OldGreyEagle

Scoutmaster: You let a patrol of mere girls beat you? Patrol Leader: Sir, girls aren't as "mere" as they used to be!

Part of my Wood Badge ticket was to put together a Court of Honor resource book. PM with your Email and I will send it to you, it has a big Eagle section

First of all I love a challenge: "...For those of you who think other wise please show me where it says the SM can remove a youth from his youth elected position..." http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/BoyScouts/GuideforMeritBadgeCounselors/RankAdvanceFAQ.aspx "However, unit leaders must ensure that he is fulfilling the obligations of his assigned leadership position. If he is not, then they should remove the Scout from that position." Any scout may be remvoed from his leadership position for not fulfilling its obligations. It has to be that way. If a youth get elected as SPL and doesnt care, isnt prepared, are you saying the Troop just folds up for 6 months because the adults can't do anything? Now, Firing, removing, what ever you call it is the last resort. You work with the scout, support him, enocurage him, do everyhting you can to have him do his job, whether its SPL or Quartermaster or Historian, but in the end, if the job is not done then you may have to remove him. I thought it was teaching consequences for choices made. Just because a youth wins an election doesnt mean he doesn't have to work, that he is untouchable, what sort of lesson does that teach? Now in the case mentioned, is this the time to remove the scout? I said No at first and repeat it. I stand by my earlier statments on the matter but this has developed into another discussion Yes, the scoutmaster can remove the SPL, the BSA supports it and you have the reference. It is the last resort, the Nuclear Option if you will, you only use it as the very last resort. Yes the Scoutmaster is in the car alright. He is the Driving Instructor and as such has an auxillary brake he can hit If he has to

I am not sure I understand what "fake leadership" is. I do know that when boys get together they inherently "elect" a leader. No, not with ballots, but the guy who they follow, who do what he suggests, the natural leader.

The Council I serve gives the Venturing Leadership Awards at the Silver Beaver Dinner

If the Scoutmaster can't, than I don't know who can. Perhaps you need a sit down with the boy and ask him to evaluate his behavior at Camp. If he says he knew he was wrong, then give him very short rope in the future, any recidivism means he is no longer SPL. If he comes up with an attitude, fire him. Have new elections, if we talk about actions and consequences, then there needs to be some

Would you concede that helping to train the poor unskilled volunteers would be a good idea? Look at what we see here on the Forum, Scouts waiting 3 months on an answer for an Eagle Project, Scouts being told they are not "Eagle Material", scouts being told that they need to wait to age X to take a certain merit badge, scouts not being allowed to advance faster than the Scoutmasters son and a thousand other grieviances that fill these pages. And what do we say to the more over the top situations? Call your DE? Have a conversation with the Council Exec? Yeah, I can see where a professional would get the idea that the scoutmasters can't be relied on to do the right thing, we see plenty of evidence here that they do not do the right thing. Then again, it does seem as though there is a natual barrier between the Professional and the Volunteer. Volunteers at the unit level focus on quality and delivering the Program to the best of their abilities, using what talents they have. The Professional is judged and employment based on expansion and numbers and money. Can anyone see an issue here? Volunteers are supposed to run the program but the Exec COmmittees tend to get filled by guys who dont know the program and are building a resume. It is a puzzlement...

What is the issue here? That the Scoutmaster is not all that adept at communication or that the scout neglected his Position of Responsibility to the point of having to be fired? Is this the time to junp on the scoutmaster for having poor communicaiton methods or is it time to tell the scout, see, thats what happens when you screw up? If the scout is going off to Jambo, it may be the magic six month period will end before he gets back so the scoutmaster had to send the email to have something dated before the 6 months is up. Of note, the scoutmaster can't say we will give you a month's credit, the scout gets credit for all the time spent in the position. Then again I wouldnt be expecting a POR for awhile either. Performamce Reviews should occur, but lets not let the process get in the way of what has been judged a sub standard performance

I became an Eagle Scout in 1969, that means my Eagle card has the name of Richard M Nixon on it, that has caused me pause many times

As I have commented before, I am on the District and Council Advancement Committee, a few years back the Camps were a little loose in giving away merit badges. A group of us on the COuncil Advancement Committee addressed the Staff during Staff week and emphasized the need to "do it right" to be sure the requirements were done. That year there were many partials handed out and many Scoutmasters said thank you, and we will be back as we know you arent a mill DOnt know the current status, it may be time for another trip during staff week. It does take the backing of the Program and Camp Director that if a counselor says the requirement is not met, that the Counselor is supported and the Directors dont fold

Cradle of Liberty contains Philadelphia and environs Possibly the Susquehannock Council name was shot down because Susquehanna Council in Williamsport, Pa already had a Susquehannock District. And Williamsport is 110 miles from York as opposed to Piedmont California being 2,683 from Gastonia, NC (Council HQ Address)

Washington DC sees a lot of parades, I wonder how the BSA parade did as far as heat related issues compared to say a comparable bunch of who ever you can think of? I would say it would be similar

the most effective recruitment tool the BSA has is an excited kid telling all his buddies how he went up to the Boundary Waters in a Canoe, or hiked Philmont and saw the sunrise on Baldy, or spent a week on Munson island, or went to Maine, or anything else a troop can put together.Whehter its a rope course, white water, flat water, fishing, being outside, doing stuff, climbing, its all better than staying at home. Then during the school year, the kid jazzed about a winter campout, tracking animals, seeing animals, making snow shelters, (ok may not work for those in the south, but work with me) You want to build membership? Get your kids excited about what they have just done, so excited, they just have to boast about, facebook about, text about, whatever it is they do

PM me if you have any more questions,

hey I am just back from Camp Minsi, and am on the Minsi Trails Council Advancement Committee. What District are you from, you know, Anthracite, Forks, North Valley, South Mountain, Pocono or Trexler? If you do not have a church, you have your parents sign in the spot for the religious reference and have your parents write a letter testifying to your belief in a higher power, thats how I understand it need be done If I were to do your EBOR I may ask how are you reverent in your daily life, or what does reverence mean to you. There are not "correct" answers, the answer will be different according to the person. I am looking for a sincere answer, the best I can tell

As a long time member of the District Advancement committee I often get quesitons on what would be a good Eagle Project, when asked I often reply, depends on how its written up. Edited phrases such as Painting a Room, doing a drive, all dont mean much. I need to see the fleshed out proposal and go from there. On another note, and the OP question. Of all the Issues we seem to get here, a dis-affected CO seems to be pretty common. The CHurch or other group that doesnt seem to know they "own" the Scout Troop that meets there. Why in the world would you not want that Troop to help out its CO? What is accomplished by not allowing the Troop to do that CO a service?

Well Pack, give me credit for adding "least wise none I have ever attended". Comes from being in a Council with a heavy Jewish population and quite a few Hindus. In other areas of the Country? Well as all scouting is local, as is politics, the economy and heck just about everything I would not project my experiences as the national norm, just my experiences. Also, just because there is a BSA policy I have no delusion that it is followed. (IE The Uniform). All this talk about what is on the applications lead me to see this on the youth application,page 2 "Members who do not belong to a units religious chartered Organization shall not be required to participate in its religious activities." Wonder how many times that is disregarded, quite often from posts here

Was it Darth Vader who said those immortal words "The Cycle is Complete", or was it Emperor Palpatine. I forget I was in the first Wood Badge for the 21rst Century course my home council did. For 3-5 years afterwards, I was told my beads were inferior, that I sucked out as a scout leader because I didn't take the "real Wood Badge" and that no matter what I did, I could never ever expect to live up to those who had taken the "Correct Course" And now we have the situation that Stosh is in, where he feels his beads are being devalued. When talk in an organization whose mission is to prepare young people to make ethical and moral decisions over their lifetime centers around whose adult training Mountain Top experience is "best", it may be time to take a step back, take in a deep breath and punt. I think Wood Badge should take up the pre-1972 Curriculum, the one Kudu advocates and the current 21rst Century curriculum can become the Ernest Thompson Seton award. Rather than wooden beads, graduates of the course would wear tiny flash drives on leather thongs around their neck Fighting over whose Wood Badge is best is counter productive

Camp wide worship services are not Christian based, least wise none I have ever attended, Scouting Worship services, the Scouts Own, are to be Non-Sectarian and non denominational and open to anyone and offensive to none.

Ah, but John Kay's poetry has stood the test of time

Yes, a most happy and wonderful Bastille Day to you all. Today is Bastille Day remembering when the peasants of France rose up against the imperial absolutist monarchy that gave "let them eat cake" from their Queen. The peasants were plain folk who were out to just "stick it to the man" or Le Homme, as it was France. The power of the people is often overlooked. Always thought this was a powerful statement: What gives you the right hey you To stand there and tell me what to do Tell me who gave you the power To stop me from livin' like I do Remember if you plan to stay Those who give can take away Don't bite the hand that feeds you Just one time I'd like to be somewhere where None of your clever lies fill the air I'm tired of your frozen smile and your voice of tin Just might all gang up on you Turn the knob and do you in Remember if you plan to stay Those who give can take away. Don't bite the hand that feeds you This never ending power play "Tween Jealous greed and vicious hate Is grinding us like giant millstones But it can't be our only fate It's time we got our heads together And let'em know that we're awake Those in the dark, you know they're no longer blind They're breakin' from your strangle hold on their minds Those that can see don't need no one to cross the street Be careful who you're pushin' round They just might find you obsolete Remember if you plan to stay Those who give can take away. Don't bite the hand that feeds you

I guess perhaps even if I beleived Beavah should face something but that would mean I would also have to be on the guard for the baiting dance you and Ed do and to tell you the truth, I dont have the time or frankly the intellect to keep up on who is baiting who and which person is the victim and who the agressor is. Beavah, thats Full Metal Jacket, the movie that introduced the world to R Lee Ermey to the world. Personally I love that Geico Comercial with Ermey as the therapist wanting to book his patient on a trip to Namby Pamby land to look for self-confidence. Pyle of course was played by Vincent D'Onofrio an actors actor if there ever was one

Hooboy? They are related to the Po' Boys of the south, where they are a revered institution

I thought it strange the only time the scout talked about camping was with the OA, he couldnt remember a troop camping trip that stuck out to him. That was the point, perhaps obtusely made Since I was the District rep, I would have a hard time running the program of this scouts troop

Sat in on an Eagle Board of Review last night. it's pretty common as I am on the District Advancement COmmittee. The candidate was asked why he wanted to be an Eagle. his response was because being an Eagle was about leadership, about knowing how to get things done. He didnt mention camping at all. His fondest memory of being a Boy Scout was working on an Arrow Corp project in Roanoke Va. I thought of this thread and thought about past EBOR I have attended, Camping and Adventure rarely come up any more, the boys talk about leadership. Gien the boys will only talk about what they have heard, I wonder how to turn things around