OldGreyEagle

So, at vatious times yesterday there were "reports" of three shooters, one shooter with two accomplices, the shooter was shot and killed, there were 9 dead, 13, dead, more dead and less dead. The wounded count kept changing, while watching the late night press conference, while the guy giving the press conference was saying the shooter was alive, the scroll across the bottom of the screen said the shooter was shot dead. In one way I don't blame the mistakes, it must have been a crazy terrifying scene as people tried to get a grip on themselves, the situation and all that was going on. What I have an issue with is the reporting. Why not say there are reports of people killed, but nothing is confirmed. What is the value of being first and being wrong? How important is it to the public to know exactly what is going on when no one is sure what is going on? Will there be an investigation into the mis reporting? Will networks wonder why no body trusts their news?

So if it's your true, honest, and trustworthy assessment, you can say anything?

... That would explain the "it ain't over yet" bumper stickers I see whenever I am south of the Mason Dixon line ?

Comming from a Council that has had Manditory trainging requirements for about 5 years now, a Training Cultire is one in which the CO's expect contact leaders and Unit Chairs to be trained, and the COuncil has Disitrcts Cordinate so that most trainig is never more than 2 months in the future

$ 11.00 Registration $325.00 Summer Camp $150.00 Average cost to attend 75% of Troops Activities per year Opportunity to develop self-confidence, survival skills, learn outdoorsmanship, associate with caring adults, be associated with one of the most Iconic institutions of American culture Priceless Scouting, like advertising, doesnt cost, it pays

I would like to see the requirement on the uniform and an Eagle Court of Honor, the Jamboree one I know about. I think I had an epiphany while looking over the advancement section and assorted threads. The original poster asks: "When Did You Notice Uniforming Becoming an "Option" Like that is the only "option" in the program, it is a visible option, but can we say we all follow the program the same way in all other areas? Is uniforming unique in its position on how units twist it (to some views) any different than a unit that requires attendance at X percent meetings/outings to comply with the scout spirit requirment? What about troops that routinely teach merit badges during their unit meetings, is that not short circuiting the Adult Association method? Can we say that we all use the Patrol Method the same way? The outdoors? Some units are backpackin' fools while others think anyone who backpacks is a fool. Do we all look at the Outdoor method the same way? I think we get hung up on the uniform and how other troops "do it" because we can look and see how well/poorly another unit is uniformed. We can't look and judge as quickly how the other guys use Advancement, Ideals, Patrols, Outdoors, Adult Association, Personal Growth and Leadership Development. If these were easily observed, how similar do you think most troops would be to each other?

Does your group already charter a Cub Pack? Why would they charter another, and then again, what 4 units do you charter? Cubs, Boy Scout, Crew/Sea Scout Ship, Post, Varsity Team? So many questions

Keeping the merit badge list up to date is a function of the Disitrct/Council Advancement Committee. If you are doing the list, you are on the committee (I would think) unless you don't want to be. I would ask them (the current memebers) why is the list so old, nothing though should stand between getting an up to date list together and also a process to keep it current as possible

I can understand the strum and drang over having a boy advance when the requirements were not met. I also do not understand the furor over making sure the individual is held to the highest standards possible and very little, if anything, is said about the Troop, the person who signed off the requirements or the process that allowed an ill prepared youth to advance. Having a boy not advance after a Board of Review should happen only once, after that, the troop would assure itself that boys going to a Board of Review would have completed the requirements by having controls on the system that did not allow unprepared youth in. The Board of Review also reviews the Unit's program and if the unit is allowing unprepared youth sit for Advancement Boards fo Review, changes are in order

● Declaration of Religious Principle, Bylaws of Boy Scouts of America, art. IX, 1, cl. 1 The Boy Scouts of America maintains that no member can grow into the best kind of citizen without recognizing an obligation to God. In the first part of the Scout Oath or Promise the member declares, On my honor I will do my best to do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law. The recognition of God as the ruling and leading power in the universe and the grateful acknowledgment of His favors and blessings are necessary to the best type of citizenship and are wholesome precepts in the education of the growing members. No matter what the religious faith of the members may be, this fundamental need of good citizenship should be kept before them. The Boy Scouts of America, therefore, recognizes the religious element in the training of the member, but it is absolutely nonsectarian in its attitude toward that religious training. Its policy is that the home and the organization or group with which the member is connected shall give definite attention to religious life. http://www.bsalegal.org/duty-to-god-cases-224.asp

You are corect Ed, Public schools were wrong to charter BSA units, the schools were not able to disciminate and yet they said they would. The BSA, holding itself out to being on the moral high ground, accepted charters from govermental units that could not discriminate requring them to discriminate. So both sides were wrong. I guess its like saying Bush lied when he talked about (Insert falsehood here) when being told that Obama lied when he talked about (Insert falsehood here). How does proving the other side is dishonorable prove that your side is honorable? If you want to say the governmental units were dishonorable, yep go ahead, I fail to see how that clears the BSA. You have two morons arguing over how many points a field goal is worth, one says 2 and another says 5. Because one side is wrong, doesnt mean the other side is right and at the end of the day both are still morons or perhaps better put "I Think We're All Bozos on This Bus" (This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

Not sure how your answer on him pushing too hard has anything to do with him pushing to hard. Either he has the skills or he doesn't. He can push all he wants, but unless he can ties the knots, knows how to read a compass, he doesnt have items signed off in his book. If he got to First Class in 7 months, he must be an active scout, if he gets things signed off, is that "pushing"? Was the proscribed process followed? Either he successfully completed the BOR for the ranks or he didnt. He can't be faulted for completing a BOR and attaining a rank, can he? I am glad he has a crackerjack brother, but what has that to do with this scouts advancement? From the on line BSA module on BOR training "If the Scout is not advancing, the board should certainly give the Scout the opportunity of learning what he needs to do to advance. He should be given a definite time for a subsequent board of review. Finally he should be given information about appeal procedures." SO, the Board turned him down, yet you are the one who will decide how he "gets better" I thought that was the function of the BOR as well as giving him a date when the BOR reconvenes, its just in recess now

How does one "push too hard" on Advancement? Either the scout has the skill or he doesnt. Either the scout demonstrates the sucessful completion of the POR or he doesn't When is the next BOR scheduled? In 6 months? 4 months? Who will be typing up the letter outlining the steps the scout has to take to be successful? WHen the process of appeal was explained to the scout, did he show any interest in appealing or does he accept the committees decision?

Going Rock Climbing? Does your Crew have a website? if not how about a Face Book, MySpace, whatever page? Get pictures of the event, put it on the page and have your youth show it to others or post links from their networking pages to the Crew page. yes, someone has to maintain the page, but if they already have networking pages, one more woint be a burden. After the Rock climbing, get pictures of any event you do and post it, sans names of course and in keeping with Scouting values but let the youth share with their none Crew friends what they do

Valid point Ed, it would be very valid if this was a Public School or a Teachers or a School Administration or a School Board Forum, but it's none of those things, its a Scouting website and we talk about issues that deal with scouting (mostly)

"And BadenP - what did you mean by the use of the word "twinkies"?" Heck everyone knows that...

Sacre Bleu, Mon pauve petit ami did not know, I shall deal harshly with him at once, he es bete... Pierre Aloious DuMonde

Pierre was wearing BSA regulation eye and ear protection, Pierre wears the ear potection over his toque to show the boys they have to wear theirs as well. Are you saying they should be applied directly to the ears?

Just a typical Autumn day in the Pocono's for our Fall Camporee, the Fall Colors were vivid contrasting against the falling snow... And there is I http://www.minsi-southmountain.com/pictures/2009_Fall_Camporee/images/IMG_0308.html About 15 lbs lighter than I was in August, but apparetnly as loose as the pants are, I have work to to, or rather The Woods are lovely dark and deep but I have miles to go before I sleep and promises to keep

In trying to keep things straight, in my own mind of course, BadenP orginally said "Say what you will Leroy but I and everyone in this forum view you as nothing more than an invasive nuisance that obviously has an axe to grind against scouting." So, indeed, surely BadenP did not say he speaks for anyone, he just, however, knows how everyone in the forum views Merlyn. But I thought LisaBob acknowledged that when she said "Baden, you do not know what "all of us" think." So, while we know BadenP , definately, does not speak for any of us, he does profess to know how we all view Merlyn and some objected to this claim. Back on 10/1/2009 at 9:59:53 PM, BadenP posted this in the Roman Polanski thread: "So Merlyn for the first time I have to say I agree with you, especially about Benedict and the abuses that the hierarchy of the RC church has yet to be held accountable." I have a hard time understanding why you would label someone on an Internet forum as a troll when within the same month of declaring that person a troll, they posted they agree with the one who they label a troll.

Lots of great posts, I didnt see many that addressed the original request How do we solve the conundrum of a boy meeting all the requirements but still not being Eagle material in the eye of a beholder?

Does anyone have a good sized picture of the uniform Stosh is talking about? The first one, or near first one with the 4 pockets on the shirt/tunic, whatever? I could see a cottage industry in knock off, not "orginal" but very close A pattern woudl be even better, but I don't think they exist, then again, I am not infallible

OK, I don't understand the conversation about how boys who just do the minimum to earn Eagle somehow don't deserve to earn Eagle. I have said before that in the University I attended, it took 120 Hours to Graduate, I do not remember anyone saying their parents would not tolerate just meeting the minimum standard so they had to earn 132 (10 percent more) before they were done with College. (I guess I see the Eagle as a diploma, you meet expectations and requirements and then you graduate) It is obvious that there is a thought that Eagle is too easy to get, that just meeting the requirements is not enough. OK, how would you upgrade the Eagle rank? What would you require of the youth that is not now required? How do we solve the conundrum of a boy meeting all the requirements but still not being Eagle material in the eye of a beholder? How do we fix the problem?(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

Definatley a treat, he was the Council Executive and his son was in the Troop I serve where he also was an ASM. He came to Camp with the Troop for 4 years as an ASM. He knows the program, his son made Eagle. He has gone through the program, and not 20-30 years ago like some Professionals, he knows the program from his son's involvement. He is a big advocate of training, The Council I serve has a mandatory training requirment so it will be interesting if he works towards this at CoL, its possible, but he is smart enough not to make changes without acclimation. I shall be sad to see him leave

Congratulations to the Cradle of Liberty, you guys have a New Scout Executive, the guy is ours until December 31, 2009 apparently.