Pale Horse

My bad, all I can see is her post from July 19, 2012. It appeared you were resurrecting a thread from almost 6 years ago to advise her on the posting rules against advertising. The "scolding" is tongue-in-cheek.

Did you just scold someone for a post from nearly 6 years ago?

Absolutely not. Living in a large manufacturing area, we get families with parents in engineering, design, and computer programming from all over the word that come and work in the States for a few years before returning to their home country.

Thanks, I was thinking of changing it to "As a Scout...", but like your suggestion better.

Have several Non-Americans in the Pack. Anybody with experience have an alternative suggestion for the outdoor code ("As an American, I will do my best...) or just have them recite as is.

So boy troop and girl troop can share committees, meet at the same time and place, have joint open/close ceremonies, plan joint events, attend mixed-sex camporees, ....but must run separate meetings because....?

A 5, 10 or 15k road march is no substitution for shakedown hikes and does little to prepare for the AT (my knowledge is limited, but I'd say the same for Philmont). Elevation change is the name of the game for AT, and walking a road isn't going to cut it. Shakedown hikes and followon camp activities are designed not only to break in boots and accustom one to carrying a ruck sack, but should also be used to assess your gear load out. You should be assessing everything you carry and use and determine if you really need to bring X or if you could get by with 1 less Y. Pretty hard to determine what goes and what stays if all you do after your road march is toss the ruck in car and head home.

Very nice tent. A couple of my hiking partners have it and love it. It's going to be my next purchase, for those rare occasions where I can't hang my hammock and have to sleep on the ground like a heathen.

#1: This isn't somebody else's program. This is your son's program. You teach highschoolers, but I assume you're familiar with elementary education. When teachers assign projects, homework or spelling lists, you have to know that kids aren't going home and doing everything by themselves. Absolutely zero science projects have been completed by 7 year olds with their parents off doing their own thing. Parental involvement and assistance is needed then just as it is in Cub Scouts. #2: Nobody is asking you or anyone to recreate the wheel, but how do you think outings to the conservancy, state park, or historical societies take place? Everyone just mysteriously knows where and when to show up to a place, and everything is ready for you? No, a volunteer has to contact the location, reserve a time and then disseminate the information to other parents. Not a big deal, or anywhere hard to do, but when 40 families look to the same 4-5 people wearing uniforms to do everything, it becomes irritating. More so, if we see that you're already doing these things with your family or volunteering at these locations. Honestly, it would be incredibly easy to put forth a little effort to "make the pack go." #3 Have you attended any parent meetings to even know if the pack is running fine? Every person's time valuable; any excuse that someone is "too busy" to help comes across as petty. Our registered volunteers are all fully-employed in professional careers.

Like I said, your reasons are your own, so fair enough. Most families don't feel that scouting is as big a part of their lives as my family does, and I'm fine with that. I still find it incredulous that because you don't share an interest in something, you choose not to help make it better or at the very least feign interest. Everything you're saying here and in your subsequent posts all deal with the direct "boy-facing" volunteer opportunities. There are plenty of ways you and other parents can help besides teaching a class or giving a lecture. By your own admission your family does plenty of other great activities, many of them outdoors. Have you considered offering to help set up an outing to these areas? You say that the den and packs are running just fine without your help. While this may be true, I find it hard to believe that any pack would turn down additional help; especially a volunteer with knowledge of plant identification and other outdoor skills. At every single roundtable or Scouting University, the most attended topics always center on how to get more parents involved. Maybe your pack is the exception, though I doubt it.

It has existed long before Family Scouting, but now we're qualified to baby sit for girls...well not me personally, I'm the wrong sex to be trusted.

Ignoring the fact that you got awfully defensive pretty quickly, for the sake of discussion why do you and your wife choose not to volunteer? I understand it's your choice, but curious as to why. The scouting experience, especially at the Pack level, is entirely volunteer driven and reliant on parents.

Yeah right. Little Johnny Bear Cub's dad didn't volunteer, and now that little sister Suzy can sign up as a Tiger too, there's absolutely zero incentive to do so now. Quite the opposite, now he has Baby Sitters of America (BSA) lined up to watch both his kids. Him and the Mrs. have a night off. Speaking from real life, our Pack has 3 sets of current parents (none registered leaders) with younger daughters they are ready to sign up. They have zero interest in getting involved other than dropping off and standing in the back.

This may not be a disability per se, more of a physical limitation question. I have an adult scouter who because of past injuries, surgeries and arthritis creeping in, can't bend his pinky to make the scout sign. Not a bit deal, but he's wondering if he should: 1. Bend his index finger, so that he's still performing the sign with 3 fingers, or 2. hold his whole hand up to make a 4-fingered sign. Thanks in advance.

Planning our Pack Family Cabin Campout and wanted to run a question by everyone. We have one scout who attends most day events, but can never get his family to spend the night. Through discussion with the parents, the DL seems to think it's a matter of extreme conservativeness/shyness, but not a religious one, that the parents are reluctant to spend the night in group cabins (even with segregated mens/womens areas). Since it's still cold up here in the north, we usually do Cabin Camping in the early spring. However, to get this family included, I was going to put out the offer for families to set their tents up outside the cabin. If the family took that option, would you require their scout (Webelos) to sleep with the family in the tent, or allow him to sleep with the other boys in the cabin? Obviously the "safest" option is that the scout sleeps w/ his parents, but if he slept in the Cabin, would this be much different than a Scout that's sleeping on the other side of the cabin from where his Mom (only parent) is sleeping?

Perhaps your Council charges an extra $1 for insurance similar to ours (Great Lakes Field Service Council).

Thanks for the great response, Latin Scot. Could you please elaborate on why you believe it would be a crushing blow to the continued BSA-LDS relationship if Cub & Boy scouts went co-ed though? Specifically regarding HelpfulTracks comment that this doesn't seem to be an issue for LDS and Scouts Canada. I'm pretty sure a local option will remain that will allow LDS to remain boy-only.

Thanks Cleveland. Good to know. And that's fair, if the actual litigation/settlements are driving increases vs. cost increases of carrying insurance.

This is the most "official" message I've seen, so far. https://www.facebook.com/CommissionersOfTheBoyScoutsOfAmerica/?hc_ref=ARS7UnPtgmsiMVjgzkPmke6C8ZqWfDJVmjhOEtY-ZwGGJZBnI2cCkQ3qC2DIkDJ59m8&fref=gs&hc_location=group While I think Scouts is still a good value, could someone please enlighten me on what exactly registration fees go towards? Am I correct that NONE of this money is retained by council? I found this article on the previous increase to $24 which lists out some benefits funded by our fees (with my comments in red). Please help me understand this. https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2013/09/03/bsa-membership-fee-increased-to-24-what-does-your-24-get-you/ Provide liability insurance to registered adult members, local councils, chartered organizations and the national organization (Ok, insurance, but seems like an organization as large as BSA could self-insure.) Provide technological platforms for the Scouting movement (BSA & Technology aren't usually spoken together in the same sentence Provide local councils with program as well as tools for camp and office planning and evaluation, extensive financial counseling, planned giving and fundraising information, and professional personnel support (My mandatory registration fee is used to teach fund raising? Nothing better for fundraising than mandatory fees) Coordinate a communications network through magazines and literature (handbooks, merit badge pamphlets, brochures, training materials, and professional development training) (We pay directly for handbooks, MB pamphlets, & UofScouting materials, etc.. Why do they need separate fees?) Make available uniforms, equipment, and program supplies (Again, we purchase uniforms & equipment. Why a fee to "make them available"?) Develop and maintain year-round national high-adventure bases and execute national events (jamborees, National Eagle Scout Association and Order of the Arrow conferences, and National Council meetings) (High-adventure bases, jamborees, and summits that Scouts pay thousands of dollars to attend?) Maintain communication with chartered organizations that use the Scouting program (religious institutions, civic organizations, labor unions, professional organizations, business, and industry) (Completely comical. I know of zero instances where National has communicated with a CO.) Maintain liaison with Scouting associations in other countries as a member of the World Scout Conference (Sure, but how much exactly does that really cost?) Set and maintain program standards (e.g., Advancement, health and safety, etc.) to ensure consistency of the brand throughout councils across the country. (Uh, ok...finally our last bullet actually deals with program development)

Has anybody heard of any changes to OWL training? Council Exec mentioned that OWL is now combined with BALOO. I vaguely remember seeing some combined IOLS/OWLS training a while ago, but nothing regarding consolidating Baloo & OWL

As mentioned, just record it. District Exec has never reviewed a single award we've submitted, can't imagine they'll start.

Based on the "Age Appropriate Guidelines" (http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34416_insert_web.pdf) what is the difference between Family Camping and Parent/Son Overnights?

If you call earning 10% less to pay for a house that costs 20% more, an auto that costs twice as much and college that costs 2-3x the amount it did in 1975 "pretty close", then our definitions of the words are a bit different. Extrapolate these numbers back to 1950s before the "hyper-inflationary" period and they're even more divergent. At least we're paying less for milk and eggs though. I would assume the trend in newer cars has something to do with the inability of the home mechanic to do any work on newer cars. They're essentially computers on wheels and any little thing totals them out. Safety features have come a long way in the last 15 years for cars too. No doubt mom & dad are paying for these new cars though.

I hate answers that consist basically of "back in my day..." If you really care about the economic disparity between 1950s America and today, take a look at this. http://www.mybudget360.com/cost-of-living-2014-inflation-1950-vs-2014-data-housing-cars-college/ There is simply no comparing being able to work part time in 1950 and having the ability to afford a new car and college to today. I'm impressed by any parent that can swing full tuition for their kids, much less asking junior to pay full ride while working summers at the grocery store.