InquisitiveScouter

@Ojoman, thanks for the input. However, that isn't what I was fishing for... You gave great tips on how a DE can be successful. Instead, I was looking for better ideas for Councils and National to improve the professional corps. That is, councils and National are responsible for recruitment, training, retention, development, and promotion of their personnel. They arguably have not been successful at meeting these responsibilities. What would you do differently to ensure our organization has and keeps the DE's (and therefore the successive leadership levels) to make the mission of BSA happen?

So, I'd love to know, please... after being on the inside, what adjustments would you make to put the professional corps on the track you think it should be on?

Trim SE salaries to fill this gap. Will aid in retention and longer term corporate health.

- A focus on unit service. And everything viewed through that lens... - Recruit, train, and support COMMISSIONERS to implement the unit service support. This is the Unit Commissioners' purpose. But in the eight councils I have been involved with over my adult years, only one did this well, and Scouting was most successful there, of all others experienced. (But that was also in the late 80's and early 90's.) - Low cost, high impact training for unit leaders. (And encouragement/recognition for unit leaders who complete more advanced training.) I know it is hard enough to get program leaders to take Introduction to Outdoor Leadership Skills (a misnomer, because it is about outdoor program elements, not leadership), but there should also be more advanced skills training available. Most adults I work with in Scouting have very little outdoor experience, and so they do not have confidence to take kids to the woods, nor to teach and train older youth to become outdoor-savvy instructors and leader-trainers . I encourage adults to take a merit badge at camp, Pioneering or Orienteering for example. However, most come away from that experience greatly disillusioned with the merit badge program, for a variety of reasons... Better, when offered, to take advantage of adult-friendly programs in camp like Lifeguard BSA, or Swim & Water Rescue, or Paddle Craft Safety (all great programs) I have also steered many adults toward National Camping School/Philmont Training Center/LNT & TREAD Level 2, etc, to gain additional program exposure to bring back to the unit program (few are willing to give up a whole week to do this.) - Transparency on council finances. 95% of the people I have shown our IRS 990 to are genuinely SHOCKED at the pay our Board approves for the SE. They do not see value for the money spent. Most professionals I have encountered are extremely uncomfortable talking about finances to volunteers. - Steer our district and council activities, and our local camp (including Summer Camp) to be more PATROL focused. Campsites and program offerings are set up to cater to an individual or to a unit. About the only patrol focused event we have anymore is Klondike... I'll search for a previous thread which covered this same topic... there was a lot of good stuff there from others, IIRC.

From that Atlanta article, "Eight Scout officials are believed to have participated in the false record-keeping, said Tom Gay, president of the council's board of directors." I know the articles are from 18 years ago, but in this digital age, black eyes take much longer to go away... And, you know there were more involved in both councils... just didn't get implicated in it... And other councils did the same. Think any of those folks are still left in the organization? I do. Yet another shining example for the mission of BSA, "... to prepare young people to make ethical and moral choices over their lifetimes by instilling in them the values of the Scout Oath and Scout Law."

I know at least three Troops in our area have notified council they will not be rechartering. Do not know their membership numbers, though. My guess is that they were somewhat small.... <=10 Several Scouts who want to continue are moving over to us. And we are getting some gear to help fill in a few of our gaps. Our attrition was normal. We had 53 on the books before recharter season... have gained 5 from Troops not rechartering already (so now at 58). (Expecting a few more in the weeks to come.) We will lose 6 who have been pretty much no-shows, 1 who is moving into multiple sports, and two (Eagle Scouts) have turned 18 this year. So, we recharter with 49 out of 58 total... that's 84.4% Not bad, but not great either. We have seen about a 10-12% attrition rate each year over the past seven years. That has been holding our numbers fairly steady. I look at differently... splitting hairs, maybe... I see 7 losses out of 51 "eligible" (not counting adults Eagles or new arrivals) that's a 13.7% attrition. Somewhat normal... Gold Level JTE metric met, which is 85% retention...

This is a fundamental truth that escapes much of the organization. Expand your net, please, to include National Service Territory and National volunteers, and professionals at all levels.

We invested in North Face Stormbreak II tents... Great for local camping and some shorter backpacking trips. But, has some drawbacks... - Footprints are extra cost (probably the same with most tents) - Vestibules are a bit small and make getting into the tent a bit of a yoga exercise - Scouts must be trained well on correct set up (this is an ongoing issue). However, once set up correctly, these can endure really bad weather and keep you dry. - Tent bag isn't big enough (nylon tents needn't be folded... just stuff them into the sack, as the fabric has no "memory" this also saves lots of time and heartache. The bags that come with the tents aren't really suited to other than near-perfect folding (a pain), and certainly not stuffing. Scouts have ripped them up in no time. After market bags (add to the expense) work great. Overall, we will not be purchasing this type of tent again. I am holding out hope for a Hilleberg one day 😜 https://hilleberg.com/eng/

Yes. And this formula works at the unit level within councils as well...

Jobs... and feeding at the trough of donations...

Welcome! The very best starting advice is to ask your questions here, and ask for the source material for the answer. Most diligent posters will give you a link to the source in some BSA material for the answer they are giving. If it is something that is a matter of opinion (and there is much that falls into that category), then be prepared for a wide range of answers. 😜

LOL, and most bad things, too 😜

As a youth, he must be a registered member of a unit in order to keep his OA membership active. It can be any unit he chooses. If he is not going to be a member of his "old" Troop, then he could transfer and recharter with a different unit. That said, the primary duty of any Arrowman is to serve his unit, not the lodge. If he only wants to serve in the lodge, then he is kinda missing the point of the OA.

Wow, that is so wrong... and it shows a fundamental misunderstanding by the SM on how Patrols work, advancement requirements, and Troop organization If the Patrol elected him, then only the Patrol should be able to un-elect him 😜 Make sure the SM reads the requirements for rank. PL is not the only position that works. From the Star Scout requirements, positions held for four months that qualify: "Patrol leader, assistant senior patrol leader, senior patrol leader, troop guide, Order of the Arrow troop representative, den chief, scribe, librarian, historian, quartermaster, bugler, junior assistant Scoutmaster, chaplain aide, instructor, webmaster, or outdoor ethics guide." There is only one PL for the Patrol, but a Troop can have lots of Den Chiefs, Librarians, Historians, QMs, Buglers, Chaplain Aides, Instructors, etc. etc. etc. There is NO prohibition I can find on multiples in the "unelected" positions. One solution: talk with the SM and review the Star requirements with him. Suggest, say Outdoor Ethics Guide (especially if your Troop does not have one!!!). Find the Position Description for that office: https://troopleader.scouting.org/troop-positions/ https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/training/pdf/510-046_PocketCards17.pdf Suggest that the SM speak to the SPL about appointing the Scout to one of the positions, with the Scout's input! Then help the Scout set three (or so) SMART goals to accomplish in his tenure in whatever position the SPL appoints him to. If you need info on SMART goals: from the ILST syllabus, page 17, ": Each goal must be specific (clear and understandable), measurable (you know when you are done), attainable (you can do it), relevant (why you are doing it), and timely (done when it is needed)." https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/training/pdf/ILST_IntroSyllabus_9_11.pdf If the Scout accomplishes his goals in the time period, then that rank requirement is no issue. If he is unable to accomplish his own goals, have a discussion with him about it, and then decide whether to sign him off... If he just wears a patch for four months, that should be a no-go!

In over 40+ years, I can easily count the number of times I have seen a Scout use the corkscrew... zero. Mostly I remember them asking "what is this for?" as they whip out the most unused extensions on their pocketknife, corkscrew included. And what, pray tell, have you carried with a corkscrew? LOL

Yes, I agree! It is REMARKABLE when the parents finally become great adults 😛 😜

Ask 10 different Scouters their opinion on knives/tools, and you'll get 20 different opinions 😜 I would differ from @Armymutt on the Hunter, it has the saw (see my post above), a corkscrew (which Scouts don't really need), and a "gutting blade" (again, not an activity we normally do in Scouting 😜 ) https://www.victorinox.com/us/en/Products/Swiss-Army-Knives/Large-Pocket-Knives/Hunter/p/0.8573

After decades of experience in Scouting and in the military, and many years of observing Scouts in the woods, recommend you go with nothing more than the tools on a Victorinox Tinker. They are about $32. https://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Tinker-Red-Swiss-Pocket/dp/B002J94KFG Or any knock-off of it would be cheaper... And please do not get anything with a saw on it, like the Victorinox Hiker, even though you can get "more for less"... https://www.amazon.com/Victorinox-Swiss-Army-Hiker-Size/dp/B0001P151M Some of the nastiest wounds I have seen on hands are from Scouts trying to use these tiny saws. Have a bowsaw and a cheap pair of needle nose pliers in your Troop tool box... When they take up backpacking, they'll appreciate this advice even more 😜 P.S. A good pair of trauma shears should be the "scissors" in your personal first aid kit. Tiny scissors do not "cut it" (pun intended). Tiny scissors are OK for cutting moleskin or a piece of gauze, but when you need to open or remove clothing for CPR/AED or to assess a wound, you're gonna hate the decision to bring tiny scissors.

Even if there is law enforcement involvement and a conviction, you should not "kick him out" without addressing the behavior and giving him a chance to mend his ways. Have a Scoutmaster Conference with the Scout. Focus on the behavior, rather than the person. Explain that his behavior is un-Scout-like, and violates his Scout Oath and Scout Law. Explain that his behavior has consequences outside of family and school, and will extend to the Troop. Tell him if he is involved in future incidents, then he will be removed from the Troop. Recommend the SPL remove him from his current role in a Position of Responsibility (POR), for a defined length of time, say, 3 months. If, at the end of that time, without further incident, he may be restored to a POR Any further incidents, and his Troop membership is terminated (depending on the infraction). You might also tell him that you will recommend that the council terminate his membership in BSA, as well. Give him a chance with discipline.

Yes, I was an avid Ceremonies Team member in my youth, until turning 21 (back in 1987!). Meteu was my favorite part, although I played each part at one time or another. We had really bad outfits, with really bad headdresses. We also used facepaint without regard to meaning. We "played" Indian... I was ignorant to the issue of this being offensive, in a religious-sort-of-way. (Although, I do think that card is played is little too much. It is the default when someone wants to stop you from doing something they do not like.) Now that my ignorance is gone, I do not support the use of most Native American elements in the Order of the Arrow. Best to part ways with the practice and move on.... When I learned more about the roots of the OA, I found that there were no AIA elements in the beginning. I would happily return to that, or, incorporate significant elements from American history. I believe that could be easily done while maintaining the spirit of brotherhood, cheerfulness, and service. Place names, including camps and campsites, should be fine, as long as they have local significance.

Not pessimistic about Scouting... just ambivalent about BSA's survival. BSA does not equal Scouting. It is but one organization that engages in what it calls Scouting. If it goes the way of the Dodo, there will still be other Scouting organizations around... There are several other Scouting organizations in the USA, and you can drill down to find them here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-aligned_Scouting_organizations

Three possible? Maybe he did not see that the thread was two months old... it was probably in his Unread queue.

An excellent article.

Your COR.

@DuctTapefor National Commissioner!! At the very least, unethical...