Eagle94-A1

We had a troop that folded in my neck of the woods. The SM of that troop was a member of my son's troop as a youth, and all but two of their Scouts transferred to us. He also is getting it worked out where the gear will get transferred to us as we need it. The troop doubled in size when joined, stressing our equipment supplies. Now we've added a 3d patrol, and will be getting a 4th (possibly a 5th patrol) in the next 6 months when the Webelos II ( or are they now called Arrow of Light Scouts) from the feeder pack Cross Over ( and it looks like my pack will be sending their Webelos to the troop too since our CO's troop is still doing NOTHING with the pack, including recruiting). So we are growing exponentially and can use all the trained adults we can get, especially since the SM's health is continuing to deteriorate. So this Scouter is not only helping recruit, but also get gear donated. Now here is the challenge. The SM of the folded troop was a hellraiser as a Scout in my son's troop and the COR was the COR back then as well. While the current SM has no problems with him being an ASM, the COR does. The COR remembers the problems he had, and specifically remembers one incident where the former scout punched a leader. So the COR refuses to sign off on the guy to be an ASM with the troop. He's even talked to the folded troop's IH as to the reason why the troop folded, and got essentially the same answer I gave. Any ideas on how to handle the situation? Forgot to add why I am getting involved in this mess. IH, when he found out I was stepping back from Cub Scouts to help the SM out, asked me to work with the SPL to mentor him and get the troop to where it should be, a role for the SM, not an ASM. Also the "heir apparent," who is CM of the pack, and others have made comments about challenges the pack is having and how he cannot switch over yet. So I got a suspicion I will be having a chat at the next committee meeting.

Once upon a time, Swimming MB was a prerequisite for Lifesaving MB. That changed in 2001 when I think a lot of laws were create that affected teenagers and lifeguarding certification programs. I know back when I got BSA Lifeguard, youth needed to have as prerequisites First Aid, Swimming, Lifesaving, Rowing, and Canoeing MBs. Adults needed to have the skills to complete those MBs. But again, a lot of laws got put in place that do not allow 18 and under to do waterfront lifeguarding. Hence the reason why BSA Lifeguard no longer covers waterfronts and boating rescues. You gotta take the Aquatics Supervision: Safe Swimming certification for waterfront skills and Aquatics Supervision: Paddle Sports for boating rescue . Now could an 11 year old take the class? Will they pass, possibly. I'm in a similar situation with a 12 year old wanting to take Lifesaving MB. He did first year camper last year and has Swimming MB. I advised him that it's a tough class, and that if he gets a partial, we'll find folks to work with him. As to size of victims, " Size matters not" until you try to get them on the deck. I had a 16.y.o. petite, 5'1" female who barely weighed 100 pounds soaking wet tow me all over the place when I was certifying her to be a lifeguard. Yes she failed the first time, but took advantage of of the opportunity to retake the class. Worked on her skills and technique, and that did the trick. Only problem she had with the retest was getting the person out. She was able to do it, but it wasn't pretty. Personally I say first year camper, but it's the SCOUT'S DECISION, (emphasis, not shouting) and no one elses,. not even the mom's.

Glacier, 1) WELCOME TO DA FORUMS! 2) As others have said, you better know your your folks going on any HA activity.You need to have team players with positive mental attitudes and necessary skills. I lazy, negative person can destroy an activity of a lifetime. Trust me on that. 3) If you have an multi-unit crew, make sure you have plenty of expedition practices.

Back in the day, I would be at the office about a week prior to day camp getting the paperwork and organizing dens and putting, DLs parent swho were "walkers" etc together. I admit the first year I did it, it was frustrating as I didn't leave any room on my paperwork for editing. parents would put down the wrong den they should be in etc. Got better the next 2 years I was PD. I would do the parents' orientation and last minute paperwork filing the day before daycamp started. And there was a little grumbling by some staff about how their Saturday was spent in training and setting up camp, and Sunday was finishing up and orientation. Monday started with normal program with the really last minute folks being dealt with. Usually 3-4 folks. Last year, the new CD decided to do away with the parents orientation the day before, and instead do all the paperwork the first day. we spent almost 2 hours that first morning doing campwide games as he got everything organized. And we still had changes to make to den assignments up to Wednesday. May not seem like a big deal, but a lot of the activities we do can be used for advancement, and it does make a difference. Plus some of us DLs and walkers were a wee bit frustrated since we were not told what to do and had to make it up as we went along. Thankfully 1) I will not be at day camp this year due to work and 2) There will be a parent's orienation the day before camp this year.

I know every district is different, and some delegate training courses to the Pack Trainer. But I know of packs with no trainers, and I've met trainers with lots of knowledge about program, but little in regards to the outdoors. I agree with Mash in that the outdoor trainers I know are a wealth of knowledge.

I do not know the entire story, but in MS three troops share a very nice campground and each has their own cabin for year round use. The do rent out the campground throughout the year. I never went to their summer camp, but had friends go and this is how it was described to me. They put on only 1 week of camp and other units are invited to attend. HOWEVER for every so many boys going, you have to provide x number of MBCs for the week. So essentially the Adutls going with their troops are the ones teaching the MBCs. Anyway, once they know which MBs the leaders can teach, they then come out with the class schedule. If memory serves, patrols are responsible for their own meals. And there is a limit to the number of folks that can attend.

Every troop does things a little differently, and every meeting will be different. But as others have said, the Scout should be having FUN! Some things about troop meetings 1) They should be run by the youth. 2) They should have some skills instruction or prep work for a trip being done. New guys may be learning the basics from an older scout. older scouts may be practicing or learning advance skills. 3) There should be some time for the patrol to get together and work on patrol items. 4) there should be some type of interpatrol gametime

best first aid course I ever had, and it was the reason why I didn't get First Class in a year, was at summer camp. The counselor was awesome, and my SM wanted me to take it with that MBC. One day of learning the skills, one day of applying the skill on a "Hike" that had stations at/ repeat. Final day was another hike.

i can relate to that. I thought we had a good time for day camp, and our attendance showed that the date was the right one. Then they moved it up about 3 weeks. Doable, but there were some adult staffing issues as our teachers who staffed couldn't staff the entire time due to all the snow days. They pushed it back a week, and now we have issues getting den chiefs since most of the camps are at summer camp.

That's almost how they do first aid courses for AHA. Students watch a video. Only 2 or 3 'hands on" items, one of which is taking off gloves without risking infection.

Current SM has a few acres and lets us do whatever we need to do, except cut the pine trees down. He harvests those. Goal in November is to do wilderness survival in the old troop campsite on the property. going to re-clear the area after almost 10 years to not only build survival shelters, but also re-establish the campsite.

i forgot who it was, it wasn't KEEN, butu someone made a 'hybrid" boot that could be used for on both water and land. Saw them when I did some training, but were outof my price range. Trying to find it again, I found this http://www.rescuesourcestore.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=BO9800&sid=i4tmhu7ffhj77m6xjd784r7f77h3cnk0

Nah, just ask your friendly neighborhood librarian.

Faith, the syllabi are out for the live classes. http://www.scouting.org/filestore/training/pdf/515-215.pdf http://www.scouting.org/filestore/training/pdf/511-503_WB.pdf http://www.scouting.org/filestore/training/pdf/511-504_WB.pdf

This made my day

Sorry for the delay, Yep I recruited youth for packs and troops. I also worked on establishing new packs, a troop, and tried to get Exploring (I'm dating myself) restarted. But not only did I recruit youth, I also recruited adults. OK mostly for packs, but I did send a person or two to a troop. But My primary focus was trying to get adults on the district committee. I also worked on getting sponsors and donations for various activities the district had: day camp, camporees, district banquet, etc. I also coordinated with one brand new pack and troop and a donor to help get them off the ground. I also was able to get them cmaperships for summer camp., I also served on the training staff to help get new leader up and running. In fact, district training chair at the time is my son's SM. When no one wanted to do the awards banquet and recognize the leaders and youth I had to do all the work. I had to spend one summer working summer camp. I had to help with rechartering. Heck I volunteered to type into the data into the brand new SCOUTNET2000 system so that everything would be in on time. I even visited with the IHs like DEs are suppose to do. As for serving the individual units, we didn't have a commissioner corps. the district commissioner was also the acting chair since we went through 3 chairs in the 18 months I was a DE. And he inherited the situation that he couldn't worked on. Since I wore a 'wreath of service" I was an acting UC and helped units with problems. I had calls all hours of the day and nite. And the best wedding gift the volunteers gave me was a pledge not to call me after 10PM or before 6AM. They didn't want to wake up Grumpy I also acted as the mail man, bringing paperwork and advancement to and from the untis and the shop since I went every friday. There is a lot of behind th scenes work that the DEs do.

talk about weathermen and accurate forecasts reminds me how much I I miss Nash Roberts. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nash_Roberts

We have one ASM with a weather app on his phone. I have a weather radio. that's what we use on trips. From way back when, I start checking weahter.com at the latest 2 days before a trip, Then the day before and day of.

Been dealing with this issue for some time since CSDC does a lot of advancement. I have no problems, and use those who have done it to help the others. Also some Cubs want to do the projects again because A) it's fun and B) they know whatthey are doing and ant to do a better job.

That's the goal, although, why didn't i think of using GBB's syllabus for new troop! I told the TG his job was to work his way out of a job. We now have an issue though; we no longer have a TG. The TG and the NSP are having so much fun together, the NSP elected him PL. Now I gotta get another copy of the 3d. Edition SMHB!

Bad Wolf, Like I said, in an ideal world. The DE question I can answer from first hand expereince. Some of the things i would do, depending upon the time of year are the following. 1) Recruiting. Not only youth but adults. For youth recruitment, I had to coordinate with the local school systems and arrange both the daytime visit and the Round Ups. Then I had to conduct both. Grant you I focused mostly on elementary schools and Cub Scouts, but I also did middle schools and other More later

Bad Wolf, In an ideal world, the district helps units out a lot. They provide a commissioner corps that helps units out that are having issues and need help. Districts provide training opportunities for the leaders so they can provide a better program. Yes some training can be done online, esp. CS specific, but a lot does need to be done in a classroom. Districts provide activities for the units to participate in. Whether it's a Cub Scout Day Camp, or a district camporee, districts do provide the youth, as well as adults, opportunities for fun. Districts provide Round Tables where the latest information can be presented to leaders about events, changes in program, etc. Districts assist in recruitment. Districts have DEs. OK sometimes the DE is an idiot. But a good DE is worth their weight in platinum. There is a lolt that in an ideal world that districts do.

One of the things I've learned over the years is that being a SM is not, in the traditional sense of the words, a "science", but an "art." Things that are done in one area, may not work in another. As a SM, you got to know your Scouts and adapt to them. Best example is the New Scout Patrol. I told you about my 2 negative expereinces with it back in the day with my troop growing up. Specifically when I was the PL for them (today it would be called TG since I was appointed by the SPL; this was before NSPs and TG were in the literature), and when I brand new troop of 8 Scouts wanted to work with us until they could get their feet on the ground ( they ended up merging with us and splitting the "troop" amongst my troop's existing patrols). It didn't work. Today however, my son's troop uses the NSP. It's effective. Is it perfect, No. Do we have issues at times, Yes. But overall it has worked for the troop. One of the things I encourage is to read EVERYTHING (emphasis) on the Patrol System/Method. Talk to other leaders, especially the old fogeys, about things that have worked and not worked AS WELL AS THE REASONS WHY (emphasis again). Get as much info as possible form all sources. THEN discount any that are adult oriented, except for Green Bar Bill's 6 month training regime in the 3rd ed. SMHB ( he starts off adult oriented, and progresses to fully Scout run by month 6). Work with your Scouts and use what is needed to get them running the troop.

1) WELCOME TO DA FORUMS! 2) I need to second Stosh. I didn't do BWCA, I did LaDomaine, Quebec, Canada. From the pics I've seen of BWCA, LaDomaine was just as wild back in the daywhen I did it. We were told prior to the trip that USGI jungle boots would be needed as we would be doing portages. I AM SO GLAD I BOUGHT MY ALTAMA JUNGLE BOOTS! (emphasis, ok maybe a little shouting with joy ) They provided enough support, and wouldn't come off. I've done 3 week-long fifty-milers and multiple weekend and day trips wearing jungle boots. I've had no problems. In fact this past weekend doing canoe training with the troop, we had one Scout with tennis shoes on that came off in the mud. I had no fears. 3) WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT BUY THE CHEAP ROTHCO IMITATION JUNGLE BOOTS!!!!!!!!!! (DANGER WILL ROBINSON DANGER!) I was footing the bill myself for the trip, and was pinching pennies. I SCREWED UP AND GOT THE ROTHCO IMITATION JUNGLE BOOTS! Within a week of buying them, I was doing a canoe training for the trip, and the sole of one of the boots ripped partially off the boot due to mud. Thankfully the place let me exchange them for the ALTAMA JUNGLE BOOTS. 4) I do not remember how long the first pair or second pair of ALTAMA JUNGLE BOOTS lasted. Old age is getting to me . At one point I had both pairs at the same time. But my current, only pair I've had for about 7 or 8 years now. If I didn't have 3 Scouts to support, I'd get a second pair today 5) I have the condura cloth and not the cotton duck cloth boots. There is apparently two types of the boot: a Military Spec (condura) and Commercial Spec ( cotton). I'd stick with mil spec. http://www.amazon.com/Altama-Footwear-6853-Leather-Cordura/dp/B00471622S/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1432297550&sr=8-1&keywords=altama+jungle+boots http://www.amazon.com/Altama-4155-Black-Jungle-U-S/dp/B005343NTI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1432297550&sr=8-2&keywords=altama+jungle+boots

Don't remind me. I use to work for National Supply once upon a time, and I scratched my head a lot with someof the stuff they were marketing. Anyone remember the Arrow of Light belt buckle for a leather belt?