swilliams

Welp, the parent who has been helping me get Scoutbook rolling met up with our CC to show it to her. She told him she has no interest in continuing as CC. (As you can see from the original post, that's no surprise.) Might be time to put my money where my mouth is. We'll see if we can get another committee meeting scheduled before the end of the year and see what the other leaders' thoughts are. In the meantime, we're building cardboard box ovens, tying knots with rope (and licorice strings), and planning our three-mile hike. I found a packet of compass games to help teach compass skills, so maybe we'll try that as well.

Attendance at pack meetings is okay. I've found they're a little late for some families (7:30 - 9:00), mine included, but at least they're on Friday nights. Some meetings have received a better response than others - a favorite for a couple years running now is 'Parents vs. Scouts'. We haven't lost too many scouts, but we have lost some. When we moved here 2 1/2 years ago our pack was at about 50 scouts. It's hard to know how many we have now because we have some listed that I know have dropped, and some that are active but never turned in applications. We had 37 scouts who attended Pinewood Derby, so that's some sort of measure. I'm hearing increasing frustration from parents that they don't know what's going on, like upcoming events we'll have outside of pack meetings. We had an overnight at Battleship NJ in January, and there was at least one family that would have liked to have gone, but they didn't hear about it until after the deadline to sign up had passed. It seems we had a couple families that had been left off the email list. Probably because they never turned in applications, but I don't know for sure. I suggested last year that we have a 'new parent' meeting at the beginning of this year, but couldn't get it off the ground. I suggested using a Shutterfly share site, like our troop does, but that was nixed. This is that tricky issue of not stepping on toes again. If the CC and Cubmaster don't want to do it, then it's not likely to happen, and there's a limit to how hard I want to push. I really do like both these ladies, plus, it's kind of a small town. We're all going to be in each others' lives for the forseeable future, and bad blood doesn't help anything or anyone. I can't speak, really, to what other dens are doing. Ours has suffered a bit, but that's because of the illness our den leader's son is going through, and why I stepped in to help. We built birdhouses for the 'Build It' elective last meeting, and the boys really enjoyed it. We're trying to line up a visit to a construction site for this Saturday - hopefully we'll be past this winter storm by then. We actually have a formal Assistant Den Leader, but he's also our Treasurer and works full-time (and then some), so he hasn't been able to offer too much. I'm on the committee for our troop, and we're working on recruiting right now. Maybe I can find a diplomatic way to take some of the tools the troop is using, and get them applied at the pack level. Thinking on this now, recruiting is one area where I could probably say 'I can do X, Y, and Z', so that it's something concrete, rather than 'how can I help'. The CC is aware now, if she wasn't before, of the leaders who haven't done the Youth Protection.

Well, here's one positive thing that has come about from trying to get a system in place for advancements - even if we never use it. A Webelos scout showed up as being registered to our pack, but I had no idea who he was. I called council to see if maybe there was a mistake. There wasn't: he transferred to us from another pack in town that fell apart and didn't recharter. He's been on our roster since December, but no one ever reached out to him. I called and spoke to his mom - he'll be coming to our next den meeting.

A little background: I'm just a lowly grunt. Ran our Blue and Gold last year, then took over Advancements at the beginning of this school year. No one stepped up to take over Blue and Gold, so I'm still involved there, though at least I've been able to divide up the work load between myself and some other parents. (I've also been unofficially acting as Assistant Den Leader for Webelos, since the Den Leader's son has been quite ill.) The CC and Cubmaster don't seem to be trying to actively fill committee positions, have no plans for recruiting, have little interest in actually tracking advancements, etc. I'm becoming increasingly frustrated by the lack of leadership. Here's an example of what's going on. Another parent and I are trying to get our scouts' and leaders' information into Scoutbook. (The Cubmaster let our Packmaster subscription run out because "it's too hard and no one uses it". We only have records for one den from the previous year.) I asked our Council for BSA numbers for the leaders, so we could get them entered into Scoutbook, and I found that two of our den leaders didn't turn in an application, but did take Youth Protection, and four other adults turned in applications, but never took YPT so the pack was refunded and the applications are sitting in an 'error file'. At least two of those four adults are active in the pack. That's just one example of many little and not-so-little things. So the question is, how do you all deal with these kind of issues (assuming you're not the CC or Cubmaster)? Part of me says ignore it, it's not my problem, and my son will cross over in a year. The other part worries that if our pack continues to flounder, our older boys won't have anyone to lead when they've reached Star and Life. Maybe I'm making too big a deal about the records or having adults registered and trained properly? I've offered to lend a hand with whatever they might need, but that's gone nowhere. I've found it's usually more effective to say to someone, "I can do _____ for you", but I don't know what, specifically, they might need help with. I don't want to come across as a complainer/critic - I'd rather find a way to help fix things - but not sure what I can do without offending. Any advice is appreciated!

I can tell you my son doesn't want girls in the Troop. He's eleven, so his age may play a big part here. I went to pick my daughter up from a Confirmation class and noted that with the exception of three girls sitting in the last pew, all the boys were on one side of the church, and all the girls on the other. I asked my daughter if the teacher made them sit in segregated groups. Nope. We still haven't received any serious inquiries, so all this may end up being a moot point for us - at least for the foreseeable future.

It looks like Scoutbook Lite is the database, and Scoutbook is a more comprehensive tool for your Troop or Pack to do things like send out email, keep a calendar, etc., as well as enter your records. (Someone please correct that if I'm wrong, since I've not used either. This is just what the info out there points to.)

We're no longer licensed to use Packmaster, and only the Arrow of Light den leader (who was also the advancement chair) entered anything last year. No going back to it, which is why I created Excel sheets that duplicate the individual history report. I've been taking those reports and manually entering the achievements into Internet Advancement, so that there's some kind of record for the boys. One of our den leaders hasn't submitted anything at all this year, but just went out and bought all the belt loops and Wolf ranks and handed them out to his boys. When I told him the ranks are usually done at Blue and Gold he said, "Blue and Gold is stupid." Sometimes it's tempting to throw the towel in. We're slowly pulling things together, though.

I took over as Advancement Chair last fall. Our Cubmaster had declared Packmaster too difficult to use, and moved us to a site called Scoutlander. For months now, the advancement page has said 'in pilot, contact us if you'd like to use this feature'. The Cubmaster says she has tried to do this, but hasn't received a response. As a result, I've had nothing other than Internet Advancement and an Excel spreadsheet I created to work from. For who-knows-what reason, we'd never heard of Scoutbook until about a week ago, and we had no idea that this was going to replace Internet Advancement. (This forum is SO helpful. Glad I found it, and that there are others here who can share their knowledge.) I sat down this morning to take a closer look at Scoutbook, but we haven't signed up. I've been reading some dismal reviews, but it looks like there's not going to be any getting around it, if I'm interpreting correctly. Is there a thread on this forum about the details of using Scoutbook? This new chair position has me having the old recurring nightmares about showing up for a presentation completely unprepared, lol.

Hi Summerfun. I realize your post is slightly older, but wanted to add my two cents on the matter of the cultural and religious 'defined path'. As a non-practicing Mormon, I totally get this. Keep your chin up. Even though it's tough to face the disapproval you might get from some members, the example you'll set for your son and others by being strong and doing the right thing will outweigh bucking the cultural tide - particularly over time. If there are non-LDS troops nearby, I'd take your son for a visit and let him see what he thinks. Given the differences in the program, he may like it better.

I would also think trying to retain youth once they reach the age of 18 would be tough. Too many go away to college or university, and even if they're still living in the area where the crew is established, school commitments may keep young adults from being able to really participate fully. Still, we're going to give it a go for my daughter.

Venturing could use some serious PR. I'd never heard of it until last year, so out of curiosity, I asked around a bit. Of the 7 or 8 parents in our neighborhood with daughters my youngest son's age (9), only one of them thought they knew what it was. None of them could tell me which town(s) have crews near us. My almost 14 year old daughter does want high adventure, and will be joining Venturers in the fall.

I was told they come longer (like the unhemmed pants), and you have to make them the length you want. I haven't seen them in person, though.

My posts are guilty of going off-track. In my post about hosting the camping and backpacking meetings for adults, though, we're not trying to force the parents to become outdoorsy. We're trying to give them the option to see what it entails, in a way that's specifically geared for someone without much experience. It's up to them if they choose to do it, and I did express doubts about how many parents would show up. For some people, you can talk and explain and show pictures all you want, but they'll never really 'get' it without experiencing it. For others, it will be enough for them to see the results of what the outdoor program has done for their scouts. My boys started in scouting because my grandpa, dad and brothers were all scouts. To be honest, there were times in Cub Scouts that I wondered what the big deal was. Now that my older boy is in Boy Scouts, in a Troop that is not only very active and very service-oriented, but that camps every month and does a host of other outdoor activities, and after camping with them a couple times, I 'get' it. The first time I camped with them it wasn't because I really wanted to. It was because my boy is so very introverted that I was worried about how he was going to interact (or not) with a group of boys he didn't really know. I've camped with them a second time now, and plan on going whenever they're short of drivers or adults. There's nothing like seeing in person the way the Patrol Method functions when these boys are setting up camp, cooking, cleaning, planning hikes, etc. I'm more than willing to trade two miserable nights' sleep and latrines for these boys to be able to do what they do, after seeing how important it is. Others aren't ever going to do this. I doubt they're going to avoid the unit over it, though it might be worth asking whether they feel like they're being unduly pressured.

Someone at Council pointed out to me last week that there are some religions that don't allow girls to wear pants. I hadn't thought about that. Still, it would have been nice to see some of the girls in the pants. Of course, at the same time, the Cub Scout pants are so ill-fitting that I don't know anyone who wants them! My boys always just wore blue shorts or jeans. On the socks... my boys love their scout socks and want to wear them even when they're not in uniform.

Thanks for this. Having just taken over as Webelos/Arrow of Light Den Leader (we only have one AOL boy and no leader for him, and our regular den leader's son has been in and out of the hospital), things like this are good to know. I've done my YPT, but haven't looked at the den leader training yet. For this first couple weeks I've just been duplicating what my older son's den leader did with the boys, and have been focused on making sure the AOL boy can earn his rank before crossing over. My older son joined the Troop at the end of April last year. He and the other new boys were all advanced to Scout at the Court of Honor in September, and most (I think all but three) just advanced to Tenderfoot at the beginning of this month. One of those who didn't was also the only boy who didn't go to camp over the summer. As someone mentioned above, we're struggling with the physical fitness requirements right now. He's in between fall and spring sports, and has Health this quarter, rather than Phys Ed. Our Troop generally does advancements only at three Court of Honors, one fall, one winter and one spring. There are exceptions, but given that's the way it's usually done, most of our boys will rank up from Tenderfoot to Second Class at the fall COH - roughly 17 months after crossing over/joining. For those who go to camp, they might make First Class. Our Troop doesn't seem to be in any hurry to get the boys to Eagle. We have one 15 year old working on his project now, but most who reach Eagle are doing so at 17.

Our older boys went spelunking in PA last fall. I stayed behind with the younger boys, who visited Indian Echo caves, but when the others came back with the few pictures they were able to get in the dark, it gave me a little claustrophobia. I'm glad this boy is okay!

Our Scoutmaster, who builds fires with the stick and string and sleeps outdoors on every single trip, claims he was never outdoorsy. I didn't know him when he was Cubmaster, but he (a Brit) says he was influenced by Bear Grylls, and he started getting really into survival stuff when he became Scoutmaster. At the same time, he keeps baking us treacle tarts in the cardboard oven, lol.

Our Troop is going to be holding "Camping for Dummies" and "Backpacking for Dummies", specifically for adults, during our regular Troop meeting times. We'll see how many parents we have attend. I think it's a good idea for those who might be interested but aren't sure what equipment they need, or what we do on our trips, but I have my doubts as to how many will show. I'll report back mid-March.

Poor leadership. While Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts are distinctly different, I've watched our Pack going downhill pretty steadily in the last two years - since we've had a new CC and Cubmaster. Den Leaders aren't trained and have no idea what they're doing. Wolf den is already wearing their ranks, even though we haven't had our Blue and Gold, and the Den Leader never gave me a single advancement report. That by itself isn't catastrophic, but is a good illustration of how we're not giving the support needed to our leaders and they, in turn, aren't likely to be giving the boys all they could to make the program successful. At the same time, our Troop is soaring. Nine Eagle scouts last year, (eleven the year before) and you'd better believe they earned it. It means something to them due to how hard they had to work for it, and because our Troop doesn't hand them out like candy. Scouts are well aware of what their responsibilities are for the positions they hold. They've learned to evaluate their mistakes and recognize things done well. Scoutmaster does an excellent job of balancing 'boy led' with enough support to let them be successful. I'm hopeful that our next Scoutmaster will be able to do the same. Bugleson (my own son: that name is forever attached to him now!) told me the other day he might be in trouble at school. Fortunately I didn't flip out on him. Come to find out, he'd decided to join jazz band and, on his own, got signed up, printed out the music he needed, and arranged his schedule. His mistake was that he forgot to inform a teacher he was to be meeting with, so she didn't know where he was. He's in sixth grade, and I can say with certainty this isn't something he'd have attempted to do on his own without Boy Scouts having given him confidence in being more self-reliant.

Quick update. The MB counselor loved Bugleson's composition. Most of the calls were signed off, with four remaining; Officer's Call, Recall, Fire Call, and Call to Quarters (that lower 'C'). So... one more week should do it. This has been a very tough badge. Thanks again to all for your tips and suggestions.

Thanks for posting that link. That's our Council. When one of our ASM's said our council was an early adopter, I thought it sounded weird. The link makes it clear that each Pack can apply to be an early adopter. Makes much more sense! We've not seen anywhere near enough interest from girls for our pack to apply. We'll have another Webelos boy as of Friday, though, and his older brother is coming to our Troop meeting tonight to check it out.

Following. One of our Troop ASMs told me last night that our "council" is an early adopter. His use of the word. As of now, I'm not aware of any girls that have asked to join our Pack. (I have boys who are Webelos and Tenderfoot, and a daughter who will be joining Venturers in the fall.) As I'm not involved at the council level, I'm not sure what level of interest they've received or what their plans are, but will keep an eye on this should it arise for us. One of our biggest Pack issues is in not having an adequate number of adults who want to be leaders. It was a huge struggle to get a Tiger den leader this year, so they got a very late start, and we only found a replacement for our Bear leader (who quit last year) two months ago. It will be interesting to see if 1) we get an interest from girls and 2) if so, how many of their parents care enough to pitch in.

This has been a challenge for Bugleson () because he's a trombone player first. He wasn't used to the small mouthpiece, and it has taken him a good six months to get to the point where he can hit that high G with any consistency. Thank you, SSScout, for the recommendations. He ended up playing 'To the Color' for the Court of Honor. He stumbled once, but he's played enough times in public now that he knows to just keep going. He didn't feel comfortable enough with some of the other calls to play them at this venue, but he'll get there. Although he's allowed to use the sheet music when we meet with the MB counselor, I've noticed that the ones he's practiced a lot he can play from memory. There's a YouTube video (isn't there one for everything these days?) that we've been using, too. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYEddDubgt0 We bought a used Holton trumpet, and Bugleson was doing what this guy does, with the first and third valves held down, but his MB counselor wanted him to use a real bugle. We've borrowed one for now, but might consider getting our own. He hasn't composed his call yet, and has about five more of the required calls to finish up, but it looks like he should have the merit badge in a couple more weeks. Our Troop was really excited to hear he had to compose something. They want him to come up with an official Troop 368 call and bring the bugle to summer camp. Having them excited about it has made him less worried about his playing and making mistakes. This has, by far, been the hardest of the merit badges for him (though he's only done four others and one partial at this point), but it seems to be well worth it.

Our Scoutmaster always has hot coffee ready for the adults at the time of the wake-up call. That always makes me more willing to go camping. As mentioned by others, at our last Court of Honor, there was a slide show of some of the camping trips the boys had been on, and it really did have parents saying how fun it looked.