Col. Flagg

On literally every high adventure or summer camp I have staffed over the years there has been at least a handful of Scouts who have remarked how nice it was to be away from siblings and parents to just "chill". Same with weekend camp outs. When you take the "SM Walk" at night to quietly do bed check, you hear the guys talking about various things. The most consistent topic, besides girls and video games, is how cool it is to be "grown up" and not have family around. I bet @Stosh and others have similar stories. I can tell you I have never heard a kid lament not having his siblings around.

Similar to @Back Pack, if you use an iPhone and Safari you can see the new posts icon in the top menu bar. See the pic below...it's the icon to the right of the white arrow. It only shows (at least for me) in the mobile version. I don't see it in the desktop version.

One would hope that's the issue. But looking at the over use of the word "family" in all their social media posts, as well as in BL and Scouting mags, I suspect good old Mike S. wants to do exactly that; make Boy Scouts a one-stop-shop for the family. I don't think his intention is to just make Cubs more family-like. I think his sole purpose for these changes is to make all programs within BSA (Cubs, Boy Scouts, Venturing, etc.) a family experience.

Cub Scouts is a family oriented program. Boy Scouts is NOT a family oriented program. If parents want to join in Boy Scout activities then get trained, become an ASM and help out. Otherwise, stay home and let your boy enjoy his time with his friends, learn from others and experience interaction with adults he's not related to. I am beginning to think "Family Scouting" is just code for giving hopelessly addicted helicopter/lawnmower/bulldozer/drone parents an excuse to fulfill their compulsion for control.

You're welcome. Now stop trolling and use that college tuition money wisely. You should be in class according to the last tuition bill I received.

"Quality Control"? Of what? @fred johnson hit the nail on the head. Quality of the troop = Scoutmaster + COR Quality of troop operations = Committee Chair + COR Quality relating to ANYTHING else = The PLC and the youth leaders Adults intervention -- and all the horse hockey that comes with it (e.g., JTE, Covey, TQM/CQI, CMM, etc.) -- belongs in the adult business world and no where near Scouting. All these adult-led, wood badge-esque principles and other stuff belong in the rubbish bin.

Well, given the new type of parents Boy Scouts is attracting they should be able to save a TON of money by simply changing the "B" in BSA to a "D" and going with their new logo.

Wow...I feel for you. Nothing like putting your heart and soul in to something, only to have a group of folks come in and needlessly ruin what was built.

Nope. Managing meddling non-Scouter adults is NOT the boys' problem. That's what the SM and TC are for, to keep the meddler at bay and to allow the boys to do their thing. In fact, I would argue it is not an SM job either, but rather the TC Chairman's job to keep parents at bay. As SM I ran cover for the boys to make sure meddling, helicopter parents were parked on the runway far away from the boys. Yes, each troops should have that "Come to Jesus" meeting with the parents where they cut the umbilical cords and tell mom and dad what their role as parent is. Then they have the same discussion with the Scouters. Anyone running afoul of the party line is invited to stay home and work on their honey-do list.

Here's the thing: It's called BOY Scouts...at least for now. Not Parent Scouts or Family Scouts or Adult Scouts. The whole program is designed for a whole bunch of boys to be monitored and counseled by trained adults...and even then not a whole ton of adults. There is ZERO need for mom (or dad) to be around to help their little yum yum. Their Patrol Leader and patrol mates will help them if there's a problem. The TRAINED adults leaders -- who should know how the program works, as well as the policies and procedures -- will be around to help if there's the need. Other than that, Boy Scouts don't need mom, dad or sister around at all. Digressing from this program is what many here are worried about. Moms don't need to be along for the hike on the AT just because Johnny is 12. If they are TRAINED ASMs, fine! Otherwise, stay at home and pick him up at the church when he's done. Anything else is helicopter parenting.

Good Lord. No one is blaming them for undermining male role models. What I have seen is a few people, me among them, addressing the notion that Boy Scouts is gender neutral. It isn't. From its founding until this past month, it was totally focused on boys. Until women were allowed in, adult association was primarily between boys and men. Since then I would wager that the vast majority of unit-based interaction is between boys and men. No one is blaming women. At worst we are blaming BSA leadership for dismantling a successful program only to save their own salaries and membership stats.

Careful, Stosh. You might be accused of "Man-splaining" or "Man-spreading".

Our troop had a kid with a Leopard Gecko but we had too many guys to rotate through taking care of it. We set up a webcam for the troop to use and they monitored the gecko that way. In addition to that the guys doing remote monitoring for the requirement also took turns working at a local refuge that had reptiles and amphibians.

Just because something was written in a different era does not make it, on it's face, wrong or out-of-date. The merits of learning in a single-sex environment have not been definitively proven or disproved in the years since it's writing; therefore, making the argument that "Well, it was written over a hundred years ago." is summarily dismissing something that has not yet been proven dismissable. Fact #1: B-P created Scouting with the intent of boys being together to learn and grow, along with (male) adult association. Fact #2: Fact #1 has not been proven to be a bad thing. In fact, it has worked so well the program is around over 100 years later. We can debate what B-P would lament were he to return to see what Scouting has become but for me its: Too much adult involvement. Eroding of the outdoor program and patrol method. The exorbitant cost of Scouting. The erosion of the boy-only program. The bloated hierarchy of Scouting (salaries, buildings, monuments, etc., in the name of adults)

Can women hold Scouting roles likes MBC, SM, ASM, TC chair and do an equal or better job than men? Sure! As with anything you will have good and bad of each gender no matter the role. What you appear to be strongly discounting is the need of young men to associate with older men in a single sex environment. THAT is why Scouting was created in the first place. Baden-Powell says as much (several times) in Aids to Scoutmastership. In fact the section covering the aims and methods of Scouting say nothing of "girls", but focus on boys. So Boy Scouting -- with all of its rules, policies, aims and methods -- *is* (well, now, "was" given the addition of girls) about boys and their relationship with adults (men). The whole notion that "There's not a lot of content that requires a male role model" is, forgive the phrase, bull pucky. You cannot expect a boy to get the same experience in Scouting from a female leader that he'd get from a male leader. That is both good and bad. In my years as SM, I had many, many Scouts think of me as a father figure for my involvement in their Scouting lives. Their own fathers were too busy making a living (or being self-absorbed) to spend time with their sons doing anything. I taught them how to hunt, fish, camp, apply first aid, swim, canoe and so on. It was DURING these activities that they saw how a man acts, how he treats others, how he communicates, etc. Hopefully these young men will take these examples and use them to form their own idea of manhood. Sorry, but no amount of female leadership and know-how can take the place of all of that. By the same token, men cannot replace (nor should they) the role of female leaders. Note that I am not saying there is not room for female leaders in Scouting or in the lives of Boy Scouts. But (what was) the Boy Scout program is more effectively delivered by men, having interaction with young men, to act as role models for them.

If you are going to delete posts where people respond to accusations, at least delete the offending post too. Seriously, try to be a little less one-sided. I'll expect you to ban me for a day again. Right? Geesh.

Great point. I was amazed at what some units charge. My unit just charges the recharter fee for adults. Some units charge that AND other annual fees for the unit. One local unit is $75/year for adults!!!

Cheese fries. Don't forget cheese fries!!!!

I think most American volunteers need to be dragged in to volunteering. The biggest issue I have seen over the years is getting the adults to make a connection between what units need and how they can help. Some folks just dive in, see what's needed and begin helping. Some folks may dive in to a role but not move outside of it despite seeing or knowing something else is needed. Some wait to be asked, knowing help is needed. Some are so clueless you need to show them so much it's just easier and faster to do it yourself. In my mind we need to connect with the first three groups.

Barry, I agree the commercial is effective. But does that get people to volunteer? Or just encourage people to put their kids in Scouts? In my mind we would need a commercial that shows the benefits an adult volunteer can pass on (or learn for himself) by being a Scout volunteer.

Great idea!! Our unit has been there and it is a GREAT place!! In fact, I would do it again before I ever went to The Summit. Seems they have overnight stays on houseboats. They are in the Atchafalaya near Lafayette (pronounced down there as "La-FI-et"), which is about two hours away from the Big Easy proper. Other things to do there (yeah, they're touristy): Beignets at Cafe du Monde The WWII museum Audubon Zoo St. Louis Cemetary (I know, morbid, but actually pretty cool. Our guys loved it). Mardi Gras World (See floats and other stuff) The Cabildo (18th Century mansion where LA Purchase was signed) Laura or Oak Alley plantation Ghost tours (must be a dozen of them, but pretty cool thing to do at night) Irish Bayou swamp tour Jackson [inert new name here] Square

Exactly what we did Stosh. Best work we had ever seen done!

Given the entirely new apparatus BSA will have to put in place for a dual-track, separate-but-equal program for girls, they are going to need a helluva lot of volunteers. If they don't get in front of this issue the program roll out will fall flat on it's face. I suspect they will take the "ambush" approach most Packs take to staffing Tiger (Lion) dens: Get all the new parents together and ask someone to volunteer to be the new leader. Not an ideal model.

Yes, there were two polls done about the 2013 and 2015 membership policy changes. In both polls the majority of respondents voted against changing BSA's membership policy. They have been discussed and quoted in this forum often enough. CalicoPenn knows darn well these polls exist and are not a figment of one's imagination. There were similar polls done by select councils about the girls in Scouting vote, but those results (not surprisingly) have not been release UNLESS they supported the BSA position. My own council did a poll and was touting over 1000 people responding. The results? Never announced, never published. In fact they simply don't talk about them. I know for a fact, though obviously cannot prove it, that the vote was overwhelmingly against. I suspect that's why the results were never announced. Why else hide them? This is all fact and has been reported by BSA's own websites, councils and independent news outlets. Because the sources have already been posted here over the years, I am not going to go find them and repost just because someone cannot remember the debate.