OldGreyEagle

The Scout Fest 2006 held on the grounds of Kutztown University in Kutztwon PA was held this past week end (May 19-21) Over 5,000 participants were registered. Venturing has specific events from a film festival of Crew produced films to tie-dyeing and many others. Perhaps the most popular event was the Venturing "social" held after the fireworks on Saturday night. There was fear if it was called a "dance" that males wouldnt show up because they might think they would have to dance. It wasnt called a "mixer" as it was felt that "mixer" was an Anchronistic term, they went with "social" and indeed it was with over 10 crews snacking, talking and dancing to the DJ's music (Also a Crew member). The height of the evening would have to be the entire attendees singing the refrain to the VIllage Peoples "Y M C A" A gathering of Arrowmen was held in the next room. The question of whose party was more rockin was answered when in less than 30 minutes the Lodge Chief was dancing with the Venturers I love this Venturing Crew Stuff!

Personally I don't beleive the writer of the story was ever a card carying member of the uniform police as no self respecting "undercover Insignia Placement Enforcement Officer" would ever refer to any uniform as a "set of Class A's"

Since its the son that has issues with it, the son should be the one who tells mom to stay home, that way it stays in the family and keeps the crew out of where it has no place being ( in the middle of a family)

AHA, laid waste by Venturing jargon, Ranger is specific to Outdoor Venturing Crews Trust is specific to Religious Life Crews Quest is specitic to Sports Crews Quartermaster is specific to Sea Scout Ships But all Venturers can earn the Gold and Silver... Then again, a Venturer in a Religious Life Crew could earn a Ranger and Quest if all requirements are met and a member of a Outdoor Crew could earn the Trust and Quest then again, thats how I understand it

Gee beav, I see your point, I guess i wanted to extrapolate trained = competent, but when push comes to shove, no it doesnt...

I understand about people "not having time for training" but consider: What would you do if your son's baseball coach had no concept of the infield fly rule or didn't know that a runner hit in fair territory by a batted ball is out and the batter is awarded a hit? What about a Soccer coach who couldnt rudimentary explain what constitutes "Offsides" ? What about a football coach who teaches tackling head down, leading with the helmet ideally aimed at the opponents knees? I don't offer the comment, every youth deserves a trained leader to be coy or flip, I offer it because I beleive in it. BTW, yes, it takes a tremoundous amount of time and committment to provide the training, whether its a group session, a unit session or a single one on one session.(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

We "HAD" a Venture Crew whose leaders refused to get training, they were not rechartered. I was holding my breath as well as I didnt think the Council would actually dump a unit, but they did. The Council said if the leaders didnt bother to find out what the promise is, how can they deliver it?

http://www.minsitrails.com/Documents/StrategicPlan/index.htm This plan was devised and implemented to attract more scouts and retain the ones we have. I know it looks like just another slick advertisment, but click on the blue headers and look at the nuts and bolts items and goals and I can tell you these are items being worked on. In 2004 all Scoutmasters, Cubmasters, or Venture Crew Advisors had to be trained for the unit to recharter. In 2005 it was all Committee Chairs, for 2006 it was all new contact personnel. I know we have had the discussion about whether or not you could "mandate training" and while that debate may continue, does not every youth deserve a trained leader?

I know its a tad long, but it's worth the read. I am proud to say I know John and am associated with Troop 362 in Bethlehem: A boy becomes a son Bethlehem Twp. woman gave Russian a home. By Kathleen Rose Bercaw Special to The Morning Call There are days when 16-year-old John Lahutsky can barely contain his euphoria. He might be poring over a favorite social studies project at East Hills Middle School, or working on a project with his beloved Boy Scout Troop 362, or chowing down on ribs, another favorite. Then it hits him. ''I love my life,'' he'll say to himself. ''I just love it.'' And what a life it is. He loves Tchaikovsky and martial arts, and is a First Class Boy Scout who has earned eight badges, ''with no short-cuts,'' his mother Paula Lahutsky, of Bethlehem Township, would quickly interject. John's life has taken many turns, but certainly no short-cuts. And Paula's journey to motherhood was no smooth sail either. On Mother's Day and every day, however, they are sure of this: They are hugely happy to have arrived at their destination. Eight years ago, John had no mother. His name was Vanya Paustookov, although he was little more than a number living within the walls of Children's House No. 10, the Moscow orphanage where he ate and slept. His ears had never thrilled to Tchaikovsky's melodies, and social studies was as alien to him as baby back ribs swimming in barbecue sauce. Vanya always knew what his life lacked, for the total nothingness that greeted him daily was unavoidable. He hasn't forgotten the emptiness, but the memories are bearable because everything has changed. He knew all about aching memories by age 6, when he learned the unrelenting permanence of goodbye. For more than a year, his most coveted activity was teaching his friend Andre how to talk. Although both boys had outgrown their cribs, they were pleased that theirs were alongside each other, where they could peer through the bars that surrounded them and find comfort in the familiarity of each other's faces. Andre had never spoken until Vanya decided his neighbor needed first a friend and second, words. He can't pinpoint when, but sometime after Andre was adopted and left, Vanya stopped dreaming of the stuff that happy childhoods are made of. He had watched other children come and go, and none of it was easy. But losing Andre hurt. Perhaps it was the way Andre smiled at him that made Vanya feel needed, or maybe it was the accomplishment he felt when Andre responded and actually correlated thoughts and words. Happy moments were rare. Magical ones, wrapped within the connection between Vanya and Andre, were all but nonexistent. And so, as Andre walked out the door, Vanya's cherished dream faded. Never mind a new computer or soccer ball. All Vanya wanted was a family. It wasn't a dream that dissolved easily, for it would be presumptuous to think that anyone who weighed 2 pounds at birth and survived life in a Russian orphanage didn't know how to dream. From the vantage point of his crib, he could envision the woman his mother with a wide smile and gentle hug, or the father with a deep voice and strapping shoulders, who would carry him out of Children's House No. 10 and take him home. And when his basic hope, this sweet vision, didn't materialize, he needed to remain as strong and resolute as a front-line soldier. Vanya was born with cerebral palsy, a chronic condition caused by a brain injury that usually occurs during fetal development or infancy, which affects body movement. He endured multiple leg surgeries without a parent to coax or coddle him through the painful recuperations. In the absence of a walker or crutches, holding onto the edges of cribs in his room afforded him the luxury of standing upright. Although a bright child, for a time he was placed in an asylum, where he was drugged and confined to a crib in a locked room for hours. He survived through sheer determination and with the dream that someday the nightmare would end. On three occasions, he was told that a British couple would adopt him. Three times the couple never came. He clung to slices of interaction with social workers. A group of British women who took interest in the orphanage brought smiling faces, arms that hugged, and the hope that somewhere outside there were more people like them. Inside, there were people like the aide who one day told Vanya that no one would ever take him home. Her matter-of-fact summary concluded: ''You'll never leave here.'' Whether that was the final straw or it was a combination of all the horrors that slowly crushed Vanya's dreams, he cannot say. He does know that in August 1999, when he finally was told that a woman from America was here and would be his mother, it was too much to grasp. Home, heart ready Nearly a year earlier and on the other side of the world, Paula Lahutsky, a school psychologist in the Pleasant Valley School District for 24 years, was settled into a comfortable lifestyle. After caring for her invalid father for four years before his death, she again was enjoying wonderful friends, a career she loved and a strong church community. The thought of becoming a mother was as far from her mind as Moscow. Then she read the blurb in her church bulletin inviting parishioners to consider adopting 8-year-old Vanya, a handicapped child whose future looked bleak. Vanya, it explained, would be placed in progressively worse conditions as he got older. His plight was conveyed by two parishioners who had recently returned from adopting a child who lived in Vanya's orphanage. While there, they witnessed Vanya crying inconsolably after learning that his would-be British parents had a change of heart. Paula pondered the life-changing decision, but not because she was reluctant to change her lifestyle. She had moved to a Bethlehem Township ranch house and made it handicap-accessible when caring for her father. It seemed that her home was waiting for Vanya. What she feared was the convoluted Russian adoption process and emotionally immersing herself in a dicey situation. Two weeks later, the inexplicable and overwhelming desire to become Vanya's mother obliterated any lingering doubt. Her mission in life became a ticket out of Moscow: for two. Temporarily lost Not everyone, however, was ready to jump on the bandwagon or airplane. When she talked by phone with the contact person at the Orthodox Church in America, which was facilitating the adoption, she was informed that the church wasn't certain a single-parent adoption would be approved. It seemed that a single woman had previously adopted a child, and the situation had ended in failure. This predicament, Paula assured them, would not be hers. ''Why should all of the children suffer because of one failure?'' she asked. It subsequently was decided that Paula could proceed. With the help of Diakon Adoption and Foster Care of Topton, Paula completed the required home study and mounds of paperwork to adopt Vanya only to be informed a few weeks later that the Russian authorities had lost track of him. ''What do you mean, you don't know where he is?'' Paula asked in disbelief. ''How can no one know where he is?'' Offers were made for other children, children who were ''better,'' meaning not handicapped. ''Don't even tell me about them. I want him. I want Vanya,'' Paula replied with the furor of a mother whose child had been snatched out of her arms. His whereabouts at that time still remain somewhat of a mystery, but it is believed Vanya was in the hospital undergoing or recuperating from surgery. Several days later came the news that Vanya had been found, and plans for the journey to his first and last home were under way. Meanwhile, Paula was beginning to panic. Not about caring for an 8-year-old, mind you, but about driving to Philadelphia to the immigration office for a notarization required for the adoption ''I am so not a risk-taker,'' she says. ''I avoid driving in a lot of traffic and, although I was going to do it, the thought of driving to Philadelphia scared me.'' Fortuitous encounter Driving home from school one day, Paula was thinking of the dreaded trip when she noticed her mailbox had been run over. Inside the mailbox was a note: ''In order to avoid an accident, I drove into your mailbox. Please call me at this number so that I can pay you for it. Stacey.'' Paula did not immediately call, and she placed the note on her kitchen table. A few hours later, she answered a knock on her door. It was Stacey's apologetic husband, Greg. Their conversation, Paula recalls, went something like this: Greg: ''Ma'am, my wife ran over your mailbox. We insist on paying for it.'' Paula: ''You don't need to pay for it, but would you mind putting it in the ground for me when I get a new one?'' Greg: ''No problem. Here, let me write my phone number on the ticket stub that my wife wrote on.'' Paula: ''Ticket stub?'' Greg: ''Yes, I drive the Pennsylvania Turnpike to Philadelphia every day.'' Paula: ''Can I ask what you do?'' Greg: ''I work at the immigration office.'' Paula: ''REALLY?'' As Vanya's adoption was becoming real, a smashed mailbox produced the remedy for Paula's driving angst. Paula asked Greg if she could hitch a ride with him to the office and Greg replied, ''Ma'am, I'll take a day off work to do that.'' Which he did. The next day, Vanya's documents arrived in Paula's mail, and the following week Greg whisked Paula to the state's Office of Immigration. 48 pounds, 46 inches In July 1999, Paula waited in the car outside Children's House No. 10 with armfuls of gifts for Vanya, who was still unaware of her efforts to adopt him. Paula would name him John, the English translation for Vanya. Her eyes were glued to the adoption agent as he returned to the car without John and with the heart-stopping news that again, the boy's whereabouts were unknown. Several days later, authorities learned John had been placed in a foster home and his foster mother, who didn't want to give up her stipend for housing him, had fled with him 1,000 miles from Moscow. They located them and returned John to the orphanage, where he and Paula finally met. John, then 9, was wheeled to his mother in a stroller, his primary means of navigation to that point. He weighed all of 48 pounds, and was 46 inches tall. Paula had dreamed of this moment, and knew exactly what she wanted to say. ''Hi, I'm your mother,'' she said, leaning down to look into his eyes and give him a long, gentle hug. John, afraid he would say the wrong thing and be sent back to the orphanage, was speechless. ''The funny thing was,'' John recalls in perfect English, ''I waited all this time and was so nervous that I didn't say anything. I didn't think this could really happen to me.'' A few days earlier, on July 28, 1999, exactly nine months from the day Paula made the decision to adopt John, Paula had stood in a Russian courtroom to file documents for his adoption. On Aug. 8, 1999, Paula and John Lahutsky became mother and son. 'The moment I knew' Sitting in their cozy home sprinkled with pictures of John, they are a living portrait of love and happiness. John, handsome and poised, dressed in his perfectly pressed Scout uniform, evokes all the glowing adjectives a parent yearns to hear of a son brave, kind and hard-working. ''I wouldn't have come as far as I have without my mother,'' says John, who walks expertly with his crutches and is proudly working toward his yellow belt in martial arts. He plans to be a lawyer. His hazel eyes reflect astounding calm; his smile, confidence, as though the joy of his present life has somehow muted the anguish of his past. ''Some very bad things happened to me when I was younger,'' he says. ''But now I'm here.'' Paula, tears pouring down her face, hears her son talk of his past, how he loves his mother, his home, his life. She recalls how quickly she bonded with John, and the day when she knew John had bonded with her. He had been outside for a while taking in the freedom of walking outdoors, when he came in the house and said, ''Hello, lubee myah,'' a Russian colloquialism that means, ''Hello, my love.'' Becoming very still, she draws a breath. ''We hugged and hugged. That was the moment I knew. I knew I was his mother.'' For information about adoption referrals through the Orthodox Church in America, call Arlene Kallaur at 516-922-0550, extension 126. For information about Diakon Adoption and Foster Care, call 610-682-1504 or 888-582-2230. http://www.mcall.com/news/local/all-b1-5mothermay14,0,2680094.story(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

I don't think allowing female members (read Venturers, I am not talking about adults) in the OA would be a good idea and before I get stoned as a knuckle dragging neanderthral, let me s'plain. Lets say that Venturers were allowed in the OA, and that the nights camping requirement was the same, but that the Venturer had to earn the Bronze OutDoor award instead of first class. Sounds good so far? Ok, now to the crux of the issue. You have to be 14 to join a Crew, if it takes 18 months to 24 months for a Venturer to get the required camping nights in and earn the Bronze Out Door award (no mean feat I will tell you), the earliest a Venturing youth could qualify for the OA is roughly 15 1/2 - 16. What is the average age in your area of Boy Scout ordeal candidates? Would this be a workable situation? On a completely sexist note, if they let Venturing Girls be OA members, I predict 6 years from that date the National Chief with be a Cheiftess and just about every Lodge Chief will be female. Its got to do with Ages and Stages

Ed, I know Merlyn is the burr that gets under your saddle like no one else, but really, reread your last post "He might not be legally old enough to give consent but that doesn't mean he wasn't a willing participant..." Are you really saying that a 12 year old can willing participate in sex and in giving the willing participation that the adult is not criminally culpable?

I have scripts for 2 Eagle COH you may like, PM me your Email address and I will send them to you

There are some sports coaches who are acclaimed great because they have a winning system and consistently find atheletes who fit their system and continue to win. Then there are other sports coaches who are acclaimed great because they consistently win by using a system that fits the athletes they have and change methods and system to fit available personnel I think the coach that can adapt to available personnel is better than one who only does things one way and fits people to the system. While it is the BSA mission to train young people to make ethical choices over their lifetime by instilling in the the values of the Oath and Law, you have to consider your personnel and the systems available. I do not like the cuss cup approach at all, a scout should not be profane or vulgar and should temper his language because he is intelligent enough to express himself with the veritable plethora of vocabulary open to him that are not profane or vulgar. Then again, sometimes the first thing you need to do is stop the bleeding. If the immediate loss of material wealth is required to make an individual consider his speech pattern as the issue of character development and ethical choices are beyond the immediate grasp, then that is the best approach. We would love to have the scouts learn about choices and consequences, you curse you pay is on the lowest level, but its at least a level. I would much rather not have them curse because its unscout-like, but that may be beyond the group at this point.

LDS troops dont use the DRP? Are we sure?

UNIVERSAL LAWS OF BOY SCOUT SUMMER CAMP LAW #1 The number of mosquitoes at any given location is inversely proportional to the amount of repellent remaining. LAW #2 The distance to a given campsite remains constant as twilight approaches. LAW #3 Any stone in a hiking boot will migrate to the point of maximum pressure. LAW #4 The probability of diarrhea increases with the square of the poison ivy content in the local vegetation. LAW #5 Members of the opposite sex are only encountered while dealing with diarrhea relating to LAW #4 above. LAW #6 The area of level ground in a given campsite diminishes as the need to make camp becomes finite. LAW #7 Tent stakes come only in the quantity "N-1" where N = the number of stakes required to stake down a tent. LAW #8 When utilizing a mummy bag, the urgency to urinate is inversely proportional to the amount of clothing worn. (There is also a correlation that is inversely proportional to the temperature + the degree to which the mummy bag is completely zipped). LAW #9 Waterproof clothing isn't. (However it demonstrates 100% effectiveness at containing sweat.) LAW #10 The weight of a backpack increases in direct proportion to the amount of food consumed from it. LAW #11 When executing the instructions of a pump-activated water filter, the term "hour" should be substituted for "minute" when calculating average quarts per minute. LAW #12 Average temperature increases/decreases inversely with the amount of clothing available. LAW #13 When hiking boots are removed, it is not possible to put them back on. LAW #14 Water bottles that are full when packed, will spontaneously deplete prior to arrival at campsite. LAW #15 Under any conditions, matches will find a way to get wet. LAW #16 Under any conditions, everything meant to be kept dry will find a way to get wet. LAW #17 A single rock located under any tent will also be located under the sleeping bag. LAW #18 Your side of the tent will always be the side that leaks. LAW #19 Universally, all foods assume a uniform taste, texture, and color when freeze-dried. (When reconstituting, divide number of servings by two). LAW #20 All tree branches in a forest grow outward from their respective trunks at exactly the height of a human nose (unless interaction is with human males, in which case branches will also grow at groin height). LAW #21 The toothpick in a Swiss Army knife evaporates as soon as the box is opened. LAW #22 The sun sets 3.5 times faster than normal when you're trying to set up camp. LAW #23 A sufficient amount of dirt will get tracked into the tent on the first day out, that the food required for the rest of the trip can be grown in rows between the sleeping bags. LAW #24 No matter where you're going it is the wrong path. LAW #25 No matter where you end up it is the wrong campsite.

And the best part is, every camp can be the camp I describe, its up to the adults and the staff to deliver ...

Have you ever had a boy in the troop that was from a rather checkered past, that overall wanted to be on the right path but sometimes fate and his own personality got in his way, but his heart "was in the right place"? perhaps you witnessed such a young lad, and he really "needed" a smoke and was told by the adult he was with that he shouldnt smoke in uniform, but also the adult considered that the youth had been on good behavior, that his behavior had been acceptable and that perhaps in allowing a smoke the adult was reaching out to the youth in a way the youth was not accostomed. Maybe he waved you off because you didnt know the background... Then again, he may be just a slacker scout with a slacker adult, you just never know

I am responsible for deleting the thread on Measuring Charactor, I thought I was cleaning up duplicate muiltiple postings and I inadvertently deleted the whole thing I blame me

Young Folks, Old Folks Everybody Come To the Boy Scout Sunday School and have a lot of fun Put your backpack, sleeping bag and canteen at the door And youll hear some bible stories like youve never heard before The world was made in six days and finished on the seventh According to the contract, it should have been the 'leventh But the painters wouldn't paint and the workers wouldn't work So the cheapest way to finish it was fill it in with dirt The Lord made Satan and Satan made sin The Lord made a cubby-hole to put Satan in Satan got huffy and he said he wouldn't stay So he's been a little Devil ever since that day Adam was the first man that ever was invented He lived all alone and never was contented Made out of mud in days gone by, And hung out on a picket fence in the sun to dry Adam was a gardener and Eve was his spouse Caught at stealing apples, they started keeping house Their married life was happy and pleasant in the main, Until they had a little son, and started raising Cain Adam was a prophet, first one that we know In a place called Eden, he helped things to grow Adam served the Lord by following His ways We are his descendants in the latter days Noah was a carpenter who stumbled in the dark He picked up a hammer and built himself an ark In came the animals, two by two All except for the worms, and they came in the apples For forty days and forty nights it rained and blew The water covered up the land and all the mountains too When Noah got to wondering just where he was at The old ark ran aground on top of Ararat Lot's wife was a woman who was mighty curious If she wasn't in the know, she'd always raise a fuss One day while leaving town, her curiosity made her halt When she turned to look she turned into a block of salt Esau was a cowboy of a wild and woolly make His father left him half the farm, and half to brother Jake Esau was no farmer, and he thought he'd fly the coop So he traded it for pottage; that's a fancy name for soup Joseph was a shepherd lad, so Bible stories tell us His father gave him such a coat, it made his brothers jealous They sold him into Egypt for a small consideration Where he made a major fortune on a grain speculation Moses was a Yiddish lad, went sailing in a skiff Along came Pharaoh's daughter, and she gave the lad a lift She took him to the palace and she fed him something grand, So he led the whole caboodle out into the promised land Pharaoh was a mighty king, the Kaiser of his day He nagged the sons of Israel until they ran away When he tried to follow them across the bounding main, His entire army died, with water on the brain Balaam was a prophet who went out to curse the band Of Israelitish children who had come to claim the land But on his way to do this deed, his little donkey balked And when he kicked her in the slats, she looked at him and talked Samson was a strong man of the good old-fashioned school; He slew a host of Philistines with the jawbone of a mule Then Delilah came along and filled him up with gin, And when she'd cut off all his hair, the coppers run him in Ruth was a gleaner and Naomi was her ma They went into the fields to gather in the straw Boaz came along and asked Ruth if she'd be his wife She married him for his money and they lived a happy life David was a shepherd lad, a fearless little chap Along came Goliath, just a looking for a scrap David hadn't any sword, he used a sling instead He slung rocks at Goliath and the giant fell down dead David played the lyre and he played it rather sweet He used to play before King Saul, the while the king would eat But the king was fond of ragtime, which David couldn't play So the king bought a phonograph, and sent poor Dave away King David and King Solomon lived very merry lives With many, many lady friends and many, many wives When old age came upon them with all its many qualms King Solomon wrote the Proverbs and King David wrote the Psalms Solomon was a wise man, he had a lot of cash Queen of Sheba came along and Solly made a mash I guess he thought that royalty was rather underpaid For he took to writing proverbs though he was a king by trade Elijah was a prophet who attended county fairs He advertised his business with a troop of dancing bears He sold assorted prophecies, and every afternoon, He ascended up to Heaven in a patent fire balloon Jonah was an emigrant, so goes this Bible tale He booked a steerage passage on a transatlantic whale Jonah in the belly of the whale felt quite compressed So he pushed a little button and the whale did the rest Jonah was a prophet, tried to run away, But he later learned to listen and obey When we really try, the Lord won't let us fail That's what Jonah learned deep down inside the whale Daniel was a courtier who wouldn't mind the king The king said he couldn't stand for any such a thing He chucked him in a manhole with lions down beneath But Daniel was a dentist and he pulled the lions' teeth Daniel was a prophet He refused to sin So the king threw Daniel in the lion's den Angels calmed the lions, and the king soon saw Daniel's pow'r was great, for he obeyed God's law Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, Disobeyed the king, and so they had to go (and told him where to go) He threw them in a furnace, to burn 'em up like chaff, But they wore asbestos BVD's and gave the king a laugh Salome was a chorus girl who danced the hoochie kootch She caused quite a scandal 'cause she didn't wear too "mooch" The king said "Salome, we will have no scandal here" Salome said, "The devil!" and she kicked the chandelier Ahab had a lovely wife, whose name was Jezebel While looking out the window, to the dogs below she fell "She's gone to the dogs", the people told the king Ahab said he never heard of such a dog-gone thing Samson was a strong man of Jeffrey Johnson's School Had the strength of a thousand Philistines (men) and the jawbone of a mule Along came Delilah, cut off his curly locks So the only strength that Samson had was in his dirty socks

Oak-Kay, I can, but I saw what yew are up too, willow give me a hand? Wouldnt want to go out on a limb alone You provide the birch beer and I have a couple albums of Black Oak Arkansas we can listen too(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

And this http://www.zwire.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=16575221&BRD=2626&PAG=461&dept_id=536271&rfi=8 Scout troop should not be disbanded 05/03/2006 Volunteering to take a blow across the legs from a stick named "Roy" isn't the worst thing in the world that can happen to a young man. It's a little stupid - although the Marines do things like this. It should not be condoned by those in authority and, when such behavior is discovered, it should be proscribed. The word "hazing" conjures up images of sexual assault and endangerment of life and limb. The reason given for the dissolution of a Boy Scout troop in Tamaqua is not in that category. The striking with a stick was horseplay. It was not an extreme thing. The council's reaction was the extreme thing in this case. The troop should not be disbanded. There has to be more to this story that just the stick incident. The first news story says the charter was pulled "in part" because of the stick incident, but as has been commented on, there has to be more. Because the Cub Pack's charter is also being revoked, it has to be something between the BSA and the Chartering Organization. From the CO's representative in the first story it appears the CO tried to dismiss the incident as "horseplay and boys will be boys". The original story talked about the BSA providing counseling, apprently it didn't "stick"

the plot thickens, or at least continues http://www.zwire.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=16588308&BRD=2626&PAG=461&dept_id=536271&rfi=8 Troop meets for last time BY LESLIE RICHARDSON CORRESPONDENT 05/05/2006 TAMAQUA It was a Boy Scout meeting just like any other held at Zion Evangelical Church for the past 46 years. But Thursday evening will go down in history as the last time Troop 776 will ever meet. The Scout troop headed by state Rep. David G. Argall, R-124, was ordered by the Reading-based Hawk Mountain Council to halt all activities as of Thursday, with both the Boy Scout and Cub Scout troops ceasing to exist by May 31, due to an alleged hazing incident involving some members. Inside the safe haven of the building that has served them well, a group of boys and leaders held a board of review for future Eagle Scouts. Younger boys played a game and the older Scouts practiced for the upcoming Eagle Scout ceremony the last one they will attend as members of Troop 776. A group of parents sat at tables in the back of the room, reminiscing about past activities, encouraging the boys and still reeling from the shock of the announcement they heard on April 21. The issue began with a June 2004 incident at the Hawk Mountain Camp, Summit Station, when some Scouts were allegedly struck in the leg with an 8- to 12-inch stick. Argall said the two Scout leaders at the camp at the time of the incident were forbidden by the council to take part in Scout activities. Parents said the final straw seemed to come when the two leaders were invited to attend and participate in two Eagle Scout Courts of Honor ceremonies recognizing the Scouts highest achievement after being banned from any further group functions. All of us mothers have come here every week since our Boy Scouts have been in first grade, said Kathy A. Murphy, whose son, Shane, is an Eagle Scout. We are not just a troop. We are a family. This is not fair to the boys, Norma J. Secara said. They all enjoy being together and being Scouts, agreed Mary E. Gurcsik. This is special to all of them, but especially to the guys that arent involved in other things, she said. Gurcsik has three sons who are all Eagle Scouts. Most of the boys would not comment on the incident, but Alex J. Jones was at the camp when the alleged hazing took place. I was at the camp and I think it was just horseplay, he said. It was no game or ritual. It was just kids clowning around. Jones would not say who or how many Scouts were involved in the incident. Hazing to me is a matter of opinion, said Assistant Scout Master Daniel Woodring. Yes, there was a problem, yes, we needed to address it. But did we need to lose the whole troop over this? When asked if the boys involved in the episode could have been dismissed and thus avoid the disbandment of the entire troop, Woodring said: I dont know if the boys could have been dismissed, but if we removed them, what would they learn? There are other ways to teach them. Most of the boys, including Jones, were upset when they heard about the reprimand. They are now looking toward the future. At first it meant a lot (to hear that the troop was being disbanded), because we had the troop for so long, said A.J. Argall, 17, Argalls son. The church has been great to us; but it is really about the kids, and as long as we get to stay together we can play it through. Argall said another church could be granted a charter to start a new troop the boys can join. He also said some of the older boys may have the option of forming a Venture Crew, a group that provides an opportunity to acquire and advance leadership skills. Parents, however, are divided about the incident and the loss of the charter. Many feel the decision was an overreaction, considering this was a first violation. It was one and done, Woodring said. I dont think there is an appeal process. According to Joseph Vlcek, 82, who joined the troop committee in 1958, he can recall about 67 Eagle Scouts coming from Troop 776. If we werent any good, how come we have all those Eagle Scouts? Vlcek asked. We have lawyers, heart surgeons, policemen, heads of the fire department and people working for the CIA that have come from this troop. I dont think the entire troop should be punished after all of these years of doing such good work and all that we have taught these boys. Woodring said the troop will participate in frisbee games next week and hold three Eagle Ceremonies on May 18 at Zion Lutheran Church. I would like to see the Boy Scouts stay alive in the Tamaqua Area, Woodring said. I have been involved in this troop since the 1980s, and I have been fortunate to see so many boys grow up. Some of the troop officials say they arent even sure what the charges against them are. All the kids going for their Eagle are going to have to go somewhere else to complete it. I think that is just silly, said Daniel Geissinger, a member of the committee and a past Scout master who served the troop for 17 years. I think it is a raw deal. It stems back to the fact that they have been on top of us for years. For this to come up and for them to take our charter away is unbelievable, and I am still not sure what they are charging us with. There will be about 60 boys thrown out of scouting because of this, Geissinger said.

The best summer camp of all? Thats easy, Its the one where the first year scout struggles and fails on Sunday. Monday, and Tuesday to pass the swimmers test, completes it on Wednesday leaving the waterfront to a standing ovation by all present and floats back to his campsite... Its the one where the scouts while walking to flag raising come across a deer and its fawn, end up missing the flag raising, but will always remember the sight of the fawn nursing on its mother... Its the one where our scoutmaster leads a loud silly song in the dinning hall, who knew he could be so much fun? Its the one with the roaring closing campfire and skits by each troop that are funny and original... Its the one where a group of friends sleep under the stars around a campfire, talking about hopes, dreams and the future and fervently wishing each day to end as this one does... Its the one where a scout is unsure of his scout skills, but with determination earns the Pioneering meritbadge and ends up teaching the adults in his troop how to do an eye splice... Its the one where a scout can go all week without taking a shower, because swimming in the lake counts... Its the one where on Saturday you wish you could rewind time and do it all over again, even the bee sting on Wednesday. Here's hoping the Camp you attend is the best ever!(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

Beavah, if you have a beef with FScouter, use the PM feature

Hazing allegations cost Tamaqua Scouts their charter Youngsters hit each other with stick, says state Rep. Argall, who headed troop. Staff and wire reports A Tamaqua Boy Scout troop headed by state Rep. David Argall has lost its charter over an alleged hazing incident. Troop 776 and Cub Scout Pack 776, headed by the Schuylkill County Republican, will no longer be affiliated with Boy Scouts of America as of May 31. Scout leaders and parents say they were told the charter was revoked in part over an incident in June 2004 at the Hawk Mountain Camp in Summit Station, when some Scouts allegedly agreed to be hit in the leg with a stick in return for getting their names carved on it. ''There were some boys playing a game, and part of the game they came up with on their own involved hitting each other with a stick,'' Argall said. ''We understood that this is not 1960, this is not 1970, these things are taken a lot more seriously than in the past.'' The decision to revoke the charter was made by the Reading-based Hawk Mountain Council, which oversees Scouting programs in Berks and Schuylkill counties, said F. Darnall Daley Jr., a regional Scouting official. He declined to say why the charter was revoked but said Tuesday: ''One of the things that Scouting has to be is a safe haven for kids. That's an absolute essential.'' Revoking a charter, he added, ''is a fairly rare event.'' Argall, who did not attend the 2004 camp, said troop leaders followed council's direction to provide counseling for the troops in an effort to keep the charter. Leaders showed them videotapes and talked to them about preventing child abuse, Argall said. They stressed that violence is inappropriate. ''I thought we were making very good progress,'' Argall said. But the troop, which is attached to Zion Evangelical Lutheran Church, learned on April 10 that the charter would not be renewed. Argall said he hopes the council will either change its mind or at least charter a new troop in the community. ''We've been told there is no appeal, although we are trying to review our options,'' he said. ''An option the council has suggested is we can form a new unit at a different church.'' Argall said the troop is one of the largest in the area, with about 30 members and about 50 Cub Scouts in Pack 776. He said Scout leaders are urging parents and troops to stick with Scouting. George Taylor, a liaison between Zion Church and Troop 776, said he believes the activity at the camp was ''horseplay'' misinterpreted and that Hawk Mountain Council overreacted. ''You lose your charter because one of your Scouts has been molested by one of the leaders, not because some people were waving a stick around at each other,'' Taylor said. The 35-member Boy Scout troop had been affiliated with the Scouts for 46 years. Christina Noecker, whose 12-year-old son, Sebastian, joined the Scouts in first grade, called the loss of the charter ''utterly devastating.''