InquisitiveScouter

Nor do they have to provide you copies. This was a speed bump, but I understand they don't need to spend time making copies. So, I asked if it would be scanned to a file. No, definitely not, was the answer. Now the speed bump is a road block. So I just wait until items are available on Charity Navigator or GuideStar and then distribute for public information. This is part of why I am blacklisted. I see it as just facilitating transparency

Awww @MattR, the occasional rabbit hole is fine, right?? Council fees should help fund professionals who go out and recruit and train (or see that training is provided to) adult volunteers (Commissioners included) to run the program. Tracing it backwards, bad program is usually a result of poor adult volunteerism, which is usually a result of a lack of recruiting/training by professionals, who get paid by the council fees... I firmly believe, if the program was the focus, the fees and fundraising would fall into place with no issues. That does not seem to be the mindset here (in this council)...

Barry, The observation on our program is mine, when looking at other units, and speaking with volunteers and parents at multiple events. And, I totally get that Commissioners' attention should be first and foremost to units that are struggling. My point is just what you sussed out: our council/district/unit Commissioner apparatus is broken, and I believe it directly affects the quality of programs at each level. The secondary point is that, if we did experience an issue we needed help with, I'd have no idea who to call directly. We do not have a Unit Commissioner assigned, nor have we had any interaction with a Commissioner (except for Roundtables) for about 2 years. And the last was a request by me to do a unit contact to "check the health", from which we got zero Commissioner feedback. (No news is good news?) But, I see it as a DE (and the other two of the Key 3) responsibility to recruit Commissioners. Am I wrong? It ain't happening here. And the liaison bit was a direct quote pulled from the Administration of Commissioner Service manual https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34501.pdf Finally, I am trying to tactfully engage our SE to find some way forward (to get off his blacklist), but he is swamped with funding/bankruptcy/DE&I/YPT issues. So I remain on the back burner until his bandwidth is more open (sorry for the mixed metaphor ).

This is one facet of the problem. Thanks. And I am not the only one...there are quite a few around here who are in that boat. It seems our council board is really out of touch with the volunteer base as well. We are a perfect example of where leadership is cutting off its nose in spite of its face.

And only good for two years? Whereas a NCS certification is good for five?? For me to volunteer to be your Short-Term Camp Administrator? I'll pass. Instead, I think I'll apply for the National Office job of Short-Sighted Camping Program Demolisher

If it is virtual, and required by National, could it be done through https://training.scouting.org/?? Or is it tailored to your specific locale??

Sometimes you wonder if they are trying to put themselves out of business...

@MattR and others... Spot on! A council (or any organization) must be of value, be able to demonstrate that value, and advocate for their value-added to Scouting. Our council is dysfunctional, for many reasons similar to those some of you see in other councils. That was my challenge to our council. "If you want our money and support, please tell us what value you give to our program." - Our district events are not fun or interesting for our Scouts, therefore not well attended. If our PLC does not wish to do District events, I CANNOT veto them. I only veto their decisions for health and safety reasons. I have given much time to District events and Committees, but for the last two years, our SE has denied my participation, ostensibly based on my non-support of FOS. Our PLC has volunteered to help run a few District events. For the last two, the PLC responded on short notice to staff stations at an event, and, after jumping through hoops to get people and materials together, were told at the last minute, "We don't need you now, we have adults who will staff the event stations." - Our council events? Aren't any...our last council-level event for units was three years ago. Our Troop supported it, and constructed a Pioneering project that was a hit. Constant line to participate and climb on it... Cost for the event was $30 a head, and that did not include food cost for our unit. Did not get program value for $30 a head. (Our local amusement parks charge about $40 a head for groups over 20. Our Scouts prefer those.) - Our OA Lodge? A self-serving organization that does nothing visible for our units. Our Committee and I support using the OA in our unit as an honor recognition for our Scouts. When they start doing service events in our council or community, I will encourage them to wider participation. - Our local camp? Our Scouts don't want to go there to camp or for Summer Camp. The facilities are horrible, and we can get similar or better services from our county and state parks, or local facilities, for cheaper prices, with less interference and interruption to our program. Our unit has done at least eight service projects over the past five years worth thousands of dollars to improve portions of camp... not one iota of thanks or recognition for our Scouts. (Not that they do it for the thanks, but gratitude costs little to nothing. We did a service project for our local land conservation non-profit (with expenditures similar to our council) and every single Scout participating got a hand-written thank you card from them.) - Our Scout Shop? Awesome, keep it. Although, we can get everything we need from on line Scout Shop, at same prices. Our local shop allows us to get 99% of our needs quicker...you pay for convenience - Our Registrar? Awesome. But, I believe most functions could be automated and placed on line. Scoutbook has been a huge improvement in our ability and agility to file for advancements and recognize our Scouts. It took two years of lobbying to get our council to put MBC lists in Scoutbook. - Our District Executive? Don't have one. I have done the Charter Agreement for our CO for the last four years, and delivered it to council. We get support from our Scout office in no-cost-to-unit printing of recruiting materials. - Our Unit Commissioner? Don't know who that is this week (sarcasm). A Commissioner only visits when I specifically ask our District Commissioner for a visit. They have an open invitation to attend any event or outing. Never seen one... "The commissioner is the liaison between the local council and Scouting units. The commissioner’s mission is to keep units operating at maximum efficiency, maintain regular contact with unit leaders, coach leaders on where to find assistance, note weaknesses in programs, and suggest remedies. The commissioner is successful when units effectively deliver the ideals of Scouting to their members." I know we are one of the best units in District and Council, but we never get that feedback from any level... We are left in a state of benign neglect. I have offered to become a Commissioner when my tenure ends this year. Will be dependent on whether SE still denies my participation at the district and council level. and the list goes on... I would love for our council to improve, but suggestions for change are not solicited, and, when given, are routinely ignored or rejected.

FOS = Fund Our Salaries??

Ours, National fee $66 plus council fee $60 (service $48 plus insurance $12) = $126 total for youth. National $42 plus $5 council (insurance) = $47 for adults. Does not include the $25 first time fee for youth... Our troop dues, $49...so Scouts in our unit paid $175 to recharter for the year....not including Scout Life. I will remain council-anonymous

You cover airfare and rental car, and I'm in!! I have relatives in SA and Fort Worth areas...which is closer?? So, if you can recruit someone to do it for your unit/council, here's what I did... Week long course at Philmont Training Center to be a certified WFA Instructor. Includes certification to teach CPR/AED and Standard First Aid. Cost for me back then was about $400 for the course. We made it a family road trip, and the wife and kids did a week long program there too. If you haven't been to PTC, highly recommended. They did a great job. Then you have to purchase the training materials from the course provider...about another $250 (can't see my old invoices now), depending on the provider Then buy CPR manikins and supplies, and a practice AED...another $750. Practice First Aid supplies, Projector, computer, etc, etc, All in, you are there for about $1500 minimum if you already have the tech support. That is the cost of about 8 WFA courses if your unit pays for them... You can recoup the cost of your outlay by training other units for a minimal fee. Worth considering...

When I do these, I assess a small fee to cover the cost of my qualification and materials (instructor certification, curriculum slides, projector, computer, CPR manikins & bags, practice AED, bandages, etc.) that I paid out of pocket to start up the operation. Still less than half the cost you'd see by council or on the market. CPR/AED costs about $110 and WFA costs about $200 in these parts. I do CPR/AED for $35, WFA for $60 (includes both). When I offered to do these for council at bare-minimum cost, and the professional training advisor said "No." The reason given was that they had professional relationships to maintain outside of Scouting, and that undercutting prices for services Scouters get from Red Cross/REI/NOLS/American Heart, etc., etc. would damage those relationships. (I remain skeptical.) If I did them through council, we had to charge a rate comparable to the market. I taught these for our council contingents to Philmont a few years ago, taught in council facilities. Council charged them the $200 per person, folded that into the cost per participant, and gave me my $60 per, which is all I asked... I will no longer spend my time being a revenue generator for council. I gladly teach volunteers, and they arrange for facilities and snacks...

I do see microfiber shirts with canvas pants a lot around here....

@sunshinescout, @CynicalScouter knows, as I do, that any monies raised for an Eagle Scout Service Project (ESSP) belong to the beneficiary of the project. If any Scout, unit, or organization other than the beneficiary, keeps money raised by an Eagle Scout candidate for purposes of funding an ESSP, then that is tantamount to theft. Now, if there is money left over from a fundraising effort, and the Eagle Scout candidate gives it to the beneficiary, and the beneficiary chooses to give it to some other organization or individual, that is their prerogative. Yet another reason National wishes to avoid projects that require fundraising...and why you should avoid one, as well, especially if you do not need it for your project.

knots, interpreter strip, service stars, trail and other medals, jamboree patches, honor patrol stars, troop veteran number strips, OA flap, Powderhorn emblem, JTE patch, Trained emblem, Emergency Preparedness pins (retiring)... Now we are talking, BLING!! But wait!!! Doesn't the G2AI say "Excess Insignia With the exception of the Cub Scout badges of rank, members wear only the insignia that show their present status in the movement. Members should make every effort to keep their uniforms neat and uncluttered." (emphasis added) And didn't BP say, "A Scout should not use a showy uniform, because it would attract attention; but Scouts in a patrol, should as far as possible, dress alike, especially as regards hats, or caps, and neckerchief." Hmmmm.... Scout Life magazine... https://scoutlife.org/about-scouts/scouting-around/164940/is-there-life-after-earning-eagle-scout/

Yes, and official pants come in three different materials, each with advantages and disadvantages, as @KYScouterbegins to point out. Canvas, polyester microfiber, and polyester/wool blend are your choices. Each material has its devotees. I am a devotee of polyester microfiber. Light, quick dry, converts to shorts, cargo pockets, does not fade as quickly as the canvas stuff. Disadvantages of poly microfiber? Wind whistles right through it in winter (you need good under-layers), it snags on brush and threads get pulled out (canvas is more heavy-duty), and even small sparks from the fire burn right through. Enjoy the adventure!

Hi @sunshinescout, An Eagle Board of Review cannot really "deny" your rank. The can only "recommend" approval or disapproval to National. Only the National office may decide that. There is a specific process your EBOR must follow if, when they meet, they come to a conclusion that you did not meet the requirement, and make that recommendation. The first step is that they must present to you IN WRITING what they believe to be the issue. If you do not agree, you may appeal. National prefers these matters be solved at the local level, so council should first review. There is specific guidance for councils in GTA, but, from your posts, it sounds as though you may have read through GTA 8.0.4.0 already. As to fundraising: GTA 9.0.2.10 (from your OP) "Fundraising for an Eagle Scout service project shall not be required of any candidate. Whether or not fundraising takes place is the Scout’s decision based on project needs. The BSA prefers, in fact, that Scouts choose projects that can be done at little or no cost. Fundraising—especially on a larger scale—has tax, accounting, and other legal implications, in which minors should not be involved." My advice, should you choose to take it, is to not do a fundraiser, if it is not needed. Stand firm. You are automatically in the right should you choose not to do a fundraiser. GTA 9.0.2.13 (from your OP) "At the board of review, if an approved proposal and any subsequent effort represents planning and development that was adequate to the project, and the project was well led and carried out to the satisfaction of the unit leader and project beneficiary, only in a very rare case would rejection result. It would have to be clearly established that Eagle Scout requirement 5—as written— was not completed. Under no circumstances shall project approval at any point in the process be withheld for reasons that have nothing to do with the project." Work through your project and get your unit leader's and beneficiary's signature on the approval page. You will be fine. Even if the EBOR makes some written non-recommendation, the appeals process is designed to safeguard your (and other Scouts') interests. Maybe your case is the one that National needs to crack down on your council/district for imposing requirements that aren't there! Maybe you will be the one who brings unfair and inappropriate practices to National's attention. Or maybe, just maybe, you are imagining resistance that isn't there. (Don't fight dragons that aren't there.) Meet the issue head on IF and when it arises.

@qwazse, There you go trying to impose some common sense again. Stop it, at once, you devil!

Anyone dare email the Office of the Chief Diversity Officer and point them to this discussion thread for input? https://www.scouting.org/program-updates/proposed-eagle-scout-required-diversity-equity-and-inclusion-merit-badge-delayed/ I do not email National any more. They have skewered me more than once for my questions, and it has been a factor in reprisals by my local SE, I believe.

How do you learn to make good decisions? By making some bad ones and learning from your mistakes! Or, as a good commander of mine once said..."Every truly good soldier has dents in his helmet." Best to let them make some bad decisions now, while the consequences are small

@CynicalScouter, Agreed, that bridge is burnt...they cannot go back Revised requirements, and possibly a name change for the badge (Human Rights Merit Badge) is the compromise we could see. But, knowing some of the history of BSA's poorly implemented changes, I am doubtful of the product they will deliver. Yet, I will remain the optimist, since they have delayed the release. I think it is a good sign of internal wrestling and compromise.

The good news with that is that teen pregnancy is down. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/08/02/why-is-the-teen-birth-rate-falling/ I think the internet and video gaming has a role to play in that, as well.

These seem to support your numbers... https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/11/gender-education-gap/546677/ https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/08/why-men-are-the-new-college-minority/536103/ Side note...In 1984, I went to a four year school (enrollment about 15K students) that was traditionally a teacher's college...female to male ratio was 3:1. I really enjoyed my college years

After a fifteen minute search and read, cannot find raw numbers of female/male college grads anywhere...only percentages within their own cohorts...not helpful. Sorry...spent enough time down the rabbit hole...anyone else find data??