects totaling at least (1 or 6 depending on rank) hours of work. These projects must be approved by your Scoutmaster." Note that the requirement does not use the word Community nor does it include any restrictions as to whom can benefit as the Eagle project requirement does (which specifically states School, Church or Community). The answer then is Yes - a service project done at a Boy Scout camp can be used for service project hours for the SC, Star and Life ranks. By the same token, service project hours can be met if the Scout works on another Scout's Eagle project. However, there is an important caveat and that is as long as the Scoutmaster approves. That's the second part of the requirement - and it gives the Scoutmaster a bit of discretion here. It doesn't add or subtract from the requirement is the Scoutmaster's preference is not to approve service projects that benefit a Boy Scout facility or helps with an Eagle project. No matter what, though - the Troop should be providing plenty of opportunities for Scouts to earn service hours. Most Troops I know will build in at least one hour of service when they go camping at a state or county park. Cleaning up one's own campsite shouldn't be a service project but gathering everyone for a one hour clean sweep of the playground/picnic areas sure could. A lot of folks operating the state parks can probably come up with a 1 hour project for a group of Scouts right off the top of their head. Joe - I've got really mixed feelings about your situation. On the one hand, being an altar boy, cantor and helping out at Sunday School really does provide a great service. On the other hand, I tend to view service projects for ranks to be above and beyond that which is already being volunteered. However, that's just a personal opinion. I would have more trouble with counting service hours for altar boy and cantor than for helping out in Sunday School regardless. (I think I would tell the lad I'll count the service hours for Sunday School for only one of the ranks). For the Altar Boy and Cantor jobs, I would have to sit down with the Scout and ask him why he took on those positions in his church. I expect that 9 out of 10 times the answer would be because he wanted to grow more spiritually. I'd then try to lead into a discussion of whether he felt that being rewarded with credit for BSA rank service hours (material gain) fit in with the notion of gaining spiritual growth, then let his answers guide my decision. Calico

Ah yes, the month of November in Maine, where fall color season made the miraculous leap from Trees to Man, and Blaze Orange was the predominant color in school, work, city, town, village, field and woods. My dog had her own orange vest, which she wore everywhere in November, even if it was just in the yard. I swear I saw maples weeping with jealousy at the amazing transformation of cows and horses from browns and white to orange, then back again in December. Memories......sigh. Calico

People will sell anything because people will buy anything with the right marketing spin. Why, just recently, someone bought a corn flake in the shape of Illinois (or so it was claimed) for $1,300! I must have eaten 100's of corn flakes in the shape of Illinois in my lifetime. Now I'm off to search through my box of Cheerios. If someone can get $1,300 for a corn flake in the shape of Illinois, imagine what someone might pay for a Cheerio in the shape of a Donut! Calico

The Spanish Inquisition if done by the Church of England: "Piece of Cake or Death" "Cake, Please" "Very well - give him a piece of cake" "Piece of Cake or Death" "Cake, Please" "Very well - give him cake" "Piece of Cake or Death" "Death, Please" "Ah Hah! You chose Death!" "Wait - I meant Cake" "But you said Death" "But I really meant Cake" "Oh, okay - give him some cake" Calico

For me it's the Trained patch under their badge of office. Calico

Pre-emptive apologies to SSScout. As I re-read my post, I realized that the first paragraph came out a bit snarkier than I intended. Mea Culpa. My point in that was that I'm not sure what enforcement mechanism would be to ensure compliance, and I'm afraid the only things that would ensure compliance are rather punitive, and would be a big turn-off for parents, leaders, and sponsors alike. Calico

And if a unit doesn't reach it's goal, then what? Send them to bed without desert? Not allow them to participate in any of the council's reindeer games? Oh, I know - don't recharter the unit at rechartering time - that'll show those units that failed to reach their goals. While the idea may sound good on paper, in practice, I think it would be a very big mistake for the BSA to become a "pay to play" organization. Think membership numbers are too low now? Wait until a policy like this is implemented. May as well just raise dues to whatever the apportioned amount per boy and adult leader would be - it's essentially the same thing. Calico Part

I saw one of these set up at the local REI store (I'm fortunate to live in an area with a couple of them around). Its got a rather odd pole arrangement - only one pole runs from corner to corner - the other corner to corner pole has been reconfigured to be 2 half poles (or slightly more than half poles). Instead of both ends terminating at a grommet in the ground, the "half" poles terminate at one end in a grommet over the door (as the 1/4 dome has a door on both sides, there are thus 2 "half" poles). It sure does increase head/ceiling room in the center of the tent. The wonders to tension. I'm pretty impressed with this tent, though I'll carry the extra 3 pounds for the half dome - just because I like the room. Calico

Wild, You may still be pretty new to the exploration of the outdoors, but I'd take you on a trip with me anytime. You seem to have a natural affinity for the outdoors and an attunement with your surroundings that most Boy Scouts and Scouters take a long time to get - if they ever do. Sounds to me like your senses were working just right, and your actions were perfect. Given your tale, I would concur that there was something in the woods that day, and that you were being "stalked" or followed. That a big cat was found in those woods two days later gives credence to the thought that it was likely the presence of the cat that you sensed. If so, then your flight or fight response worked very well - had you started running, and it was a big cat, you would have been in much greater danger of being attacked - running from a cat, even if you don't see the cat, is considered a weakness to be exploited by these predators (most tales of attacks by cats on people involve people jogging through the woods - it isn't that the people are fleeing, its that the running movement is interpreted by the cats as a weakness - it's a really unfortunate coincidence). Moving at a consistent pace as you did, if being followed by a cat, may make the cat curious, but tends to also make them wary as it shows confidence and strength - they continue to watch to look for weakness, but if they don't see it, they won't risk an attack on something that might be a threat to them, especially something as large as a human, (who can look like a bear walkiing on two legs). Crossing the creek crossed a boundary that the cat didn't want to cross. Of course, its also possible it wasn't a cat (I'd guess it was most likely, given the facts that came out later). It could have been Coyote, or Bear or the most dangerous predator of all - Man. It's no real secret how you got this woods instinct. You walked these woods on an almost daily basis - you know the woods, you know the moods - I think that 90% of instinct is just the application of knowledge and experience. The real test is can you transfer your outdoor instincts from your familiar woods to other places - not just in Georgia, but in other states too. I'm thinking the answer, in your case, is going to be Yes. Calico

If I'm not mistaken, you are a college student. I'd check with the college to see if it is offering any first aid courses. Some colleges offer the Standard First Aid/CPR course with the WFA certs at the same time - if that's available to you, then that's what I would do. If not, you'll have to start with the Standard First Aid/CPR course first as its a prerequisite for Wilderness First Aid courses. I'm always a little wary when I hear that it's "State Law" that requires people not do give any care. That seems to be pretty unlikely. What is more likely is that it is the policy of the bus company, or a school district, or an employer, hiding behind the phrase "state law". Most states, if not all of them, have pretty good laws protecting "good samaritans" so I seriously doubt that a state would have a law that says a bus driver couldn't perform first aid on an injured student while waiting for an ambulance to arrive - especially in rural areas where an ambulance may be 10 minutes or more from the scene of an accident, its doubtful a state would prefer that bus drivers stand by while an injured student "bleeds out". A lot of company's seem to make up a "state law" when it serves their purpose of scaring their employees into a specific action (or lack of action) when there are risk management (insurance/liability) issues at stake. In the case of the camp, it probably has specific written protocols on how to handle injuries, and specific personnel to handle injuries. If help is minutes away (and in most camp situtations, it is (not all - but most), then its easier for the camp to say wait for a designated person to show up than to try to tell you how far you can treat. There is nothing harder to try to explain to an injured person why you're removing a splint or bandage that someone just put on - and an EMT/Paramedic arriving on scene is pretty much going to be required to remove said splint/bandage to do a proper assessment of injury. These kinds of policies in camps and schools exist for reasons like this. Calico Calico

If I'm not mistaken, the knot for the Arrow of Light is not a restricted badge, meaning you should be able to buy as many as you want without having to tell the Scout Shop folks who is getting them. Just go ahead and purchase the knots (if the Scout Shop folks are being Nosy Neddies, tell them its for multiple uniforms) and give them to the folks who earned the Webelos Award from 1941 to 1967 (which is the equivalent of the Arrow of Light). Calico

I've posited this before, I suspect that the Cradle of Liberty Council is really just giving token opposition to this whole issue. They are stuck in a "in perpetuity" Lease that they can't break without incurring major expenses to break - and now have an opportunity to get out of what has become an albatross hanging around its neck without incurring any costs, and with artful manipulation of the conservative right wing, a means to raise a few bucks in the process. From what we know from CoL posters in the forum, most of the operations of the Council are being performed out of a modern building in Vally Forge. CoL doesn't need this building in Philadelphia. It appears the only people that need this building are right wing agitators from outside the city - its become their cause celebre. Is it surprising that only two people in Pennsylvania have signed on? Not to me, as I suspect the real Scouters in Philadelphia understand the back stories and have heard from their Council that this is not actually a bad thing. Calico

Only one thing could be more endearing - hijacking a mea culpa thread to try to get the process to repeat itself as a way of saying "We understand, and Don't Sweat It". Sooooo with that in mind... Five-hundred Twenty-five Thousand Six Hundred Minutes Five-hundred Twenty-five Thousand Moments So Dear Five-hundred Twenty-five Thousand Six Hundred Minutes How Do You Measure A Year In Daylights, In Sunsets In Midnights, In Cups of Coffee In Inches, In Miles In Laughter, In Strife Five-hundred Twenty-five Thousand Six Hundred Minutes How Do You Measure A Year In The Life Calico

I agree with Trevorum and Packsaddle - it should really be a question about Reverence, and about Duty to God. OTOH - it depends, OGE, by what you mean by God. If the question about God is about a specific "God", then the answer is an unqualified absolutely not. If the question about God is about the BSA defined meaning of "God", which is all inclusive to mean any God, or some higher power (even if that higher power is, as has been suggested by a BSA Spokeperson as a possibilty, a rock), and it doesn't result in a negative impact on the lad, then I would say its a fair question to ask - though I would hope that it be worded in such a way as to talk about the concepts of Reverence and Duty to god. Calico

When you're a Jet You're a Jet all the way From your first cigarette to your last dying... Ummm, never mind - wrong musical Calico

The Appalachian Trail in Georgia is approximately 80 miles long, following a ridge of the Appalachians through the Chattahoochee National Forest. Most of the trail is at about 3,000 feet but can vary between 2,500 feet and 4,500 feet - with steep climbs and descents. To hike the AT through Georgia in 3 days means hiking a minimum of 27 miles per day - not as easy as it may sound on paper when factoring in all the climbs and descents along the ridge. The AT starts in Georgia on Springer Mountain. There is very limited auto access to Springer Mountain, so, before you even start the trail, you'll have to hike about 9 miles from Amicolola Falls State Park to get to the start of the AT. If you're lucky, you might be able to park at the US Forest Service parking area about 1 mile from the summit of Springer - if you're lucky. And if you feel secure doing so. There is no secret as to why there is a shelter about .2 miles from the start of the AT on Springer Mountain. Most hikers actually get to Springer Mountain at the start and spend their first night at the Springer Mountain Shelter. (Or their last night if coming from the North). The typical through hiker, starting at Springer, averages about 10 miles per day for the first couple of weeks (it takes most through hikers about 6 to 8 days to get to North Carolina from the start of the trail in Georgia) - they generally don't start hitting the 20+ mile days until they've been on the trail a while. And these are people who have been preparing and training for the hike for a minimum of a year before starting. Given the lack of experience backpacking in your group, don't even start thinking you can make 27 miles per day. A more realistic trip would be about 5 to 10 miles per day. You'll also need to either coordinate with someone to pick you up at the end of your trail and take you back to your cars at the beginning of the trail if you want to make it a linear hike. Now that I've completely discouraged you, let me suggest a possible 3-day trip in the Georgia portion of the AT that might work out - if you folks start doing some pre trip training now (that means day hikes with back packs of at least 5 miles, preferably 10). Day 1: Unicoi Gap (Mile 50.5) to Low Gap Shelter (Mile 41.1) - total mileage = 9.4. You'll go from 2,949 ft to 3,780 feet to 3,500 feet to 2,990 feet. Your ascent will be at the beginning of the day and you'll descend most of the rest of the day. Day 2: Low Gap (Mile 41.1) to Neels Gap (Mile 30.5) - total mileage 10.6 miles. Longest day of the trip and maybe the most challenging; From 2,990 feet you'll climb to 3,450 feet, descend to 3,360 feet then to 3,138 feet then climb again to 3,766 feet then descend to 3,125 feet. Neels Gap has a first come first served hostel. Day 3: (And the best part of the trip - and maybe even the best part of the AT in Georgia). Neels Gap (Mile 30.5) up Blood Mountain (at 4,461 feet, its the highest point of the AT in Georgia - Mile 28.1)descend to Bird Gap at Mile 26.9 (3,650 feet) then take the Freeman Trail bypass back around Blood Mountain to Flatrock Gap (1.8 miles) and then .6 miles to the Byron Reece Memorial for pickup. Total mileage = 6 miles. Sounds like an easy day, but the 1,336 feet climb up Blood Mountain, then the climb down, won't be as easy as it sounds wearing a 40+ pound pack after 3 days on the trail. Total trip mileage = about 26 miles. Remember, backpacking and day hiking are different animals. You may be able to day hike 10 miles in a day very easily, but backpacking adds other challenges. I'll let others speak of the food and water issues, etc. I will say this - don't count on using the shelters - bring tents. I also suggest you check out the website georgia-atclub.org for Georgia specific AT tips and hints. Let us know what you end up doing. Calico

"Honestly, have you ever known a man to intentionally buy uncomfortable shoes because they look good? I haven't." Then you never go to country/western bars in big cities up north where men show up wearing cowboy boots bought because they look really good and leave limping at the end of the night because the boots are just plain uncomfortable. I hiked the AT through Maine and New Hampshire, considered some of the roughest country of the AT by many, for 3 weeks one summer between the end of my summer job and the beginning of school wearing 6 month old Hi Tec Sierra Lites purchased for $39, that already had a number of mountain climbs on them before we started, including three hikes up Katahdin before the 4th hike up Katahdin to start the jaunt on the AT. Those boots held up just fine and lasted another 5 months before I had to buy a new pair (and only because one of the eyelets gave way). When I went to get new boots, I didn't even have to try any on - just told the guy I needed a pair of Hi Tec Sierra Lites, size 10 1/2. I wore my boots as my everyday footwear - so that 12 months of wear was wearing them all day every day. Its not the cost of the boots - Expensive boots can fail just as well and spectacularly as cheap boots. There are makers of inexpensive boots that still make quality boots. There are makers of expensive boots that make garbage. I do recommend getting "light weight" boots. When heading to Philmont, its time to set aside the Red Wings, or any other boot heavy on the leather, and go with the synthetics. 4 pounds of boot will feel like 30 pounds at the end of a long day. While I wouldn't do a mountain trail, no matter how well traveled and "packed down" with Chuck Taylors (they really have no traction), there would be nothing wrong with going with an ankle height boot that looks more like a trail running shoe. Calico

I'm not Ed, but I feel like adding my two cents. I agree with Trevorum. Scouting, in its G2SS, specifically states that all aspects of the Scouting program are open to observation by parents and leaders. Committee meetings are part of the Scouting program (it's a real stretch to argue that Boy Scout Troop Committee Meetings, which are only necessary because the BSA granted a charter for the BSA program to a chartering organization, isn't part of the Scouting program), and therefore are an aspect of the Scouting Program that is open to observation. As the G2SS states, there are no secret organizations in the BSA. Closing committee meetings to parents makes the Committee a "secret organization" - which is not allowed. There may be very rare times when a Committee may hold a portion of their meeting as a closed session to deal with some kind of disciplinary action (which really shouldn't be handled by the Committee anyway - that's something that really should be dealt with by the COR, CC and SM - all of whom may talk to individual members of the Committee separately and outside a meeting to solicit advice). While the purpose of the Committee is to support the "program" of the Unit (and don't confuse Unit program elements with the Scouting Program), the discussions in and the results of these meetings affect the boys in the Unit - and that alone should be enough to ensure that any parent, or any leader, may attend a Committee Meeting as an observer (not as a participant, but as an observer). Its not just about "child molestation" - its about maintaining and open atmosphere for parental comfort. Also, depending on your State, it may be illegal for a non-profit organization that does fund raising outside of simple membership dues to close their meetings, even their board meetings, to their members (not the public - their members). Executive Board meetings would be exempt because Executive Boards aren't generally allowed to make binding decisions on an organization affecting its membership, bylaws, hiring, firing, revenue and expenses, without gaining agreement by the full board at an open meeting (though a board can go into closed session in most states to discuss and make personnel decisions, though they have to announce that decision at an open board session). Executive Boards meet not to make decisions/policy, but to discuss strategies and recommendations they'll make to a full board. As for an SPL at a Committee Meeting - I'd think that would be a pretty rare event. The Scoutmaster is, indeed, the representative of the Scouts at the Committee Meeting - its part of his job. The SPL is busy enough running his own meetings - the PLC and the Troop Meetings - as well as making sure there is plenty of Leadership coverage at campouts and other outings, without having to worry about attending a Committee Meeting. Many Troops ask the SPL to appear briefly at one or two Committee Meetings per year - usually to talk about the results of a planning weekend, and perhaps to give a quick talk about some of the happenings with the Troop at Summer Camp. Calico

Welcome to the forum!! To start, you've already answered one question in your search for a sleeping bag. You chose a Mountain Hardwear Lamina because its the one your son was comfortable in and happy with after trying many out - that's 9/10ths of the decision right there. Mountain Hardwear products are very good. And the bag you're choosing isn't cheap. I'd suggest that you take into account your son's current age and expected growth over the next few years - in other words, though the short bag may fit him best now, you'll want to think about what might fit him best about 4 years down the road. There is no reason that this bag can't serve him well when he becomes an adult. And definitely stick with the synthetic insulation. In the US, sleeping bag ratings are not regulated as they are in France. In France, if the bag is rated to -10 degrees, it really is a -10 degree bag - and all manufacturers are required to use the exact same test to determine the rating. In the US, the ratings do vary by company, and the range can be as high as 15 degrees either way, mostly because there is no standardized test, but companies like North Face, Kelty, Mountain Hardwear, Big Agnes - those that really specialize in quality outdoor gear, tend to be pretty spot on. Given that, you can expect any one 0 degree bag from a quality manufacture to actually be a 5 or a -5 degree bag. I wouldn't worry about how accurate the rating is for a Mountain Hardwear bag. For where you are, the 0 degree bag should be plenty comfortable - there really won't be that many nights he'll be camping in below zero temps. But, if you do expect him to see some below zero nights, my suggestion is rather than purchase a second bag, that you invest in (or make!) a fleece liner - which is basically a lightweight fleece blanket folded in half and sewed up at one end and along the long side - this gets stuffed into the bag and your son would just crawl into it. This combo will prove more than sufficient for a -15 degree night. As an added bonus - a fleece insert can double as a warm (summer) weather bag all on its own. As you start to think about a more spring, summer and fall like bag, I'd like to make a radical suggestion and say stick with the Mountain Hardwear mummy you're buying - it looks to me like it will zip open, at least to the foot, if not around the bottom of the foot. There is nothing that says one must sleep IN a sleeping bag. I rarely do, even in winter - I tend to open my sleeping bag and use it as a blanket, with a fleece liner or blanket on top of my sleeping pad. I use a bag I purchased from North Face so long ago (alomst 20 years now) that I can't remember its name or its rating. Better to buy one very good bag that you can use all 4 seasons (or even one good bag), than to buy two very good and expensive bags - or two really mediocre bags. As for the sleeping pads, if, and that's a big IF, your son is going to carry both pads with him, then he'll want to put the Ridge Rest closed cell pad on the bottom and the Trail Pro on the top. The reason is simple. The Ridge Rest is pretty much non-slip on both sides. The Trail Pro is non-slip only on the bottom. If you put the Ridge Rest on top of the Trail Pro's top side, it is much more likely that the two pads will slip around over night. That's not to say the Trail Pro's top side is slippery - it's just not a non-slip surface. Now to the big IF. This is one of the cases where two of something isn't necessarily better than one of something. The Trail Pro should be more than sufficient insulation and provide plenty of comfort all on its own. Same with the Ridge Rest - though my personal preference is a Thermarest air mattress - I find the air mattress, which is NOT a typical air mattress but is instead an open cell pad with thousands of very small cells, to be more comfortable as it has a little more "give" to it. By this I mean that the air mattress is less likely to "transmit" the shape of a twig or rock to the top of the pad than a closed cell pad will. In other words, you're more likely to feel the twigs, stones and bumps in the ground under a closed cell pad, even the Ridge Rest, than under the air mattress. The added advantage to the air mattress is that you add additional air beyond the capacity of the self inflation to personalize your comfort zone. At some point, your son is more likely to gravitate to carrying one or the other. Don't despair about buying both, though - they each have advantages over the other. When winter camping, I generally take both the closed cell and the air mattress. The closed cell is much more useful as a camp seat when not sleeping, than the air mattress is. It can also make a fine temporary camp table (I wouldn't cook on it, or set hot pans on it, but I would use it as a prep table, or an eating table). I see no need for any emergency blanket for a sleep system. An emergency blanket is just that, something to toss into a car or day pack just in case one gets stuck away from the shelter of a tent or away from a sleeping bag/blankets. Hope this helps - and have a great time with your son in Scouts! Calico