Eagle1993

Finished reading that GSUSA guideline. I have no problem showing the uniform, emphasizing their unique brand, ensuring GSUSA money is spent on GSUSA events. Recruiting separate... sure. Many valid points. Telling a Troop of Girl Scouts that they can no longer participate in Scouting for Food because it is a BSA event crosses a line. It crosses the line of an organization more self interested in $ than doing service. I haven’t seen that and GSUSA in my area still does some joint BSA activities when it involves community service... I hope that remains.

Found this to be interesting “Girl Scouts of the USA prohibits events co-sponsored or co- branded with the Boy Scouts.” “Do not participate in, allow, or promote any co-sponsored or co-branded events or programs that use either Girl Scouts’ name, logo, colors, or likenesses together with Boy Scouts. This includes long-standing events like Scouting for Food and Pine Car Derbies.” Yep... screw the hungry if Boy Scouts are involved. What a load of crap. My sympathy for GSUSA went down a few notches...

https://scoutingwire.org/this-infographic-shows-the-right-way-to-refer-to-girls-who-will-join-scouts-bsa/

most of the girls in my daughter’s school that are in GSUSA have no desire to do the outdoor program. They sign up for the STEM, arts and crafts aspect. Sure ... glamping is of some interest but definitely not HA. When signing up for summer camp the GSUSA camp about fashion was sold out and had a waiting list... that wasn’t the case for the more outdoor focused camps. I’m sure they will increase their outdoor offerings to help stem losses to BSA but from what I see on the ground at our school the actual Troops and girls will focus on STEM and arts/crafts and going to museums. Not sure about other schools.

@Treflienne You are probably right. My only thought is that BSA will not drop the use of Scouts and in the end, even if they are forced to change to BSA Scouts instead of Scouts BSA the confusion will remain. I did notice that my daughter (who is in both) has been seeing a lot of language from GSUSA about the power of G.I.R.L.s. Emphasize on the girl vs scout. Perhaps they are looking for a payout while keeping the name unchanged.

I wouldn’t be shocked if BSA/GSUSA settle and BSA helps fund a name change of GSUSA to Girl Guides USA. Regardless of the name BSA chooses there could be confusion and GSUSA will want to differentiate. Could be a big marketing refresh of their program and I don’t see BSA losing the term scouts. Who knows, will be interesting to watch.

From FB Post The following is an official statement from the BSA's National Council. Please be aware that any comments to the media should be made by the National or local Councils only. If you receive any media inquiries, please route them to PR@scouting.org. “We just became aware of the lawsuit filed in the Southern District Court of New York, and we are reviewing it carefully. “Our decision to expand our program offerings for girls came after years of requests from families who wanted the option of the BSA’s character - and leadership-development programs for their children – boys and girls. We believe that we owe it to our current and future members to offer families the options they want.” “We applaud every organization that builds character and leadership in children, including the Girl Scouts of the USA, and believe that there is an opportunity for both organizations to serve girls and boys in our communities.” On background: • The Boy Scouts of America has served girls in our programs since 1971 through Sea Scouts, Venturing and Exploring; in fact, there are currently over 170,000 girls registered in Boy Scout of America programs. • In the time since we’ve welcomed both boys and girls in Cub Scouts, over 62,000 girls have registered underscoring families’ interest in the programs offered by the Boy Scouts of America. • We take the brand and trademark of all organizations seriously and have worked proactively to differentiate our unique program offerings. Any time we have been made aware of an instance of potential confusion around our programs, we immediately took steps to correct and clarify."

I think some of the issue is local leaders and councils being “innovative”. See below for an image used in the lawsuit.... clearly not from Nationals as their online forms crash too quickly to take screenshots.

All the issues GSUSA listed are prior to use of Scouts BSA. They know they can’t sue to block BSA from accepting girls so this is what they are left with. Will be interesting to see BSA’s response.

@Hawkwin Posted as a comment to a private FB several weeks ago. Apparently all councils are now provided national breakdowns weekly. Your DE should be able to give you numbers.

This is 2 weeks old... but is probably still directionally correct Rank. Council - Total Girls - Southern Region 1. Central Florida - 2,323 2. Circle Ten - 2,221 3. Atlanta Area - 1,549 4. Northeast Georgia - 1,185 5. Sam Houston Area - 1,108 6. Great Smoky Mountain - 720 7. North Florida - 709 8. Quapaw Area - 575 9. Heart of Virginia - 569 10. Last Frontier - 533 11. Alamo Area - 482 12. Flint River - 479 13. Capitol Area - 478 14. Greater Tampa Bay Area - 464 15. Longhorn - 461 16. Lincoln Heritage - 407 17. Palmetto - 324 18. Golden Spread - 297 19. Daniel Boone - 284 20. Northwest Georgia - 278 21. Indian Nations - 259 22. Westark Area - 246 23. Chattahoochee - 241 24. Piedmont - 238 25. Southeast Louisiana - 233

Agreed. For those of us in the Midwest... we don’t have vast options of wilderness to choose from to really get away. BWCA is our Philmont/Sea Base/Summit. BWCA is our Rocky Mountains. BWCA is our Olympic NP. BWCA is our Acadia. I was always glad it wasn’t a NP as it helped keep vast hordes of tourists out... but now I wonder if that was a mistake. I’m sure there is a chance this could be done without damaging the environment but why risk it. We have enough copper and nickel to avoid mining this area.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2018/11/03/hit-and-run-3-girl-scouts-1-adult-killed-wisconsin-crash/1880652002/ Not much to add, just sad to hear this news.

Agreed. When I hit the online recharter process it becomes a bit of a game of how to adjust my actual leadership structure into the BSA requirements. For example, I have a great den leader who is also Cubmaster. If I followed BSA I would either have a weaker Cubmaster or a weaker den leader. Yes, ideally I have competent parents tripping over themselves volunteering. I don’t, so we run the pack with the leadership we have (always looking for more), following YPT and adjusting our charter renewal to match requirements.

Ahh.... that would be fun... which is why I write out some emails and just send them to the delete bin. 😀 Camping with a Troop is no longer required for scouting adventure or AOL. Only an outdoor activity. One could argue they didn’t follow the patrol method. However, if you did take that path I think it could make the situation worse as the existing leadership would point to a “disgruntled ex leader” and deflect blame. In the end, I see silently leaving as a louder statement. FYI.... not to derail this thread. With your Webelos den leader, parent, or guardian, participate in a Boy Scout troop's campout or other outdoor activity. Use the patrol method while on the outing.

Sorry to hear how it finished but I agree it is better to leave a bit early than too late. Good to hear you had a replacement ready. Hey, as far as other things to do, Would you be interested in serving as a FOS Chair for another pack in your state?? 👍😀 Our committee meetings are at a German Bierhaus and we would cover the first round!

@Eagledad I would be with you if this was straight up bullying if this wasn’t borderline sexual assault. That is not an emotional statement, that is a simple truth based on what is described. Having a scout decide to give up SPL seems incredibly minor given what occurred. Sexual assault covers a wide range of unwanted behaviors—up to but not including penetration—that are attempted or completed against a victim's will or when a victim cannot consent because of age, disability, or the influence of alcohol or drugs. Sexual assault may involve actual or threatened physical force, use of weapons, coercion, intimidation, or pressure and may include— Intentional touching of the victim's genitals, anus, groin, or breasts.

This was a border line call to the police to report the SPL. The only reason I wouldn’t was that it was a single occurrence and his underwear was on. Given that, I think a call to your SE is appropriate. It was a group of scouts... yes non scouting... but it doesn’t lessen the impact of the action. The council can decide if the SPL should be dismissed. If you don’t report it and this gets out... I think some may question your Troop’s leadership. If the SPL does this again and then the council hears you had an earlier issue you didn’t report... your scouting membership could be at risk. At this point, given his actions, I wouldn’t want to put my own scouting membership on the line by not reporting. Just my opinion... I know this isn’t a black and white situation.

Latest report is 53139 girls... so only 3000 more in one week. What I found interesting is that the southern region reported their numbers as 23,089 with Central Florida leading the way with 2,300 girls. I wonder what is unique in the Southern Region for them to have such a large percentage of total girls. Any ideas ... yes, I know to be suspicious of any recruiting numbers... but if correct any idea what is going on in the South vs the other regions?

Now my mansplaining take...I took that post as a bit of tongue in cheek, especially after further clarifications from @qwazse. He does go “off the reservation” from time to time (like most of us) but I don’t think it was fully along the lines of find yourself a rich maid. Quips don’t all translate to Internet forums well. I took it as find a good life partner that will be willing to do their share of work in the marriage. That other attributes may not be the best to go on. Perhaps there is a bit of an assumption of what roles in marriage each should take, but that is something that should be understood before going in. If someone believes and wants their wife to cook, that is fine as long as both partners recognize that and agree before entering marriage. My quips to youth now focus on recommendations of keeping detailed calendars and limiting social media for our future leaders...talk about a mine field.

I agree. You can not submit an online app without paying. The online invitation manager is separate. I don’t see how this could be a glitch...

For new units. Most packs are simply adding girls as there is no minimum (since you already have a charter agreement for the Pack); however, it sounds like their council is still referring to a 5 girl minimum.

Family packs have no minimum number of girls. Where does the 5 come from?

@Buggie Did you submit request for more info through beascout.org? I have seen a few requests come in from that but what is odd is that it only generates a lead in the online system, not an application. Someone in your council must have manually converted your lead into an application. They appear to be totally separate systems (leads and applications) online. One suggestion, log onto my.scouting.org and see if you have anything under the Youth Profile. My son was a paper app and nothing is there for him. My daughter was an online app and her profile appears. Just a guess (based on my experience), but if this was simply an online app mistake I would think you would see her under your profile. If someone in council printed out your lead and made it into a paper app it may not show up.

Recruiting season is wrapping up this year. We have over 90 Scouts registered, I expect several will drop and we will end up in the mid 80s. (We have some casual scouts and we have made the change to strictly enforce advancement requirements. Our Pack had a long history of handing our ranks and our current leadership has decided to change that... so we expect some to drop.) We currently have 18 girls in our Pack and it varies greatly by age. Our largest pack size in the last 10+ years was 74... so we are definitely up even excluding Lions which is by far our smallest den. We are now pulling in girls and a boy from other schools who’s Packs have decided to stay boy only. The girls are easy to explain but there was a boy as well. The boy was best friends with a girl and they wanted to be in the same Pack. We have received no negative feedback from parents. There are a few that said they are “interested” in seeing how the dynamics change (if they do). One dad said his son had threatened to quit if we added girls but now wants to keep participating. One girl (young) actually asked why there were boys in the Pack. Otherwise it is a non (or at least limited) issue in our Pack. One of my leaders was talking to a parent of a girl who recently joined and explained that he was concerned that we might negatively impact GSUSA. The parent said that without our Pack her daughter would have no scouting available as the GSUSA Troop collapsed when no parents wanted to volunteer.... and other Troops were difficult to join. Strong GSUSA Troops will be fine in our school, but we are there for those without a scouting home. Next up recharter. It will be interesting to see if there is more attrition than in the past.