Eagle94-A1

Having worked in the medical field, I have heard some stories of people not telling 100% of the truth to their providers. When I went through physical therapy a few years best I did my darndest to be compliant with his instructions for exercise at home. It was challenging and initially I was not meeting his goals. But I was honest with him and told him I was actually doing. He admitted that since most patients do not follow instructions, he always add to the regime so that the patient can make progress to recovery. I was able to get out of rehab in 5.5 months following his instructions. I saw one of my fellow patients with the milder problem I had still in rehab a year after starting because he would not do the exercises at home, despite saying he was. The procedure he had was the one I was suppose to have, and the recovering should have been shorter than the 5.5 months I went through.

And that is a mistake IMHO. You need to have a basic understanding of the program in order to promote the program. Plus the more experience you have, the better able to help your struggling units if you do not have enough/any commissioners. If you don't meet the minimum training requested of Volunteers, how can you help them? Grant you I was not the normal DE. I already had 5 years as a ASM, and 2 years as a Chapter Adviser and Explorer Post Associate Adviser. While the Scouters had some reservations about me initially, but when they saw me willing to get down and dirty with them at an Ordeal ( my old lodge's motto was a clean sash is the sign of a lazy Arrowman ) that got their respect and trust. And while I did have to go through Cub Scout Basic Leader Training (day long course covering ALL Cub Scout Leader positions), my experience working on staff at various Cub Scout programs, and the work the OA did with Arrow of Light and Cross Over Ceremonies made a big difference in gaining respect in that community. This is what happens when a MOVEMENT turns into a BUSINESS. I think Scouting is about to get a lot smaller, and fees are about to skyrocket.

When I was a DE in the Late 90s, i needed to complete all the basic training for the programs prior to PDL1. Thankfully i was a trained ASM with a troop and AA with my post. All i needed was Cub Scout Basic Leader Training, which I took as a DE. When i got to PDL1, found out it was a formality that they would do outside of class the first nite. Now i am told basic training is not required.

I am cleaning after each patron at my library. It is a pain. And I am not dealing with the numbers or time restraints that a camp has.

@Ronmass NC

We are betting that our summer camp will be cancelled. I am looking into options to give the Scouts. They stem from going to the local Scout camp and doing our own program, to going out of town on a 5 day lollygag. We will have challenges. We do have some Scouts who may not be bale to do anything due to immunosuppressed parents. Other may not think it's safe. We will get that input first.

With the governor saying no overnight summer camps, I am betting ours will be cancelled now. Already looking into options to provide the Scouts. Worse case, we will go to the local Scout camp (5 to 20 minutes away depending upon the Scout) and do our own program. Best case, get out of dodge and have a 5 day lollygag.

Don't worry about it, it is the SCOUTS' ADVANCEMENT, THE SCOUTS" RESPONSIBILITY. (Emphasis again). I had a Scout who spent 4 years as a Tenderfoot. Only reason he decided to get First Class was a HA backpacking trip.Had no issues getting it signed off, and he was happy. But attending his first Eagle COH, was what got him motivated to get Eagle. He barely made it, but he got Eagle. But he got a lot more out of Scout than Eagle. He got skills that put him way ahead his peers. He is doing exceptionally well in college. He also had a lot of fun. Eagle is nice, but that is not the goal of Scouting. The goal is to help our youth become independent, responsible citizens. One of the best Scouts I know never got past Star. But he he was able to use the knowledge, skill, and abilities he learned to save someone's life: mine. So don't worry about it. Can it be frustrating, yep. My youngest is one of those three Tenderfoots who has been in the troop over a year. I got to step back and let him take responsibility for his own advancement, because in the end, he will grow a lot more doing it on his own, than me pushing and pulling him across some advancement lin ur Scouts.Focus on the important stuff: providing the counseling and guidance to so they can create and achieve their program.

Here's my take on advancement, especially at the T-2-1 level, IT IS MORE IMPORTANT THEY HAVE FUN AND LEARN THE SKILLS THAN JUST GO THROUGH IT AT BREAKNECK SPEED TO GET IT SIGNED OFF AND NOT LEARN A THING. (caps for emphasis). There are folks who think my troop is a abysmal failure because we have 4 Scouts in the troop over a year now, and they are still Scout(1) or Tenderfoot (3). Why are they still active, because they are having fun. They know the stuff, done the activities and skills, but they just have not taken the time to get it signed off ( an aside, in my troop only adults and the SPL can sign off. I wish the PLs and ASPL could sign off, but the SM just allowed the SPL to do so, sot it is progress). Don't get trapped in the FIRST CLASS, FIRST YEAR mentality. The data used to come up with that idea was skewed. Not only did the data not take into account of how active the troops the Scouts advancing were ( otherwise JTE would want a lot more than 4 campouts a year) but also it factored in the LDS 11 Year Old Program, which from my discussions from former LDS Scouters and pros. The 11 year old program is basically Webelos 3 (or 2 since LDS only had a 1 year Webelos program) with a ASM acting more like a Den Leader and a TG acting like a Den Chief. Regarding summer camp, have a plan B. I seriously doubt it will happen. But reguations permitting, nothing says your troop cannot do their own program. There is talk of an extended backpacking trip.

I got to agree with Fred 110%. I have seen too many Eagles lose control of their projects. Unless the Scout has a lot of time and patience to teach folks what to do or it is something within the grasp of Scouts, I would not recommend. One tech heavy project I saw was an Eagle repairing/rebuilding a car to donate to a local charity. It took him something like 18 months, and every time a new batch of Scouts came to help, he had to show them how to use tools, remove automotive parts, etc. Another tech project I saw done was building mobile gaming stations for a hospital. All of the Scouts knew how to assemble and connect the equipment from their personal expereince.

I sympathize. Why was the troop committee involved in a programming issue which the PLC is in charge of, and the SM advises? Also, are you the SM now, or still troop committee. SM should be contacting the PLC about this and putting the responsibility on them. It is their troop, their responsibility. In talking to friends, I am finding that some of the adult-led troops are having the same issue you are facing. Adults have done everything for the Scouts, and now that they do not have the time for organizing online meetings, it is not happening. But it can be turned around. Neither the Scouts nor the adults in my troop were too keen on doing online meetings. We are an active, outdoor troop that had 3 camp outs cancelled so far due to COVID-19. But when it was realized that we are going to be out of action for a while, SM talked to SPL, and they got it up and running. Grant you, we are doing the "paperpushing" MBs (Family Life and Personal Finance), but it is up and running. I'm afraid that even when things get lifted here, we will lose a few Scouts for a while. Several have parents who are immunosuppressed, and COVID-19 could be lethal if caught. Good luck.

Necker became optional with the 1972 Improved Scouting Program. Thankfully the majority of the troops I've been in had neckers. When I was a DE and worked for supply,they did not want me wearing a necker. Which surprised me when I worked for them since the uniform was meant to be used as a model and advertising. I still have the troop necker I was in as a youth. Green Bar Bill's signature is barely legible because it got washed after using it for an actual first aid injury. While I regret the signature is barely legible, I think Bill would approve of the necker's use. I have a bunch of neckers I have collected over the years from trades, attending events, gifts, and yes ebay to replace some lost in Katrina. But there are two custom neckers I am looking for: the YOULBURY INTERNATIONAL CAMPSITE SERVICE TEAM NECKER and a. KINGSDOWN INTERNATIONAL SCOUT CAMPSITE SERVICE CREW NECKER. I know how hard those neckers are to get because they ran out of them when I was on the crew and team in 1995. Especially the Kingsdown necker since they camp was sold a few years back. As far as slides go, While the Friendship knot is popular, slides tend to have meaning. Some troops have custom made slides like mine growing up. Other slides have meaning to the wearer. There is one necker I have that will be worn with the Friendship Knot, my 1995 WSJ necker. That's because the WSJ slide has too small an opening for both necker ends to go through. SO I have a slide on each end, and a freindship knot connecting the two ends together.

1. WELCOME TO DA FORUMS! 2. Sadly Hitler and the NAZIs took over the Scout associations in Germany and turned them into the Hitler Youth. Hitler Youth uniforms and equipment were essentially Scout uniforms with the 'Be Prepared" and other Scout identifiers taken off. I saw online one rare knife from the period that had the Scout association info written over, but still noticable, by the HY info The NAZI takeover of the German Scout Association was so big a deal, that BP himself intervened to try and prevent the takeover from happening.

What scares me is this comment: Over the past few weeks, Scouts and Scouters from coast to coast and around the world have logged thousands of views on our page and countless hours participating in our virtual content. If that many people from across the country actually thought it was a good idea to take a hands on, physical class and do it virtually, then BSA's traditional program is very much in jeopardy. In another thread, I commented I hate to say it, but I don't think the folks remaining at national care about the traditional program. They are just concerned about the immediate money, worrying about next year at that time. I worked for pros like that. They didn't care about having a quality program that people wanted to join. Scouts were numbers. I am willing to bet that if they thought it would not be a liability issues, they would allow it, since it is apparently what people want. I am glad, very glad actually, that national put a stop to this. But think think how this Scout Exec, someone who has been involved with the program for a number of years, had no problems with allowing this. And now that he is a SE, there is every possibility of him moving up to national.

I hate to say it, but I don't think the folks remaining at national care about the traditional program. They are just concerned about the immediate money, worrying about next year at that time. I worked for pros like that. They didn't care about having a quality program that people wanted to join. Scouts were numbers.

I don't know. I see more and more "Eagle factories" than "Hiking and Camping" troops. I am also seeing more and more parents who want high speed, low drag. And once they Eagle, they move on to the next activity for the college resume.

NC

Local council cancelled traditional summer camp, for "virtual" summer camp. We have folks attending out of council camps who are concerned over a variety of issues: CDC guidelines, State guidelines, and refund policies. Refunds is the big one as one council has not issued refunds, but instead is issuing "credits" instead. We have 3 Scouts I know for a fact will not be going to camp as they have immunocompromised parents. No way they are risking health.

Once Pandora's box is open, you can't close it. And too many times in the past when the people complain, National changes it's policies. Don't believe me? Look at Eagle Palms. 94% of those polled were against changing the requirements, yet they changed them anyway. Look at the 2015 Cub Scout Program. People complained, and guess what, in December 2016, WITHOUT ANY ADVANCE NOTICE, NOR TELLING THE FOLKS WHO WORKED ON THAT PROGRAM COMMITTEE FOR 4-6 YEARS, (emphasis) they changed it. Look at OA eligibility, election procedures, and Brotherhood changes over the years. what once was a great honor society that inspired people is now viewed as just another club, and nothing special about it. Look at the YP changes they made regarding patrol day activities and 18-20 near old ASMs . THANKFULLY they delayed implementation until October 1, 2018 instead of the immediate February 2018 as originally posted. But that had more to do with councils and HA bases getting complaints about groups having to cancel since they were using 18-20 year olds as their 2nd adult. And I can go on and on. So Yes, backyard camping is probably here to stay. Parents will pressure units and national to allow ti since it is allowed for this emergency.

The GTSS has this to say. Adult Supervision Two registered adult leaders 21 years of age or over are required at all Scouting activities, including meetings. There must be a registered female adult leader 21 years of age or over in every unit serving females. A registered female adult leader 21 years of age or over must be present for any activity involving female youth. Notwithstanding the minimum leader requirements, age- and program-appropriate supervision must always be provided. (Youth Protection and Barriers to Abuse FAQs) All adults accompanying a Scouting unit who are present at the activity for 72 total hours or more must be registered as leaders. The 72 hours need not be consecutive. No where in that passage does it state "registered adult unit leaders, " only "registered adult leaders."

Definately had a different mindset as you and SSScout pointed out. They wanted us to have a little hardship. They wanted us to think for ourselves and solve out own problems. THEY LET US FAIL AND LEARN FROM OUR MISTAKES! (Emphasis, not shouting.) The problem as I see it is adults today do not want their children to encounter difficulties. If there is a problem, they will solve it, not the Scouts. You see this with helicopter and lawn mower parents. Sad thing is BSA caves into the mentality. Folks complained about the June 2015 Cub Scout program being too difficult, despite the fact that if you went to the RTs leading up to the new program and did some proper planning before the implementation of it it worked great. No, National changes all the requirements in December 2016, MID SCOUTING YEAR, because of the complaints. My sons' pack decided to keep using the 2015 requirements in the books until May 2017 sicne they actually planned everything out. But the absolute best example of National caving into the no hardships mentality is the COVID-19 advancement for Scout through First Class. Most of these Scouts are in the 10-11 year old range, with lots of time ahead of them to do the requirements properly.

I see he is THRIFTY. Ditto my adults being Vietnam Vets, and some still active in the reserves. Standard joke in my troop regarding surplus gear is "Government surplus, if it's designed for combat, it may survive Boy Scouts."

Scouting Magazine has not been useful for a while. Advertising expensive gear (anyone see the walking stick article and the prices), irrelevant articles (anyone remember the Scout Age family camping issue), Diverging from the methods ( Anyone remember the article saying it is OK to temporarily do away with the Patrol Method). And Boys' Life is the same way. My boys stopped reading it, because it was not useful for them. Comparing what was in it when I was a youth, and what's in it now is like night and day.

You would be very surprised with what the youth can come up with. In my limited international experience, BSA is the anomaly with organized, individual classes for summer camp. In Europe and Canada, the patrols and troop as a whole decide what activities to do. At the 2 camps I worked at in the UK, Kingsdown International Scout Campsite and Youlbury International Scout Campsite (the world's oldest, continuously used Scout camp I might add), troops could pick from a host of activities the camp offered, a la carte style, or do their own thing. And the troops and Scouters I came into contact did the same thing as the UK Scouts. These folks came from France, Belgium, Holland, Germany, Switzerland, Croatia, Russia, Ireland, and Finland.

We have several Scouters in our district who registered as MBCs and they are active. I have looked into this, and have not found and literature stating that MBCs do not count. If you have it, I would appreciate a copy of it.