Eagle94-A1

You are lucky. There are some places that are so remote, big telecom does not provide internet services. Only option is satellite, which is extremely pricey. Sadly out state legislators nixed local government agencies from forming their own after big telecom complained about losing customers in the two areas that had it.

35-40 minutes away is the McDonald.

Your camps have wifi? LOL Seriously, wifi in the past has been a serious concern. There is one camp the troop likes that has extremely pour internet, to the point where their office staff will take turns driving into town to use the local McDonald's wifi.

I have found that pros come and go, usually on a yearly basis. And most folks stay around until their kids age out the movement. There has always been a cadre of long time volunteers, whose knowledge. skills, abilities, time, and treasure could be relied upon to keep things running. I have been in multiple councils in my 42 years of Scouting. And that fact is one of the few constants.

Yeah the parents are not the ones who are ready, especially in those packs that wait until 5th grade to begin transitioning. Problem since circa 2008 when Cub Scout Leader Specific came out, IMHO. The Webelos DL section is almost cut and pasted from CSDL section. And now that training is modular and online, many folks think they are trained for all levels because they got most of the modules completed already, and they have been a DL for 1-4 years already. WDLs are continuing with CSs at 4th and 5th Webelos level. And now national will be making it worse with the new program. I expect retention to drop further, as older Cub leaders, or folks trained by them, will no longer be allowed to begin the transition process in 4th grade as it was intended since circa 1990s. Why I really miss the in person, all day Cub Scout Leader Basic Training as it went over all the CS levels, as well as Pack level roles.

You may be quite surprised at the number of divorces because the man is no longer able to support his family, or gets critically ill and the wife is unwilling to support him. And you would be surprised at the number of men, who bust their butts supporting their wives in higher education, only to divorce them once they got what they want. It is a lot more common than you think Sadly women say they want men who break gender norms, but in actuality do not. This is based on my personal experience, observations, and from reading research conducted on the topic. I do not believe gender integrated patrol will solve the problem. Based upon my experiences and observations not only in Scouts, but in multiple environments, when teenage boys get together by themselves, they act one way. As soon as a girl is in the picture, there is the competition to get her attention. regarding the guys you had the talks about feeling with, if you were single, would you date any of them? Probably because boys won't admit it to girls. Again when girls are around, the focus is on getting their attention.

Another factor, membership losses are that bad that it affects the ratio.

A few reasons why this may be the case, but I do not know. 1. MBCs are now a paid position, so they are now included 2. the 18-21 crowd, the 'Adult participants" are now being included 3. A lot of folks are getting tired of the constant increases in prices.

Maybe that is why the Venturing Director made that announcement. To quote Han Solo:

The OA has lost a lot of meaning in my neck of the woods. And now that everybody who wants in gets in. None of my Scouts are interested. In the past 6 years, only 1 person wanted in, and he was pushed by his dad who was an Arrowman in his youth. He did the Ordeal, and went to a meeting, and it was so bad he never went again. As for 2 of my sons, despite telling the OA election team they were not interested in joining the OA and remove their names from the ballot, their names remained and they did get elected. But never did their Ordeal. The reason they told me was that the OA is no longer a true honor society like it was in my day. There was a Call out where several Scouts my boys and I knew got elected and eventually became Arrowman, All of us knew one of them was a serious problem, especially camping, and wondered how he got elected. When they asked their friends in that Scout's troop how he got elected, they were told everyone gets in, its no big deal. What really hurt me was that when I was the chapter advisor, and we were rebuilding out chapter and lodge's AIA program, my oldest helped me with the drum and drumsticks. he heard my stories, and couldn't wait to get in. But by the time he became eligible, talking to his friends who were in said it was no big deal and he lost all interest.

With respect, I would start with the 4th grade Webelos. I was around in the old 3 year Cub Scout program, when you had 9-12 months to earn both Webelos and AOL and cross over. One year was not enough time to prepare for the differences in programs. When the 18-24 month program came out in the 1990s, it was based upon research, and the training of the time emphasized the differences between the two programs and how Webelos needed to start transition in 4th grade. When the training got updated circa 2009, that information was not emphasized as much as the older training. IMHO separating all the DL trainings into 3 different courses, was a mistake as folks will take 1 training, and assume Tigers, Wolves and Bears, and Webelos are all the same. Then going online where there is no human interaction AND folks can just play the training and do other stuff further exacerbates the issue.

Last time National improved the program, Bill Hillcourt had to come out of retirement to lead it.

2 reasons. 1. Guys will always hide their feelings, emotions, and turmoil. Especially when when trying to make an impression on similarly aged females. But even as adults the societal norm is that men need to be the tough, unemotional and independent, despite that folks say otherwise. Sadly I know folks who have major physical and emotional traume, and when they go to their wives or significant others, they have been told to deal with it themselves, or worse divorced because the health issue caused roles to be reversed. Their support is all men's groups, and even then some of this doesn't get discussed. 2. Since it didn't affect you directly, you never noticed. This has been around for quite some time.

Western Society has focused on girls and women for the past 40+ years. Even the current studies that say girls need all girl environments at times, neglects the fact that boys need it as well. It's on my to read list, after I finish my current series, but A SELF MADE MAN, written by a women who impersonated a man for 18 months, discusses how society is so focused on women, that the mental, physical, and social needs of men are completely neglected. The author's conclusion: "I really like being a woman. ... I like it more now because I think it's more of a privilege." Part of having a discussion is the ability to leave your prejudices behind and listen folks are actually saying. Not really. Folks find their ways But what is upsetting is when boys lose their safe spaces, but girls do not. Some areas, like athletics, boys have their own space because of Title 9 forcing to have equal number of women's sports. But even then that can hurt boys. I know one university who had enough interest to field teams in two different sports, but because there was no interest by girls to increase their number of sports, those guys had to stick with being in a "club league" and not be a varsity team. More later.

I have been told that Scouting has been my surrogate family, with the adults in my life being surrogate fathers, the Scouts in my youth as surrogate brothers, and depending upon what age as an adult I was, me serving in a older brother or father role. I have served in various roles for over 30 years, and until recently also had a passion for Scouting. Read some of my posts over the past 5 years so see issues. I have rebuilt so much over the years, and the current state of Scouting is deeply depressing: declining membership, inability to get council support, ad nauseum. My troop is dying, and the adults were pushing to try and keep it alive. But the two recent changes, Name and coed, really disappointed folks. Now I read on Mike Walton's FB post about how they are "simplifying the Scouting program" which some are interpreting to mean "dumbing down." And that frightens me more than anything else, except the increasing cost of Scouting. Sadly too many professionals view it as a job, and not a movement. Very few good pros last long. Sadly to succeed as a professional, you cannot look at the long-term, only meeting your immediate goals, and let the mess to be cleaned up by those who succeed you. That felt by many who have spent years and decades with the BSA. Many of us have given up time and treasure, giving up our free time to make Scouting work. Sadly I have even sacrificed my family at times. Prior to my sons getting into Scouting, every single argument my wife and I had, save one, was over my involvement with Scouting: "another meeting!?!?" "Another camp out?!?!?!" , "Why can't you you go to dinner with my aunt while she is in town?" etc. But lately I am having a hard time supporting Scouting outside of the troop. So you are not alone.

I would say my troop is pretty outdoorsy. We camp 10/12 months, with a lock in IF possible in December and 2 weekends of Scouting For Food in February, being the 2 months we do not camp. Even during COVID, we continued to meet, virtually and outside, had monthly day trips in the outdoors, and even did our own summer camp. Yes we car camp, but we also backpack, cycle, and do canoeing and whitewater activities. And the Scouts pick Summer Camps with the program they want, with the only caveat being it has to be within an 8 hour drive. The last 2 batches of Webelos that visited, the activities scared the parents.

At one European camp I was at, the couple were not responding to anyone, and folks pulled the tent pegs out to have the tent collapse to get their attention.

With respect, I was in a coed Sea Scout Ship, adviser in several coed Explorer Posts/Venturing Crews, and also did several international Scouting activities, including a WSJ. I saw a lot of couples, and I have seen a lot of problems.

Times do change. Didn't WOSM mandate that condoms be available at the 2019 World Scout Jamboree? Yes, they did.

Not necessarily. I talked to one professional recently, and the implied message was that we need to create a coed pack, and have a girls troop, or no longer get recruiting support from council. Grant you We have had 0 support for over a decade now, so it will not make a difference. Where there is a will, there is a way. I cannot tell how many couples I saw when I was involved in Venturing.

Regarding research, there is a ton of research, not only from the past but also current that supports single gender learning and spaces. GSUSA uses it so support their rationale as to why they do not allow boys into their program. Which no one has a problem with. Some Scouting associations, while coed, do segregate the sexes at the Scout/Guide age. Cubs is coed, then you have Boy Scouts and Girl Guides for 11-13, then coed 14+ And how many WAGGS countries are coed, and those associations are members of both WOSM and WAGGS.

I think they were more concerned about GSUSA's reaction, and they did sue. Yep I too see another lawsuit.

Because GSUSA was not meeting their desire for an adventurous program. And their leadership does not want to change. While society does indeed teach there are no differences in roles, psychology and other sciences do show otherwise. Give me until the weekend to get the research collected. Because research from way back, and event to this day, shows that both boys and girls need their own spaces without the opposite gender present to develop. Again, GSUSA has not listened to their base, and have lost many over the years.

25+ years from now, folks will still be saying "Boy Scouts," "BSA," etc. Just look at Venturing and all the older names that had nothing to do with the Venturing program still in use, i.e. 'venture crews," "Venture Scouts," etc. And I can tell you from the discussions i have had since it was announced, folks with years of irreplaceable knowledge, skills, abilities, time, and treasure are upset. In my neck of the woods we have lost a lot of folks over recent membership changes, and finding replacements is difficult to impossible. Best money example is the current FOS goal is 5%, yes FIVE PERCENT (emphasis), of what it was 25 years ago.. And if you adjust both today's goal to what the 1999 adjusted dollars are , it is only 1.4%, yes ONE POINT 4 PERCENT (again emphasis), of the 1999 adjusted goal. And do not forget the volunteers who conducted trainings, program activities , commissioner service, etc who have left. We have lost a lot.

After talking to a professional recently, the writing in the wall that the "trial" period of 8/24-7/25 will be successful and full integration will occur. Also from the discussion, if you do not go coed, the council may not be able to help you recruit. I know my troop's volunteers will be meeting about folding the troop at the end of the year. Between existing challenges, and hint that we need to go coed or we will not be supported hit hard. But as @Scoutldr said, That is the sentiment of a lot of the boys I have worked with over the years. Sadly there are fewer and fewer places for just boys. The same research GSUSA uses to support girls only places and organizations, also supports boys only places and organizations. But sadly society could care less about boys and men. Maybe that is why men are essentially checking out.