OldGreyEagle

When I was in Management, it always seemed I had a malcontent who was always right on the edge. While I would try to work with this person, he/she would never quite be bad enough to terminate, yet their attitude would poison morale. While never content this employee type would never leave, but the good solid employees would get disgusted with the other's behavior and they would leave. In the end, to paraphrase a great man, ... all scoutmasters gets the troop they deserve... If you cant stand up to bullies, you will get bullies, if you establish expected behavior standards, you will get them.(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

I am not sure if it was Plato, Socrates, Aristotle, Rouseau or Churchill who said when its all done and said, you can NEVER over communicate

I am not sure if it was Plato, Socrates, Aristotle, Rouseau or Churchill who said when its all done and said, you can NEVER over communicate

I've listened to those recordings. B-P himself says Boy Scouts are non-military.... Didnt we have a discussion on this?

The best thing about this forum is to get other opinios and ideas. yes Rooster, I have seen special hats troops have made up and the entire troop wearing them looks good. I was reminded that our Natl Jamboree troop had a special hat made up and we wore it with our class A's so I was wrong. You can wear a non-BSA approved hat with a class A Campaign hats on a patrol? I love it, I have a campaign hat I only wear for SPECIAL occasions, can I be in your troop?

By the way, as a part of this quesiton, does anybody know why the red berets were so short lived? I have a story I heard, but I would like to know what others were told.

I beleive the Red Berets with the scout inginia on them are still valid uniform parts. It is my understanding that an official BSA uniform part is never retired. If it says official BSA, you can still wear it. Now, red berets without the scout insignia may be part of a class B uniform but not a Class A and that might be a topic of discussion for another thread. And, while BSA no longer makes the red beret, you can usually find one on Ebay or similar place. My son has 4, and its become his trademark. The kids all know from a distance that its him when they see the red.

Are you talking about a troop policy, a district policy, a council policy or a national policy? Each as you would imagine would go up a few notches in degrees of difficulty. My advice would be to sound out your thoughts to a group of people you respect to get alternate viewpoints. If after those discussions you feel you have support or you feel you are right even if you find no one who agrees with you, begin the process. If its a local thing, a face to face appointment should be schdeuled. If its a national thing, write an Email/snail mail letter and see what happens, dont be afraid to follow up with a phone call in a week. As a bit of elderly advice ( I really hated saying that) be suer to pick battles that you can win, while tilting at windmills may seem romantic and brave, it is more often irritating and frustrating. , good luck

I was aghast when I first read this posting. Then I went to Meritbadge.com to check the requirements. http://meritbadge.com/bsa/mb/061.htm (and its the 2001 revised ones as well) I could see where you could assume you could combine a 10 and a twenty, which I beleive is against the intent of the requirements. The Asterisk statement at the bottom mentions the hikes of requirements 5 AND 6, not 5 and maybe 6. Plus, if you have to do a write up of each hike, what do you do for the 10/20 mile hike? You write a paragraph about the first tem miles and then copy it and add the second 10 miles? If this gets interpreted to mean a 10/20 mile hike is ok, the scouts will learn that finding loop holes is as important as meeting requirements, whether they are specificaly stated or not.

I am not sure if you mentioned/alluded to it, but have you taken Scoutmaster Fundamentals or whatever they are calling it now? That may help strenghtn your confidence in yourself that you are doing the right thing. I guess I missed it when you said you were a special needs troop. Having a couple of ADD kids is nothing new, in fact if I meet a scoutmaster who says out of 20-30 kids he only has one ADD, i know he is blind or doesnt pay attention. Our troop is half ADD, we have a boy who is in a wheelchair or a walker at all times and another who must catheterize a urinary stoma every 3-4 hours and sleep with a drainage bag. (he is an Eagle and SPL)And I may add we have over 70 boys in the troop as well. Our Committee chair is a pediatrician and at summer camp she has two foot lockers, one for her stuff and another for the troops medication, the medicine locker is the bigger of the two. I told you all that because I wanted you to know Special Needs Troops (we were once referrerd to in the council as the "spaz" troop) can flourish. We do it with heavy parental involvement, heavy JLTC orientation and a full schedule. Camping at least once a month and another day activity during the month. We are a place boys can come to be themselves, not all stand at strict attention during opening and closing of our meetings. Indeed for some to stand at strict attention for 10 minutes is as impossible as having our wheelchair bound boy walk 20 miles. Its not gonna happen, the kid cant help it and we dont require it. We do require the kids do their best and push themselves and keep the parnts involved. GO GET'M, YOU ARE DOING NOTHING WRONG

Sounds like you have a bigger problem on your hands than just bad electioneering. If this scout is as much trouble as you have related, and I have no doubt he is, then his behavior is more than just unscout-like. He and his family need a serious sitdown with you and the chair and behavior expectations need to be laid out. Have you ever talked to the boy away from his father? Why does he feel the need to be the center of attention or else is so impulsive or rebellious? Having read what you just posted I think this is a serious behavioral issue that needs attention from the family. I would hate to see a boy who needs obvioulsy needs scouting to drop out. I know I sound like I am reversing a previous stand on this issue, but with this background, it is obvious more is going on that a boy wanting to be SPL and doing whatever it took to win

These may not be from Boys Life, but they are PVC showshoe plans http://home.att.net/~hitchings/troop42/snowshoe.htm

Actually Mike hit on a point I forgot to make. If cheating to win an election is OK with the Assitant Scoutmaster, how seriously does he take signing off requirements for advancement? I am from Chicago, and even where the motto has always been vote early and often, we know fraud when we do/see it.

Oh wow, now I am just like Rooster

While enthusiasm and original thought is usually as asset, a bribe by any other name still stinks. He bought votes, you have the proof, he knew it was wrong and you need to re-elect. I would inform the Committee Chair of the situation and what you intend to do, but I wouldnt think you would need approval. If your chair condones such actions, you need a new chair. I would not make the scout eligible for the new elections. If you dont stop this now, whats next? Promises of easy slots in the duty roster? Bigger gifts? Stop it now!

While enthusiasm and original thought is usually as asset, a bribe by any other name still stinks. He bought votes, you have the proof, he knew it was wrong and you need to re-elect. I would inform the Committee Chair of the situation and what you intend to do, but I wouldnt think you would need approval. If your chair condones such actions, you need a new chair. I would not make the scout eligible for the new elections. If you dont stop this now, whats next? Promises of easy slots in the duty roster? Bigger gifts? Stop it now!

Heck Brad, you're in Nationals back yard, be sure to go over there a lot and give them a piece of our minds

Sounds like you have it figured out, and it would be a good time to talk to your boys. Remember each hike is supposed to have a narrative written about it, just BSA's way of saying no job is done until the paperwork is in, in that regard we ARE training the boys for life... Just for kicks, where in texas are you? I have traveled the state quite a bit

Brad, I guess it depends on how you define "packs". As I understand it, on each hike you are to be adequattely prepared. This includes water, food, rain gear, compass, personal first aid kit, etc. If you can get them all in your fanny pack you dont need a pack. Then again this is the Hiking merit badge and not the back packing merit badge, now on that one you do need packs.

The posting on the Hiking Merit Badge got me to thinking about a subject of much debate in our local area. How are the rest of you handling merit badges anyway? Are most boys earning them in your own troops, do you require they earn them outside of normal scout meetings, do you have a limit of how many may be signed off by a single counselor, or do you have some other merit badge statement you would like to make.

As far as I have been able to figure out, the hikes just have to be 10 miles long (except for the 20 miler of course) and approved by the counselor, they could be all or some or none done with the troop. As was alluded to, the boy earns the merit badge, not the troop so they hikes dont have to be done as a troop activity

Most troops have a system for who can sign off which requirements for advancement. I am not sure there is a set national criteria for which offices/positions can sign off requirements

First, Congratulations on earning Eagle next, the above postings capture the spirit of what I have been told wearing the Eagle Medal is SUPPOSED to be reserved to formal ocasions such as a Court of Honor, Scout Sunday, something like that. However, I am not sure that you cant wear it anytime you like, indeed my medal has a few mud spots from wearing it when I was a scout on a campout. I was/am proud of the fact I am an Eagle scout. Once you are 18, you are not to wear the eagle rank patch and you graduate to the square knot core. In out troop, all the adult Eagles wear their Eagle medals only at Eagle COurts of Honor, while I am not sure this is "OK" it is impressive to see us old guys with the medals we are proud of standing around the newest recipient. On closing, its your medal, wear it as a scout whenever you like

I dont know if the syllabus has changed, but when I took my scoutmaster fundamentals a few years back, I remember the instructors telling us that Boards of Review didnt have to be solely aimed at advancement. They can be done for a scout who is not advancing as well for motivation reasons or just to let the scout know the troop cares. Since a Board of Review consists of Troop Committee people, having dfferent faces, not the scoutmaster or asst scoutmasters amy help the scout open up more. Now, to the matter at hand, if the scout is not performing in the role of responsibility to which the scout has been elected/appointed, I beleive a Scoutmaster conference should be done at the 2 month mark with expectations clearly spelled out. If the requested improvement does not occur, a Board of Review should occur at the 3 month mark. This brings more people in the mix and eliminates the possible argument the scout could have that the SM just has in "in for me". If the scout doesnt measure up to the commitees/troops expectations I see no problem in removing the scout from the position and no credit earned towards rank advancement. I see a lot of comments about "paper eagles" and how scouts are sometimes rushed though the process, well, if the troop doesnt stand up to non-Eagle like scouts, they will get the troop they deserve. Having clearly defined expectations with some wriggle room is definatley a plus for every troop to have.

If that is true, it is very new. All I can find says a boy at least first class when he joins the crew can work to Eagle in the crew. If its changed, thats great as the female members of the crew cannot and I dont think thats right. And as far as I know, OA members have to be boy scouts, Venture Crews are not mentioned. Although in our lodge we have female leader members who duly pased their ordeal. I dont know if that has changed