OldGreyEagle

Our Camp fires a cannon, it has what amounts to a sawed off 12 gauge shotgun inside of it that shots blanks, it is fired at the raising and retrieving of colors, it is quite dramatic and memorable. Hate to see it discontinued because of one incident.

Since a Venturing Crew Memeber cannot be voted in the OA (as a scout in he troop he may be of course), why would a Venture crew ever wear an AO sash?

Not to dispute the wisdom of Eisely, but perhaps some good will come of this, every and I mean every hint of sexual abuse is subject to the Youth Protection principles, if those had been followed, the aftermath would not have been so damning to the scouts. This on top of the other report of sexual abuse involving the "handicapped" scout demonstrates the need to follow the YP program. Dont worry if you think the incident isnt "bad" enough to report. Reporting in a timely manner and having a full investigation on file is the best defense going, whether the investigation found a problem of not. What happen to the alleged perpetrator?

http://www.scouting.org/nav/enter.jsp?c=xds&terms=eagle+leadership&x=64&y=9 This is from the BSA website, I HOPE its the most recent. FInd the entry on the Eagle Leadership wookbook and go from there(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

So if Ventures cant be in the OA, why would the crew be deciding which OA sash to wear?

I think this has been covered in other threads, but not using the word "punishment" is for other than PC reasons. The Scoutmaster, the committee, et al do not have the right to punish or discipline a scout, that is left to the parent or guardian of the scout. What the troop may do is require behavior before allowing further participation in the troop. Such things may be any number of the items suggested here. Why such a hangup on the word "punish" ?because it means so many different things to so many different people and this disctinction makes it clear the troop dosent punish. Now, as far as throwing flaming paper balls and lighting arms on fire, they are lucky they arent in the troop I am associated with, a quick call home and about three month away from the troop would be my call and after that punishm... ah required behavior was over, each invovled scout would be doing an individial Board of Review laying out proper scout behavior. As a former hospital worker who has extensive experience in a tertiary care burn unit, I cant emphasize proper fire care enough. As for the "father" stirring things up, a visit to the local Burn Unit should be required for any of the COmmittee who wants to discuss this further.(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

and I havent forgotten to sing as well: Softly falls the light of day, As our campfire fades away, Silently each scout should ask, Have I done my daily task. Have I kept my honor bright, Can I guiltless sleep tonight, Have I done, and have I dared, Everything to be prepared. Listen Lord, oh listen Lord, As I whisper soft and low. Bless my mom and Bless my dad, These are things that they should know. I will keep my honor Bright, The oath and law will be my guide. A nd mom and dad this you should know, Deep in my heart I love you so.

Well now littlebillie, see now you are using your BRAINard...

::eyes bulging, neck veins strained to absolute limit, wild look of abandonment:: If you HAVE to ask, I question your right to post here !

If you ever want to study a true leader, I would have you research Leslie Groves, the military coordinator for the Manhattan project. He had to control the most brilliant minds the country had to offer to complete a task not everyone on the team was sure was possible, under strictest secrecy and before the Germans. He was a trained engineer who oversaw the construction of the Pentagon. He was leading men who were uncertain they could do as requested, and he didnt have a real good idea of exaclty what it was they had to do. Yet he succeeded, thats Leadership

We have another ASM who sings the Happy Wanderer Song all the time, like I said, its my second most favorite hiking song in the whole wide world. My favorite hiking song is: Follow Me Boys (chorus): Follow me boys, follow me, When you think your really beat That the time to lift your feet, And follow me boys, follow me, Pick'em up, put'em down and follow me, Pick'em up, put'em down pick'em up. There's a job to do, There's a fight to win, Follow me boys, follow me, And it won't be time till we all pitch in, Lift your chin with a grin and follow me. (chorus) It's a long long climb, But we've got the will, Follow me boys, follow me, When we reach the top Then It's all down hill, Till you drop don't you stop and follow me. (chorus) So the journeys end Is beyond our sight, Follow me boys, follow me, If we do our best And we've done alright, Pack your load, hit the road and follow me.

Dan, one thing you could have done was take the PL aside and suggest the youth sit down after dinner to discuss the problem. All the adults would take a walk to watch the sunset, and give them about an hour. When you get back, ask if the problem is resolved, it most likley will be. I guess this would be delegating the job of fixing the problem to the PL

Ah, true hiking songs, the is my second most favorite hiking song in the whole, wide, world I love to go a-wandering, Along the mountain track, And as I go, I love to sing, My knapsack on my back. Chorus: Val-deri,Val-dera, Val-deri, Val-dera-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha Val-deri,Val-dera. My knapsack on my back. I love to wander by the stream That dances in the sun, So joyously it calls to me, "Come! Join my happy song!" I wave my hat to all I meet, And they wave back to me, And blackbirds call so loud and sweet From ev'ry green wood tree. High overhead, the skylarks wing, They never rest at home But just like me, they love to sing, As o'er the world we roam. Oh, may I go a-wandering Until the day I die! Oh, may I always laugh and sing, Beneath God's clear blue sky!

True, and on a Bear Bryant Football team you always knew who was the leader. And in a Boy Scout troop, the leader is the SPL.

::rubbing eyes:: Rudd, you are going to have to explain this one to me, and type slow as I cant read or think too fast. In the uniform section you seemed to imply lower uniform costs could be achieved by lowering executive salaries, then right here you talk about what a grand guy this DE was/is. Should his salray have been cut to lower your uniform cost? I may not be understanding this so please help me.

Good example of Directing Rudd, take a look at the thread on a Presentation of 4 leadership styles, I have three examples listed, your cliff example is an excellent fourth, or first either, I dont imply any order. The problem with directing is its so easy, roll into camp at 9:00 pm on a cool fall evening, its pitch black, its so so so easy foe the adults to start giving orders, patrol boxes over here, you go light the lanterns, you go get water, hup to hup to. Its easy, but its 100 percent certifiable not boy scouts. The SPL is in charge of setting up camp. He has been trained to do so by the scoutmaster. He may have a checklist deveoped by the PLC under the watchful eye of the scoutmaster, but the SPL is in charge and its his words that carry the most weight.

This has come up a few times before, and has been discussed but I would like to add a wrinkle to the ADD/ADHD thing. My son is ADD, he has been tested both by two school systems and privately. He does much better on ritalin that when he doesnt take it. He is at the point where he can tell when he needs it. I am no physician, nor clincal pharmacologist neither do I play either on TV, but I can tell a change when he takes his meds. I can tell when the other kids in the troop get their meds. To my experience, I have never seen a kid on ritalin whose seneses are dulled. Ritalin doesnt slow them down, or make them drowsy, it allows them to stay on task. What is the forum's experience. I ask first before you post, you declare if you have an ADD child or not. It should be interesting to get the opinions of parents of ADD kids and those who dont have ADD kids

Actually those are very old songs, the first may be heard by visiting a Wood Badge site from Minsi Trails at: http://users.rcn.com/kjmayer/bear/ the song Boy Scouts of America, will play in the background, have your speaker turned down as it starts with quite a jolt. The "On my Honor" song may be found in the WOod Badge songbook, at least it was in mine. You can get a download of Burl Ives (!!!) singing it at: http://www.scoutsongs.com/lyrics/onmyhonor.html Never been to Ockanickon, but that is to change soon. Taking Powderhorn this September and the first three days will be at Ockanickon and the final three days at Camp Minsi. I love singing camp songs, it seems to be the purest form of scout spirit expression. On campouts we often have a campfire and sing. I think the reason kids dont like to sing is nobody knows the words, well my troop found out a long time ago I know the words to an awful lot of songs and I sing the verses while they do the chorus, it works well, nothing like some high energy singing to expend energy at night: Green Grow the Rushes I'll sing you one-ho, green grow the rushes-ho. What is your one-ho? One is one, and all alone, and ever more shall be it so! I'll sing you two-ho, green grow the rushes-ho. What is your two-ho? Two, two, lily white boys, cloth-ed all in green-ho One is one, and all alone, and ever more shall be it so! [Continue: adding each verse and repeating backwards to, "One is one, and all alone, and ever more shall be it so!"] Three, three, the rivals; Four for the Gospel makers; Five for the symbols at your door; Six for the six proud walkers; Seven for the seven stars in the sky; Eight for the April rainers; Nine for the nine bright shiners; Ten for the ten commandments; Eleven for the eleven who went to heaven; Twelve for the twelve apostles. (This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

http://www.swcivilwar.com/ChamberlainReportGettysburg.html Dont congratulate me to much, when I saw Patton and McArthurs name I was thinking WWII figures and then I saw Chamberlain and thought, what? The PM Of England, the Grand Appeaser? So I thought I better look it up, yeah, I remember him, the Kevin Costner charactor in the movie Gettysburg, no bullets? no problem, just charge. BTW, are you from Maine? Have an Uncle in Skowhegan

Directing: A Scoutmaster has his troop settled in for the evening. He notices a wild lightning storm way off in the distance, he sees a bolt strike the earth and then an orange glow appear, the wind is comming from the glow. He shouts every one up and put your boots on and leave your gear, take water only we have to get out now! A SPL is walking around camp, he sees a tenderfoot scout holding an aerosol insect repellent can in one hand and a lit match in the other getting ready to make a blow torch to start a fire, He yell across the camp, drop the can and put the match out now!!! A patrol leader is talking to his assistant after a patrol meeting. All the guys are in the front yard passing around a football. One guy misses the throw and is going blindly into the street between two parked cars to get it. The Patrol Leader sees him doing this while a low slung sports car is comming down the street very fast. The Patrol Leader yells, Charlie Freeze!!! and saves a life Theres three for you Ed, Bob may have a few as well

Oh boy, here I go again, The person "in charge" of the troop is the Senior Patrol Leader, not the scoutmaster, not the committee chair, not the Charter Organization Representative or the Institutional Head. The Scoutmaster makes sure the Senior Patrol Leader and the Patrol Leader Council knows how to lead by training them, but in the end, its the Senior Patrol Leader who is in charge. Teens, by being in charge of the troop, learn to lead the troop. The list of heroes you mention, Patton, McArthur, and Chamberlain are fine examples of MILITARY leaders who used DIRECTING as their main form of leadership style, which is what military leaders do, they have to. Scouting, not being the military, should not be lead by the directing style when coaching, supporting and delegating is far more effective.

ON MY HONOR On my honor, I'll do my best, To do my duty to God. On my honor, I'll do my best, To serve my country as I may. On my honor, I'll do my best, To do a good turn each day. To keep my body strengthened. To keep my mind awakened, To follow paths of righteousness, On my honor, I'll do my best.

We're the Boy Scouts of America Scouting for things anew. Our activities lead to victories in all we set out to do. We're the Boy Scouts of America, We plan hand in hand each day To do better than need be done till all our goals are won champs with a winning way. We're loyal to purpose and integrity Pledged to the Scout Oath eternally. With verve and conviction we sing our song to keep America strong. We're the Boy Scouts of America and this we have to say Join us and we'll stand beside you, beside you all the way. The Boy Scouts of America will stand beside you all the way.

Came across this one night, thought is may be a good idea to bring here: http://www.chsscout.net/rescenter/video/index.shtml Scroll to the bottom, there are recordings of B-P's voice talking about Scouting. It doesn't embarrass me to say that listening to these recordings always brings a tear to my eye when you listen to his thoughts on the goal and purpose of scouting. Listen particularly to number 4, where he says scouting is Non-Military, Non-Sectarian, and Non-Political and expresses hope that the brotherhood of scouting will make war impossible. Leave it to a soldier, who knows the horrors of war, to try to make war obselete. In Number 5 he talks about British Scouts and congratulates them for their efforts during the war. He says being a soldier or sailor isnt the goal of scouting, but to be a good citizen. The same site has video of B-P talking as well. It gives you a sense of the man, and his own sense of humor. It makes me proud to be a scout and makes me wonder what he would say about us now, after all, "all we are are a bunch of bare kneed rascals in Cowboy hats and staves in our hands"(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

Interesting insights, it was purported to be naitonal,,,