Eagle1993

So, our final count hit 73, with 17 girls. We had two girls drop, one due to sports and Irish dancing and the other as the girl who dropped was her only friend in the pack. We had 22 boys drop.... one moved and most due to sports. Looking at years past, the only major attrition increase was our Lion to Tiger Scouts. I do think we lost a lot of scouts due to a nice but poor den leader.... that was a lesson to watch new den leaders more closely in the future. Recruiting was a bit tougher this year as the school prevented us from emailing all parents. We have done that in the past as the school does not allow us in their doors for recruiting, but now they told us to not email parents as well. I asked my den leaders if any boys left due to girls, they said no. Most of the ones that left rarely showed up to meetings anyway. I know we can’t know for sure, but we saw nearly no loss of Bear or Webelos Scouts... only younger ones. That seems to be consistent with years past, before girls. Our Pack is now functional a coed pack. On paper we do talk about boy and girl dens, but in practice it appears coed. We were not able to recruit enough leaders nor garner support from parents to split up Den meetings. In some cases this is helping boy dens (the Tiger den is run by parents of the girls) and in some cases it helps the girl dens. We tried the multiple age den meeting last spring, and we didn’t like the results. Not sure if I’ll add more to this thread. Adding girls was a bit more work due to YPT rules, but seeing the results was worth it. What worked for us will not work in all areas. Unit leaders know their parents and youth more than the District, Council or Nationals. I also know Cub Scout age youth may handle coed Scouting differently from older youth. Overall, I think our Pack’s implantation was successful. We have an active and growing pack that can serve all youth.

It’s been a while with number updates, but National is stating over 73,000 girls are in Cub Scouts.

Just curious... what do you use your membership card for? I have a note on my phone with my ID number, so have never used my card. Just curious when you use your card. For packs this makes sense as I think most kids/parents throw them out or lose them. The certificates sit in a plastic file cabinet in my office. I guess it is nice for historical purposes.... but again if this saves paper and cost (as most units probably won’t even print them out) it seems like it could be a good idea.

If “It’s a Wonderful Life” is a Christmas movie, then Die Hard and Gremlins are as well. Case closed! Merry Christmas!

BSA just settled 19 suits in Idaho (LDS Troops). Not sure if the Church settled as well. https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/northwest/idaho/article223365950.html I found this comment to be interesting.... “From what we understand the only way these [four new] settlements will work is if the Boy Scouts do not file for bankruptcy for at least 90 days,” Dumas said. “If they file within 90 days, these settlements may be at risk. We really do not know what will happen.”

I can’t find any official statement, but based upon FB chatter from adults who had daughters in BSA photo shoots for the new handbook - the new female cut uniforms will be available in Scoutshops by Feb 1 - there is virtually no change from the current uniform other than fit It sounds like they dumped the idea of a major uniform change that was floated earlier. Again, not official but they did share some pictures that seemed to validate their story.

Catholic Church, USA swimming, USA Gymnastics, US Soccer all have had issues. Any group that deals with youth better have strong YPT training and background checks or face lawsuits. This is not BSA unique. For example, see this law that went into effect this year https://unitedsoccercoaches.org/web/web/News/Articles/March_2018/New_Law_Brings_New_Responsibility_to_Youth_Coaches.aspx

Yes, I have seen COs (only when churches) named as many times the individual, church, council and national are all being sued at once. https://www.ajc.com/news/breaking-news/another-georgia-boy-scout-leader-sued-for-sex-abuse/zHH6ygpw9CAlhnygOVpCXP/ https://nypost.com/2018/07/24/4-men-sue-boy-scouts-of-america-over-alleged-sexual-abuse/ I’m sure more are coming https://www.classaction.com/child-sexual-abuse/boy-scout-lawsuit/

Stepping aside from the debate regarding the point of religion, I don’t see much upside for the BSA if the drop the faith requirement. It is already extremely weak tea. There is not a large new member group out there that would join (such as when they added girls) and I haven’t heard widespread loss of corporate sponsors or COs like I saw with excluding gays. All that would happen is further controversy and loss of experienced members. In my pack, which is essential tied to a public school, we tell parents to handle the duty to God requirements and let us know when they are complete. Yes, I’m sure that there are a few kids and adults that are excluded and more that are uncomfortable with the religious aspects, but BSA needs some stability now and I don’t see this as something they should stir up anytime soon. I don’t lose kids to g,g,g.... I lose kids due to band, soccer, hockey, friends and fortnite.

I’m sure they are thinking FOS impact... and I don’t blame them. People will not want to give to FOS if they think the money will simply to to Nationals and be part of a bankruptcy fund. I was already asked by multiple parents if they should stop buying popcorn or contribute to FOS until after the bankruptcy.... Councils need to get their message out quickly or they will see major losses in donations.

I hope Philmont would be safe given your comments. But what about Sea Base? I was really hoping to go there with my son in a few years.... but I could imagine that is prime real estate. Hope that they can hold onto it.

It’s not the end of a National office if BSA does proceed with bankruptcy. I think BSA could protect anything that generates net income and is critical to their continued existence... which I think would include the HA camps they own; however, I’m not 100% sure on that and I’m concerned that a judge would decide if they have to sell Philmont. I’m also concerned for the employees. It seems like typically the highest level employees (and highest paid) are rarely impacted as much as lower level (and in my view more critical) ones. Pensions, benefits and salaries could be at risk... I hope any impact would be minimal. My understanding is that this would force all lawsuits to stall and into settlement talks. I would expect BSA would setup a victims fund similar to the Catholic Church. I hope that fund is large enough to cause significant pain to BSA so they ensure our organization never Harbors those creeps again. I believe this will also halt the damages aspect of the GSUSA lawsuit. Perhaps that will force the two organizations to figure out how BSA can add girls without causing massive confusion with GSUSA. Finally, I hope this would then be a new beginning. BSA could look at using this to stop (or at least minimize) making decisions based solely on insurance actuaries and income. They can put the threat of massive litigation and bad contracts behind them and hopefully restructure.... ensuring more funds remain local and keeping overhead down. One can hope....

Assets at risk... 1- Summit appears On National’s balance sheet as a major land asset at over $370M. Other high Adventure bases (not specially listed) show up as $60M. 2 - $800M of various financial assets 3 - $258M endowment Financial Condition-from annual report The National Council’s financial condition for 2018 and the next few years will depend, in large part, upon three factors. The first is the outcome of the litigation discussed within this report (see Note 9) and the impact to GLIP (Note 7). The second lies with the success of securing donations for the Summit project in order to continue to pay bond payments as scheduled and maintaining compliance with debt covenants. The third factor is the economy and legislation and their effect on market conditions and liquidity requirements. Note 7 This is about their General insurance program.... Note 9 .... There continues to be additional lawsuits filed alleging sexual abuse, including claims for punitive damages. The National Council could be required to pay damages out of its own funds to the extent the claims are not covered by insurance or if the insurance carriers are unable or unwilling to honor the claims. Based upon the nature of and management’s understanding of the facts and circumstances that give rise to such actions and claims, management believes the reserves established by the General Liability Insurance Program of the National Council are sufficient to provide for the resolution of these lawsuits. However, in the event the General Liability Insurance Program or its reserves are insufficient to resolve such claims, it is the opinion of the National Council that the total amount of payments to resolve current and future claims could have a significant impact on the financial position or results of operations of the National Council in the future.

The Eagle Scout award .... 😳

I am writing to you today in anticipation of news reports that will speculate about the BSA’s financial position. We have an important duty, and an incredible opportunity, to focus as an organization on keeping children safe, supported and protected, and preparing youth for their futures through our nation’s foremost program of character development and values-based leadership training. To do so in perpetuity, we are working with experts to explore all options available to ensure that the local and national programming of the Boy Scout of America continues uninterrupted. We have a social and moral responsibility to fairly compensate victims who suffered abuse during their time in Scouting, and we also have an obligation to carry out our mission to serve youth, families and local communities through our programs. We care deeply about all victims of child sex abuse and we are steadfast in our belief that one incident of child abuse is one too many. We sincerely apologize to anyone who was harmed during their time in our programs. As you all know, we have always taken care of victims – we believe them, we believe in fairly compensating them and we have paid for unlimited counseling, by a provider of their choice, regardless of the amount of time that has passed since an instance of abuse. Throughout our history we have taken proactive steps to help victims heal and prevent future abuse. I want to stress that at no time in our history have we knowingly allowed a sexual predator to work with youth, and we always seek to act swiftly when alerted to abuse allegations. Please know that these matters continue to have the full attention of the highest levels of our organization, and we will communicate transparently as there are developments or updates to share. I wanted to update you today due to the news speculation, and I want to assure you that our daily mission will continue and that there are no imminent actions or immediate decisions expected. Thank you for your continued support of the Boy Scouts of America. Michael B. Surbaugh Chief Scout Executive Boy Scouts of America 1325 West Walnut Hill Lane Irving, TX 75038 Copyright © 2018 Boy Scouts of America. All rights reserved.

There wasn’t much beyond the first paragraph. This is one key “Filing for bankruptcy would put the brakes on the litigation and give the nonprofit the chance to negotiate with victims who have sued.” I think the GSUSA damages (if any) could be lumped in. However, bankruptcy could lead to some ugly outcomes.

I think anyone looking at the annual reports could see this coming. This is horrible news and I am very concerned about loss of camps and property. One glimmer of hope.... many organizations rise from the ashes and prosper.... I certainly hope BSA will.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/boy-scouts-of-america-considers-bankruptcy-filing-amid-sex-abuse-lawsuits-11544649657

As a Cub Scout Leader who is going through recharter, I can tell you we are losing scouts to sports and busy parents. I have had 0 parents tell me that girls, gays or god made a difference with their membership. What I have been told has been 2 major reasons for not joining or dropping.... - both parents work schedules are too much to support their child in scouts... if they could simply drop them off at meetings and outings... that could work. They don’t have time to help their son with PWD, etc.... already too busy. - Sports....they see sports, especially for boys, as the best way to grow their son. For those inside the program, we know the unique benefits and experience scouts provides. I don’t see the general parent population seeing it outside of the Eagle Scout. My guess is that if they de-emphasized Eagle, you would see even faster attrition... it is the one topic I consistently have parents from outside scouting ask me about when considering joining.

So much discussion about the names got me thinking about the famous Romeo and Juliet line that fits this discussion .... “What's in a name? That which we call a roseBy any other name would smell as sweet." That got me thinking that someone could rewrite Romeo and Juliet to be a tragic story of two lovers... one from the house of BSA and the other GSUSA. I then switched Juliet to Juliette given the GSUSA reference.

Usually it is about cub scouts crossing over this spring... so in that case the parents are right (correcting me when I say Boy Scouts). That said, I have also had the snarky response from a few like you mention.

I was wondering where they would define what to call members of Scouts BSA... thanks for the link. I’ve only remembered seeing references to the program name. I expect if 5-10 years, perhaps 50 based upon our UK friends’ experience, scouts will clearly mean Scouts BSA and Girl Scouts will be GSUSA. That is unless GSUSA changes to Girl Guides. So, if a girl is in Scouts BSA she would say... I’m a scout. If she is in Girl Scouts she would state I’m a Girl Scout. Boys will probably either call themselves scouts or Boy Scouts.... either should work. Just had a thought.... I see a new take on Romeo and Juliette (see what I did there). Romeo is an Eagle Scout and Juliette is a Gold Scout.... you know the rest...”what’s in a name.” I’m surprised how quickly my area is already switching over to saying Scouts BSA. I hear it from parents (those with kids in BSA) who correct me when I say Boy Scouts.

They want us to say “Scouts BSA”. Where do you see BSA staying “We are Scouts....”?

Some good guidance and info regarding Scouts BSA recruiting and how to handle questions about GSUSA. I would highly recommend reviewing these if you plan to setup a Scouts BSA Girls Troop. This was released to councils today. Brand-Guidance-Talking-Points-for-Scouts-BSA-Info-Sessions-1.pdf BSA-Messaging-to-Staff-and-Volunteers-12-5-18.pdf FINAL Brand Training 12-4-18.pdf

More info just announced... Not sure how you get added yet. In anticipation of the Scouts BSA launch on February 1, 2019, families are already looking for units forming in their area. To help youth join scouts, the BSA has added new functionality that allows councils to display “Coming Soon” units in BeAScout.org.