Eagle1993

Thanks for this info. If they are willing to hold up a $10B bankruptcy like Purdue, why wouldn't they hold up $2.4B BSA bankruptcy based on the same arguments when only $7M was spent to date. I hope they don't hold it up and agree that it doesn't mean they plan to overrule Purdue, I just question overuse of mootness. In terms of the Purdue decision I hold to my initial thoughts post arguments... they find a way to uphold the plan, but it will be close and perhaps set a new bar for 3rd party releases. Would uphold Purdue plan: Thomas, Kavanaugh Would reject Purdue plan: Gorsuch, Barrett, Jackson On the fence (or just tougher to read): Roberts, Alito, Sotomayor, Kagan

Usually when I don't respond timely to a scout, either a text cc to parent or a short email reminder helps. Perhaps just ask the SM and coach if there are other methods of communication that would work. If that doesn't work, fully agree about reaching out beyond your unit. I just checked my email .. OA elections, summer camp planning and updates, two eagle scout projects, troop meeting prep and an eagle scout SM conference... oh, and a job, sick pet, home repairs, wife, etc. 😀

My understanding is that all appeal litigation must end before insurance companies make their full payments.

$2,333 per survivor .... This will be a big decision. I'm not sure paying out 0.2% of the settlement is enough to say it is too late to pause. That said, I do agree that it is likely the best settlement for survivors and BSA. It will be interesting to see how the court rules.

Here is the screenshot from National...

Nothing beyond that screenshot. I would think everything else in the process is unchanged. I do think this could open up the option of adults having to directly use a third party for the background check. I have to do that for other youth orgs, get the certificate and then can submit my registration. We will see ..

Our Troop used to go to LeFeber which was shuttered and then CFL which was shuttered. Bay Lakes is down to two Scouts BSA summer camps (Bear Paw and Hiawatha (which only runs 2 weeks)).

Just received email of another delay in spending out our 2024 summer camp guide. I noted that summer 2023 seemed lighter in attendance than prior years and I think that is causing issues with plans for 2024. Has anyone else seen 2024 summer camp plans change from prior years? "With declining membership in Bay-Lakes Council, as with most councils across the country, there are serious, but not insurmountable financial repercussions. These budgetary considerations need to be dealt with wholistically to ensure the viability of the Scouting program in Northeast Wisconsin and Upper Michigan. Part of that wholistic approach must include a careful examination of how best to provide world-class programing while reducing costs and increasing revenues at our summer camps."

I don't disagree this is a concern. I've read the book and highly recommend it. It was both entertaining and informative. Add in AI and I think we have the trifecta of ways we can destroy ourselves and the planet.

Earlier this year I worked through Ansestery.com to research my family linage. I was able to find family members in the USA back in the 1600s. For the most part it was interesting and in some cases I was able to find a lot of interesting details. Unfortunately, I found a couple who had records of owning slaves (my 9th great grandfather/mother and a 10th great grandfather). That started a discussion with my coworkers ... what horrible thing are we doing now that our 9th great grandchildren will look back in horror (as they comb through Facebook, Twitter and Scouter.com archives). Nearly unanimously we agreed ... the burning of hydrocarbons. While there is definitely debate how quickly warming will hit, it is clear our CO2 levels are already exceeding any level seen in the last 2M+ years and they continue to rise. Listening to some climate scientists talk, it appears the real hoax is that the scientific community is understating the future impact. Rarely do they talk beyond the year 2100 and many models assume massive reductions in C02 emissions ... and there is reason for that. If everyone knew how bad it is going to get (based on what has already been done) governments and citizens may simply give up. While we won't be alive to see the greatest impacts, I do think we are responsible (similar to my 9th great grandfather's ownership of slaves) and should help turn the tides. In terms of the WOSM taking a stand .... I'm not sure what drove them to do that. However, I do see scouts as stewards of the environment. Perhaps someone thought the forest fairies have concerns greater than a small piece of packaging. I don't know if their statement will help and in general, I have not been impressed with the solutions presented (many are too expensive or require too great of change in lifestyle). That said, I don't have an issue with scouting organizations putting pressure (within reason) on governments to protect the environment.

One could argue that reducing CO2 is very much in line with leave no trace and the outdoor code.

I think parents are less interested in volunteering for any activity; however, scouting takes more time than most. In K5, if you make the mistake of signing up to be a den leader, you are looking at 9 months x 6 years (54 months of volunteer work). If you sign up to coach a kids soccer team, that may be 3 months of work and absolutely no expectations you would do that every year going forward. In addition, the number of adults required to run a good pack is excessive (12 den leaders, Cub Master, ACM, CC, COR and a few other committee members). If you have a pack of 80-90 kids this is achievable... If you have 10-20 impossible. I talked with a few pack leaders recently and it doesn't look good. The program needs to greatly simplify and the changes made were not sufficient. BSA may need to look at other sources of volunteers (than parents) even at the unit level.

Listened to the argument. My thought (again who knows): Would uphold Purdue plan: Thomas, Kavanaugh Would reject Purdue plan: Gorsuch, Barrett, Jackson On the fence (or just tougher to read): Roberts, Alito, Sotomayor, Kagan Boy Scouts Plan was brought up and the DOJ indicated it may still be ok as appeals could be considered moot. I do think there is a lot of concern of what will happen if the plan is rejected and the DOJ didn't do a good job explaining that. So, I could see a path where they accept the plan and perhaps set a high bar on non-consensual releases. If I had to be, I would bet there.

This has been debated previously and there are differing opinions. That said, organizations are responsible for both paid staff and volunteers. If an organization was so poorly run and organized to allow volunteers to repeatedly rape children, I do think that organization should be held accountable. In addition, there is evidence that BSA intentionally covered this up. While I understand society changed over time (background checks didn't exist in the past) I really struggle with the cover up that seemed to be occurring at national. BSA could have decided to fight this in court, but they decided to declare bankruptcy instead. I think most agree that is a poor method of working through the history of abuse and what results is far from imperfect.

Unbelievable....

Any talk about the future of the BSA must begin with the financial situation it is in. Unlike most bankruptcies, BSA doesn't leave it nearly debt free and in stable financial shape. They entered bankruptcy with nearly $300M in cash and $180M endowment. The endowment is gone and cash is at $25M. They also added to their debt right before the bankruptcy ... and exited with all of that debt $222M of secured debt (I believe on their HA bases) and $364M of debt on Summit. So, $25M of cash on hand and $586M of debt. Let's say that loan is 4% and 30 years ... that is $34M a year in debt payments starting back up. Or ... $34 per every scout per year. At $80 per scout in National Fees, removing $34 for debt and likely $50 for insurance doesn't leaves any room to pay anyone at National. They need to refill their endowment and find a way to reduce that debt fast. Growing membership will be important, but $80 per scout won't get them out of this hole fast enough.

They paid Mosby over $500K per year (full C&B).

I'm sure Sea Scouts/Venturing cost money at National. There is some amount of insurance, some attention form leadership, etc. If numbers keep dropping there will be a risk vs return point where BSA feels it is no longer worth the risk/cost of supporting the programs. BSA gets about $1M of revenue a year from them (from fees)... much of that probably goes to insurance. So in terms of fees., the number of members left provide little revenue to offset any cost. If they get a lot of donations backing these programs, they will last. If donors don't care much about these programs... My guess they are at risk. So donations will really be key to keep them around long term. I really think the future of the BSA will be based on donors. What do individual and corporate donors want to see in a scouting program. Looking forward to our new AI offerings ...

Our Troop will likely hit around 24 scouts by the end of the year. 5 years ago we were 84 and had 53 attend summer camp. 12 of my 24 age out by 2025, so we really need to see more Cubs crossing over soon. Two other Troops in my area have shuttered and one went from 70-80 to 8. I fear we are headed to a future of BSA having 90% of members in Cub Scouts and Scouts BSA limited to a small barely supported group maintaining a tradition.

I bet we do see overall growth Jan to Jan by the end of the year (the would need to add at least 11,902 more scouts). However, rechartering impact probably won't be officially counted until March. Expect the revised Cub and Scouts BSA to show declines there. I think in Jan 2023 we showed 3% overall growth which was nearly completely wiped away by March. Personally I think the March to March numbers are most accurate (however, that will change going forward with rolling renewals).

The full year membership + increasing council fees are a concern. I know our Council is pouring everything into Cub Scouts (almost ignoring Scouts BSA outside of Merit Badge clinics). Hopefully that works as the Scout BSA Troops are really starting to suffer from the lean Cub Scout years.

Any updates on how recruiting looks this fall? I seem to remember seeing a lot of updates last fall, in terms of major growth of Cub Scouts, but haven't seen the same updates this one. Curious if anyone has seen Cub Scouts continuing to grow and any turn around in Scouts BSA.

That research was likely before the addition of Lions. I just met a pack yesterday and they are desperate to transition AOLs ASAP. Kids and parents are burnt out, limited interest left in Cub Scouts. Pack leaders said if transition waits until May we may only see one kid. Ive seen transitions diminished over the last 3 years. Some of that is COVID but Pack leaders are telling me burn out it hitting during 4th grade. I'm not sure if the new program is better, but retention is currently really bad, not sure it can get worse.