OldGreyEagle

Is it that sooner or later a people gets the government they deserve or the government the judiciary gives them? It just may be semantics

It is possible District folks have the positions they have because no one else will take the job. A good Distrct moves titles around a bit so no one gets saddled with anything too long or the Distrct gets saddled with them. It takes a culture of accepting change that I luckily walked into.

Dont worry Cam, I am OK. Anything made by man, even organizations will have defects. The Catholic CHurch, Boy Scouts, anything. I went to the Seminary after my abuse ended because I wanted to counter-act the abuse, I wasnt up to the task but that, as they say, is a completely different topic. Sounds like you have quite ambitious plans for the Crew, I wish you well. I hope the youth have as much enthusiasm as you do

And we eat pagan babies for lunch... betcha didnt know that !

Once again, Shakespeare comes to mind There are more things in Heaven and Earth Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy There is only one way to see if there is a demand, and thats to try

Is the Priest a leader in the Crew? Most Priests I know get "dressed" by themselves and pray as they put the vestments on, and they go on over their clothes, its not like they disrobe to put on the stuff. I would say a pupil in a school has as much one on one time as the altar boy and priest. Not that that counts as much. The priest who abused me did not do it before or after Mass, it was in his room in the rectory while I was watching Batman, he had a color TV

Would not a law defining Marriage have to be acceptable by a majority of the population? Come to think of it, it has. A few states have had referendums on the Gay Marriage thing. And in a few of the states, the population clearly said they did not want Gay Marriage. So then, with the people speaking clearly, the Courts decided no, you can't do that. Then again, we have the Courts as part of the Checks and Balance system the US Government was based on. The COurts protect the rights of the minority, or the oppressed. The question is, who gets to define what consitutes a minority or opression? If a law against Gay Marriage is illegal, how could it ge ton the Ballot in the first place? Then again, should tbe Courts decide who/what gets on a Ballot? So, what was it that Lincoln said, a Government of the People, for the People and by the People, shall not perish from this earth unless of course the Court system thinks it most prudent... Personally, I don't care if a gay couple wants to be married, it really doesnt effect me much. But, I do want to know what I beleive is as protected as the polar opposite view that does not seem to be occuring. Just as a note, as a Roman Catholic I am feeling might oppresed right about now, time to sue somebody, hey Beavah, can you make a referral?

BasementDweller raises a point in the parent thread, how much adult planning should go into a new Venturing Crew as we all know its supposed to be a Youth Run Organization We have had members on the forum that had Re-Enactoring Crews, now I am pretty sure a bunch of youth didnt contact the advisor and say, hey we want to do this Civil War re-enacting and will you be the leader? The BSA markets the Venturing Program to many venues, especially Churches with its Youth Ministries branch of Venturing and its a rare group of teen agers that would go to their pastor and ask to form a Youth Church Group. Not saying it never happened or couldn't just saying its not the norm. So, adults have to get the ball rolling and plan a few activities to atract youth and see what type of response that will occur. If its meets a need in the community, the Crew grows, if not, it whithers quickly. Leastwise thats my thoughts. What do you think? The goal of any Venturing Crew should be that the adults show up to provide credit cards for reservations and required two deep leadership as everything else has been taken care of. But thats just me, how much adult intervention should be allowed in a Crew?

Short, the Catholic church has an 8 hour youth protection class all youth leaders must take. Least in the Disocese I live in does and I am told its National wide.Youth Prtection is emphasiszed Cam, the church I go to has female servers and female Extraordinary Ministers, you only have males? Must be a local thing. Officers are elected on the skills and abilites the membership see in them, ranks and/or acheivements are not part of the eligibility quotient. I spent 3 years in Seminary, Carpe Diem and Tempus Fugit et Illegitimi non carborundum

Always thought that was one of the best uses of Tamborines in pop music other than: Drop your silver in my tambourine Help a poor man fill his pretty dream Give me pennies I'll take anything Now listen while I play My green tambourine That should keep you busy

I have never thought it was a good idea to turn away an interested youth, Baptist or otherwise. You tell them its Roman Catholic based and then if they want to join, they do. They won't get upset if you only have fish on Fridays in Lent or always go to mass on SUndays on outings. Its their choice to attend and your choice as the CO to have Mass as part of the program. You could say Catholics only, just as you could say males only or females only, thats up to you as the CO. You realize Powderhorn is usually a Council or larger (such as Area) activity and most times open to any one who wishes to attend, youth or adult. If you are going to tailor it Catholic, say so up front and have at it. I think a Crew doing the Gregorian Chant at Easter Midnight Mass would be quite the thing. It would be fun to have the Crew Uniform a hooded cassock, but that may border on the Jedi Knightish

But if only 5%, one out of twenty has leadership skills, then are not the other 95% of us up the creek? if the boys dont listen or follow or buy into a "great Program" then the key is who says its a "great program" in the first place. If the scouts don't care, no matter how skilled the presenter, the presentation will be a flop. What are the reasons the boys join your troop? FOr the backpacking? The Rock Climbing? The white water rafting? The 10 consecutive months of Cabin Camping with all night gaming marathons? What compels the youth to show up? WHy are they members of the units we serve? Once that is understood, the rest should be easy... I think... If the reason is the softest way to Eagle, then one needs to search ones soul

if there is a cut up in the back disrupting the SPL's EDGE method teaching, its not EDGE's fault. Rather the cut up should be the guy presenting, I thought it was all about identifying the natural leader and using him to get things done

Sounds like you would be a good fit as a Youth Ministries Crew. One thing to always remember that even though you may be registered as a Youth Ministries, your youth members could strive for any of the Venuturing Acheivements be it a Gold, Silver, Ranger, Trust or Quest. This part of the program is truly dependent on the youth, I was with an Outdoor Crew that got in the habit of going from Eastern PA to the Virginia Shore each year as a Habitat for Humanity Crew. Were we Outdoors or Youth Ministries? Eating and Sleepin in a church for a week would lead you to think YOuth Minsitries, but when you spend 8 hours swinging a hammer, putting up drywall or framing a house it seems pretty outdoorsy. You need 5 youth, but you also need a critical mass of youth who will give you 5-6 youth at every event. How many that takes is up to the group. Sometimes it take 7 other time 20, depends on the composition to the group and how committed the youth are, All in all, most crews I know of are ecletic in nature branchinf out in many directions. Some do have a very focused interest such as re-enacting but that is up to the group

Have always thought there was nothing like a scoutlike discussion concerning program and various interpretations of G2SS and since this is already nothing scoutlike, I shall bow out.

He must have the boy spirit in him; and must be able to place himself on a right plane with his boys as a first step. He must realise the needs, outlooks and desires of the different ages of boy life. He must deal with the individual boy rather than with the mass. He then needs to promote a corporate spirit among his individuals to gain the best results.

I thought Unit Program and Focus were the responsibility of Unit Leadership. (This message has been edited by oldgreyeagle)

Ok, I think I understand If you want to know what it would be like to have the female BPSA scouts show up though, I may have had a glimpse. Back about 2003 the COuncil had a Camporee, all the Distrcts were there, and it was for Troops and Crews. The FRiday night event was watching a movie out doors, as Dusk was falling they started with music video's, just as the female dominsted crew I was associated with got the entrance point, "Girls just want to have fun" started. So, the crew "Danced" down the center aisle, singing as loud as they could the chorous. It may have been the first time many saw a Female Venturer in the first place. The place went wild, or most of the boys did at least Those were the days my friend, I'd thought they never end, we'd sing and dance forever and a day, we'd live the life we'd choose fight and never lose...

Clearly I am confused, Why would a bunch of BPSA Scouts, either male or female show up at a BSA Council event, in or out of uniforms? Are you talking about having a BPSA unit soley for the girls? Sorry, I got lost in what your musings are

But if the unit is leaving to join the BPSA, how is losing BSA membership an issue?

BD, how could a DE remove unit Leadership? Thats the job/Responsibility of the COR/Institutional Head.

I think its a local thing. I did not recharter with the troop my son was in this year. He is going to be 27 in June. I think 15 years is long enough. Then again, the Committee Chair is on her 25th year I think and the scoutmaster 10 years as scoutmaster, 6 years previous as ASM. One of the ASM who is the COuncil NYLT Scoutmaster has been in over 10 years is going strong. We like working with each other It comes down to working with people you enjoy working with. I know the District People and like them, heck I guess you could say I am a Disitrct Person, There are a few blow hards but they tend to get worked around. Program is kept front and center and drives the District. I think we have often said, People vote with their feet, either scouts or scouters and people rarely walk away from a good time. So, if the nucleus of adults is having a good time, then it works and thrives. I would hate to work in the enviroment that BD describes. I am certain I would not have lasted this long in that sad state of affairs

The COuncil I serve is using the same price for 2013 as was used for 2010, I am not sure that is lowering the price, but its not raising it either.

I beleive it was B-P that is credited with starting the world wide Scouting Movement, Earnest Seton and Dan Beard are in the category of BSA originators and there is a difference As far as B-P liking younger women, it was not unusual in the second half of the 19th century for older "established" men to wed younger women. I have to say, those who have read the forum for awhile know a former member of the Venturong Crew I help start became a Professional Scouter, she is on her way to be a District Director in the Cradle of Liberty COuncil March 1, 2012 after being the DE here in the District I serve. At one Crew meeting we were talking about B-P, his good friend Julitte Gordon-Lowe, who turned down a marriage proposal from B-P or so it was asserted. The Prospective DE commented on the age difference and we realized I was 55, the age B-P married Olave and the YOung Lady was 23, Olaves age when they wed. We looked at each other and both said "eeewwwww" at the same time. Great hilarity followed. FUnny how times change

When I was naught but a lad, the troop of my youth went to the Grand Canyon, and we were just west of O'Hare field in Chicago. It was a great experience, I will be putting up a picture on the Facebook page. We went by rail and camped overnight in the Bright Angel Campground, which is next to Phantom Ranch on the Canyon Floor. Sat in Bright Angel Creek and let the water soak us good. We did the mules, rode horses and generally had a great time