Eagle1993

I moved the "On My Honor" trailer/comments to a new topic. SCOUTER Forum

What was presented in court wasn't the Churchill Plan ... at least that term was never listed in any slide they displayed in court. The Churchill Plan dates back to 2020 or perhaps before. What was shown in court was from a senior executive meeting held at Philmont in August of 2021. This was not a big group of volunteers ... this appears to have been a meeting of senior staff/volunteers. My guess is only those watching the court hearing plus a few others have any clue what was discussed. I am also curious if/when the hearing recordings are released.

Not exactly an appeal. You can read the lengthy twitter thread below which details out the appeals process in bankruptcy. She includes a comment about BSA's case. The district court sounds like more of an "approval" of the bankruptcy vs appeal. I believe the debtor lawyers gets the choice of the path. What is interesting is that once district approves the bankrutpcy, the appeals process could be moot. Basically, by the time any appeal can be heard or reviewed, the bankruptcy is done. In #BoyScouts bankruptcy, case has been overseen entirely by bankruptcy judge. If she confirms plan, lawyers say they will immediately seek district court approval too.* *Authority for that procedure you ask? Probably a riff on other parts of 28 USC 157. 15/x Prof. Jacoby on Twitter: "Here is a thread on appeals from bankruptcy court decisions. Cannot say it is by popular demand - more by demand by a popular person! @alahav 1/x" / Twitter

Started new topic here as the hearing is now complete. Chapter 11 - Part 10

Hopefully this is the last topic on bankruptcy. The hearing is now closed. A few remaining items will be filed, tweaking the language in the plan. Then the bankruptcy judge will rule followed by district (assuming she confirms the plan). We can use this topic to discuss the case. If the discussion strays from the legal bankruptcy case (for example, price of Cub Scout books and belt loops) please use new topics. Thanks in advance for keeping the discussion scoutlike.

Dr. Doug Kennedy made an impassioned speech to the court and asked the Judge to keep her focus on the survivors as she makes her decision(s). Jessica Lauria thanks the court for the time devoted. A few more letters/filings will come in on the docket including minor changes to the plan (coming in next week). Next Friday will be a general hearing and the only topic is the sale of the BSA distribution center. Judge thanks all of the staff that made this so smooth. Hearing was pulled off very well and great teamwork between firms. February 2020 until mid April 2022. Matter is under advisement. Confirmation hearing is closed!

Seemed to be going well until right now. Judge seems to see some issues that BSA insurance counsel cannot defend well. Basically, non settling insurers are saying yes you can transfer the policies but that comes with the benefits and burdens. It is really a debate around language in the plan. It may require some clarifications in the plan. BSA doesn't disagree ... sounds like it is just working through proper language. Judge never entered in order (That she recalls) that assigns a contract & also by the way here is a bunch of stuff about it. Basically, she wants to say the trust is assigned the rights. She is concerned there is professions touching on post assignment and she doesn't do that. If there are issues with insurance honoring their contract ... take it to state court. Judge is working through this out loud as there could be some mechanics about payment of claims. I don't see this as a roadblock, more like a speed bump. She doesn't seem to agree with how it is written today. 4:30 eastern ... still hopeful arguments close today.

BSA, Ad Hoc LC, Century lawyers presented so far this morning. Very convincing arguments to approve the plan. They are pointing out clear factual errors that were made by opponents. It feels like this is wrapping up today.

Judge says ... I have 45 mins more today. I just heard a "Jesus Christ". So, it will go on tomorrow.

The good news is that BSA is making improvements. They do have online applications for youth and adults. They did buy Scoutbook which greatly improved tracking advancement. I'm glad they see this as an area to invest. However, I think they have a long way to go. I hope post bankruptcy, they further fund IT including providing better IT services to councils. This should not require $XXM of solutions. There are much smaller organizations with much less funding that have better IT solutions. The signing up of volunteers is typically their first experience with BSA. Nearly every volunteer I signed up had issues with training not working, payments, delays with COR approvals, etc. I guess my thought is that the volunteer signup is likely an easy area to address vs attempting to relook at major program content, merging councils, etc.

I really question this for TCJC. Basically, nearly every single boy in LDS was a scout. Since all LDS wards were COs, I wonder if TCJC sees this as a path to deal with 100% of all male sex abuse. The judge needs to be careful here ... LDS is very unique.

I think there could be a major issue. TCJC releases. What if you have a Ward leader who abuses a youth within the Ward as both a Scoutmaster and a leader within the ward. The TCJC believes this bankruptcy deals in total with that youth (since it involved scouting at some point). It is not clear that can be allowed. TCJC said they would never contribute the amount they did if that isn't the case.

I have spent years signing up adult leaders. While it is slightly better, it involves chasing down paperwork, chasing down signatures, chasing down money and a bit of a repeat every year for recharter. I just signed up to be a high school mountain bike coach on the NICA site. The Team Coach sent me a personal link. That ended their interaction/involvement. I completed all of my documentation online, including my health form and insurance info. I completed signing various wavers on line. I submitted for a background check online. I know the company who did it. I already know the results (1 hour later). I have an account to follow up if needed. I paid for this directly $38 and it includes a monthly check. I was able to see I passed a DOJ Sex register and some other checks. I can also use this for other orgs now (FIRST Robotics used the same company). I submitted my payment (only allowed if background check passed). $25 for registration During payment, they ask for an additional donation (optional). Now my training is available ... right on the same site, very easy to interact with. Required training is concussion (annual), Coach license level 1 (every 2 years), NICA Philosophy and Risk Management (annual) and Athlete Abuse Awareness Training (every 2 years) It was fast, clear and rather painless. The team head coach didn't need to sign off. I didn't have to list a bunch of stuff on a small form of references that no one will call. I certainly hope BSA is looking at other organizations on the future of signing up adult volunteers. There are groups out there that are far smaller that give a much better onboarding experience while limiting the demand on existing volunteers.

In court, BSA lawyer said it is critical for BSA to exit bankruptcy by summer as they run completely out of liquidity by then. They have agreement to receive a loan (I believe from a trust) to deal with their cash flow ... however, that can only occur if BSA exits bankruptcy.

Judge seemed very sympathetic to their points and didn't like BSA's response. Basically the GSUSA is expecting at least $17M. The insurance BSA set aside for them has limitations that will likely prevent that payout (even if GSUSA wins in court). BSA's point is their case sucks and there is no chance they are going to win. The judge basically that may be true but you still need to be ready in case they do win. Or.. she may just say district court's decision makes it highly unlikely for GSUSA to win so let's move on.

I have yet to see a single one of their arguments land. I think at one point Wollf talked for an hour (perhaps it was less, but it seemed like an hour). No questions from the judge just a thank you. The times I see a lawyer winning some points is when I see the judge more engaged. If you talk for an hour and just get a thank you ... To be fair, the DOJ also typically just gets thank yous but at least he only talks for 5 mins.

I think I fixed it correctly.

Yes. After looking at the term sheet and hearing discussions, it sounds like the Roman Catholic Church is not yet a participating chartered organization. They simply no longer op out and no longer objecting to the plan. Note there is still two diocese who are op out charter orgs (and I think 1 objecting). I think Agana and San Jose are the two.

Yes, I should have clarified. The UMC & LDS are also protected (just like LCs). The debate is around allowing the injunction to go for 1 year for non settling COs.

The channeling discussion that is being discussed as part of the plan is just for chartered organizations other than the Methodist & LDS. In the plan, there is a 1 year channeling injunction to give the remaining COs time to reach a settlement with the trust. After that 1 year, lawsuits can proceed. LCs are protected as part of the plan. They are protected forever for claims prior to Feb 2020.

After two full days of closing, the judge summarized the 1 issue (so far) she has to decide. - Are the TDPs fair based on the evidence presented - Should she even decide if they are fair That's it. I think the fraud arguments, venue arguments, bad faith, etc. all failed to land any punches. Now, there are more arguments coming up ... but so far, I think she is looking at narrow issues of law.

I'll argue they do far better than BSA in K5 - 5th grade. 6th - 12th grade GSUSA faulters unless you have some great Troop leaders. Also, talking with several of my den leaders who are also GSUSA leaders .. GSUSA is much cheaper AND simpler to run than BSA units. Most of our GSUSA Troops have thousands in the bank by 5th grade. I wonder if BSA should consider the GSUSA model for K5 - 5th grade and keep the Troop model for 6th - 12th. I thought this was interesting as it happened yesterday. My daughter just took her annual GSUSA survey. They asked ... what would you say to a friend who isn't in GSUSA about GSUSA. She answered that all of her friends are already in Girl Scouts (which is true). Then they asked what would be one thing she would change with the program. She wrote ... let boys in.

Based on the judge's comment yesterday, there is a 0.0000001% chance any further vetting of claims will be done before plan confirmation. Vetting will be done during trust distribution (except for $3500 payout).

To restart a new plan, go through voting, etc. could easily mean they would remain in bankruptcy through 2022. Their cash is near $0 by September and that assumes they can back off on bankruptcy expenses. It was interesting as it was the first time I heard anyone say it, but it seems clear, if this plan completely fails and is rejected, BSA will likely have to choose Chapter 7. Christian did give the judge a path to approval though ... I thought that was interesting. At least on the issues he raised today.

BSA counsel just said that if this plan is denied it will result in liquidation of BSA.