Eagle1993

I hope so. I’m just not convinced the BSA evolves quickly enough to survive this.

To be clear. The TCC legal team, accountants, etc are all billed to BSA. They have to pay them. They are not working on contingency.

They get $1M per month. The TCC lawyers do at least.

Part of me thinks National gets it. They are only protecting their “restricted” assets. If the judge decides they are not “restricted” they will go to the Trust. The TCC announced they will sue JP Morgan (likely over the Philmont line of credit). So National is pretty clear... decide if HA bases are protected and clear up the JP Morgan mess. The billion dollar question is the hundreds of local councils. Will they get it and turn over everything. I’m not convinced. COs I expect will head down the lawsuit path.

Not your fault. I hope BSA goes back to their documents and really looks at what are restricted assets and offers everything else. Then build a non CO model as I expect COs are gone.. Then settle with protection for the LCs and let the COs fend for themselves. If they do this, BSA can survive. I just don’t trust BSA’s leadership and I think they will realize this too late in the process and we will lose most of our camps.

I clarified in a later post. I agree.

To be clear... this is to pressure LC and COs to pay up proactively. If they can essentially get a liquidation value from the majority of councils I expect they would push for approval and blocking lawsuits. COa haven’t offered a dime. LCs offer was small. So either deal with 20-40 thousand lawsuits or pay up.

I hope you are right. I really do. However, they have hired forensic accountants to go over every LC asset. It if isn’t restricted it should go to the trust. We may lose a ton of local camps.

They are telling every individual (83,000) to file every individual lawsuit they can against CO and LCs based on their rights. Some cannot file due to SOLs but 10,000s will.

National isn’t the issue. They plan to go after 7 sources of income. 1) National assets 2) National insurance companies 3) Local Council Assets 4) LC insurance companies 5) CO assets 6) CO insurance companies 7) Individual assets I expect lawsuits to go on for years, leaving to loss of COs and local camps with a decade or so of bankruptcies of churches, LCs, clubs, etc. Or BSA the LCs and COs really increase their offer until 66% approve.

Dont think because there is a bunch of NAs the data doesn’t exist. Many claims have the details just in the wrong fields and they are working through that. Expect council and CO claims to increase. Minimum payment of plan must be at least equal to liquidation of BSA. So they are comparing plan to total liquidation of the BSA and the plan must meet that at minimum. Their accountants are working through that now. Creditors cannot force a non profit into chapter 7. The court cannot convert to chapter 7. BSA can convert it on its own. Bankruptcy case can be dismissed which means each individual can sue BSA individually. They spent time telling individuals how to obtain counsel. Get ready for a wave of CO and LC lawsuits this summer.

Yes. It’s over. 13,000 claims since YPT.

TCC will ask court permission to sue JP Morgan over their loans as they have legal issues (for example Philmont). TCC is not interested in the future of the BSA. Their job is to maximize the payout. However, they plan to require the BSA to release their ineligible volunteer list. They are recommending each individual to prepare and start filing lawsuits against: COs LCs Individuals April 15 will likely end up not even approving the plan for a vote ... far too many issues. They have worked with 18 sex abuse bankruptcies .. there have been 0 cramdowns. Judges do not do that to sex abuse claimants. So, essentially, the bankruptcy will only be accepted when 66% of the claimants approve.

There are more claims here against the Catholic Church than all of their bankruptcy settlements combined. Most councils have appear to have enough claims to drive them into bankruptcy if court cases can proceed (depending on their state). It would be interesting to see claims by year by council. COs as well. Over 3,000 claims in the 2000s. Many of these are recent enough to pursue criminal charges.

100% agree. I have never told scouts not to meet and work on advancement together. Many times, I suggest scouts work together outside of our meetings in small groups (i.e., reach out to our Troop Guide to review your knots, etc.). I see this like any sport ... would anyone tell a kid not to practice soccer with his friends? My issue is that YPT is written in a way that scouts working together on low risk activities appears to require 2 adult leaders. Technically one could argue that one scout should not call another scout to discuss their patrol flag design without two registered adults on that call as that call would be a scouting activity. Currently, we do not interpret it that strictly but I could see others would disagree. I wish they would update YPT/G2SS to allow flexibility of scouts meeting on their own for low risk activities. In town patrol meetings, in town short distance hikes, etc. I'm fine with requiring adults for overnight campouts or higher risk activities ... but let the scouts meet together without parents/adults breathing down their necks.

The agreement to extend the injunction also prohibits any local council from selling or transferring any property with the intent to hinder or defraud creditors, or without receiving compensation that equals the property's value. The agreement also prohibits local councils from designating unrestricted assets as restricted “by board resolution or otherwise,” including proceeds from the sale of assets.

According to someone, this is because the TCC lawyers get $850K a month in fees ... so they are in no rush to close on these decisions.

I think it makes sense vs National as the old National BSA is gone. Good question about local councils as they technically didn't go bankrupt. There would be a settlement for the 95,000 claimants ... but if someone wasn't part of the national bankruptcy could they still sue the local council?

100% agree. Note the USA Gymnastics' case was a $250M offer for 500 victims in January 2020. The judge is pushing back hard against the USA OC and said don't use your insurance companies as a crutch ... dig into your wallet. See that date ... January 2020 for nearly $500K per victim. BSA's offer is $6K per victim. No judge is going to use a cramdown with that low. If BSA doesn't simply give up, I expect this to last well into 2022 or 2023. There is 0% chance this ends this year unless BSA files Chapter 7. The big question ... will LC lawsuits be on hold until 2022 or 2023. I doubt it ... if the judge rules they are separate entities (National & LCs) and doesn't see fast progress to a settlement, its hard to see how she can continue to bar the lawsuits against LCs from proceeding. There is already pressure to lift the hold now ... I cannot imagine she bars lawsuits beyond this year. My one, slight fear right now.... The summer camp we use and love is owned by a council that would likely be sued into bankruptcy (just a guess as it is in a populated area in a state with a generous SOL law). Those are the lawsuits that will really hit our units. Right now, its just interesting forum discussions and has no impact in my unit operations. It gets real with LC and/or CO lawsuits.

Yes. Only that the "go fight the insurance companies" adds a clause that there are non settlement trust fights against the insurance companies and the $$ must be shared between all. What was mentioned, now my multiple insurance companies, that the BSA's plan did not detail out HOW the Settlement Trust would operate post bankruptcy. They mentioned BSA had listed an appendix but it was blank. Therefore, BSA does not have a "plan" that could even go to a vote. A second insurance company group joined Hartford, objecting to BSA's submission. They are asking for an review and determination on claimants before proceeding and saying BSA's plan cannot go for a vote until this is done. BSA is essentially arguing none of this matters as they are running out of money so vote on this by August or they will liquidate in September. They are requesting the judge approve the plan for a vote (I believe in mid April). Voting would take until mid July and a court hearing late July would decide the fate of the plan. What are real risks vs negotiating tactics .. who knows.

There were a bunch of articles at the time. https://www.firstcoastnews.com/article/news/investigations/boy-scouts-sexual-abuse-investigation/77-6b587579-410a-4f37-a9a0-d7f3cb0000b6 "On December 1st, New Jersey is giving people who say they were abused more time to file suit. The statute of limitations is changing from age 20 to age 55. That's significant because the national headquarters of the Boy Scouts of America was in New Jersey from 1954 to 1978."

I agree with that ... in my mind I was thinking civil. There is no SOL for murder and there shouldn't be one for child sex abuse in terms of criminal charges.

I think that depends. If it’s due to people in their 20s and 30s coming out and the perps are still employed by the Methodist Church most would say let them go bankrupt. If the perps are dead and the victims are in their 50s+ I tend to agree there would be SOL pushback. IMHO, I don’t agree there should be no SOL but at the same time, 21 seems far too young. If you were raped at 11 it may take until your 30s to really seek justice and that should be allowed. It may take longer but there is a trade off at some point. 21 seems too early. 50 seems to late.

My understanding is that in 1978 and prior, BSA had its HQ in New York and New Jersey. Both states have updated their SOL. So, for any abuse nationally, 1978 and prior, lawsuits against National could pursue. Post 1978 it would likely then go per state law. Now there are 30+ states with their own SOL changes. Now the question is, since BSA is declaring bankruptcy, did they give up the right to defend against abuse after 1978 and outside the current state’s SOL? Is that the 57,000 reference?

Is this another $11M legal fee for the BSA? https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/877519_2330.pdf