OldGreyEagle

When I said managers, I meant major league baseball managers. Your comment is what I meant by vocabulary defining a person's character

Those of you who are long time baseball fans know that the manager arguing with the umpire is a long term baseball tradition. There exists informally a list of words/phrases that when used by the manager guarantees immediate expulsion. This is the reason why the manager can come out and argue for quite a while and never be thrown out, he didn't use the code word. He can argue for quite a awhile and be safe, say the correct phrase and get tossed or he can come out and use that phrase and be tossed immediately. In general society we also have a list of words/phrases that guarantee immediate expulsion, maybe not from the activity by certainly from being taken seriously. A persons vocabulary shows quite a bit about a persons character, are they erudite or vulgar? Are they thoughtful or profane? The sooner a person learns that words do matter, that when you express yourself, the words used paint a picture about you which can take a very long time to fade the better situated they will be.

Pack, Medicare and Medicaid funds are paid by the Feds and the state to the hospitals who have provided covered services to the beneficiary (patient). It is of note that it doesnt matter what the hospital lists as a cost for the service, Medicare/Medicaid will pay what it deems appropriate and thats all she wrote, the bill is considerd paid and the patient doesnt pay the difference. If the chest x-ray costs $200 and Medicare pays $34.20, thats all the hospital gets, $34.20

Excellent point Beaver, a mission can change with time and organizations committed to longevity may adapt changes to the Mission as times change. That is of course as long as the Values remain intact

Oh yes, the mission, vision, values thing. I remember back when the management buzz was all about mission, vision and values and like lemmings we followed demming. The best part was the first lecture I heard on Mission, Vision and Values. It was focused on probably the first Mission Statement anyone ever heard was mentioned: Space, the final frontier. These are the voyages of the starship Enterprise. Its five-year mission: to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly go where no man has gone before. We know the values, quick what was the "prime directive"? and the Vision? "to boldly go where no man has gone before."

How about a timed event based on how much time it takes to change a tire on a car?

Way back in the Troop of my youth we went to the Grand Canyon, from the Chicago suburbs I'll have you know (about 1967) we subsisted almost exclusively on rudimentary dehydrated food (usually eggs and something called vega-rice and for lunch, spam and crackers. Beleive me, lunch was the best meal of the day. Fast forward to a back packing trip with the troop I currently serve. It was a few years back, when I was a fledgling leader. I had a dinner of fried spam and rice planned (ok it was minute rice ) When the scouts saw I had Spam, they all most to a one wanted to "have a taste" the problem was, if they hall got a taste, I would be dining on rice only. The kids had heard about spam, most knew the Monty Python SPam skit by heart, but none had actually tasted it . For a brief time, and I emphasize "brief" Spam was the meat of choice at campouts as the scouts experienced the spiced ham concoction. Most moved on, but a few developed a real attachement to it. I consider one of the things I am most proud/unsure of at the same time

On the other hand, I have four fingers and a thumb... And come from a Council that requires training (not all leaders) and you can read about the training requirements in the Councils Newsletter at http://www.minsitrails.com/Documents/Newsletter/May2006/final.pdf We have had required training, but no fines, for 2 years and from what I understand are a growing Council

I have always heard that the shortest job description for a scouter is to simply "deliver the promise" I find it hard to deliver anything when you don't know what it is

Ed, BW hasnt been around for quite awhile and I am sure many members who consider themselves long term posters here have no idea who you referenced. How about living in the present, not the past? And do you not think that you owe Eamonn an apology over that chipmunk crack? What in any of his posts makes you think he would do such a thing? or actually not do?

My eyes aren't what they once were, which post says that Councils HAVE started fining troops with untrained leaders?

On another thread a poster commented that we shouldn't deride a program unless we know all the specifics of that unit. It got me to thinking, what are people looking for when they post a situation or ask a question? I am sure everyone has their own answer to this query as we all look at things from our own unique perspective. And I think its that widely varied bank of unqiue experiences that is a fourm's greatest strength. I realize that when a question is raised or a situation described we never get all the information so we can only offer thoughts based on our experience and how we view the problem. Posters are free to follow, discard, or blend responses. Just as posters are advised to take advice given on any forum with a "grain of salt", the situations are also to be taken with a "grain of salt". It takes a lot of time and effort to be a good volunteer in a unit, district or council and I would like to think everyone appreciates that however, just because someone volunteers doesnt mean they are sacrosanct and above reproach. If an upset parent asks if a Board of Review should take 90 minutes with knot tieing, lashing demonstrations, and first aid skills exhibited I am going to say that is wrong, not tell the parent to support the adults of the program. If someone asks if a troop can alter the BSA uniform policy and is that OK, I am going to say no, its not ok. I find it hard to encourage support for adults who are wrong. What people do with what they read here is up to them. But I do feel it incumbent that we all respond from each unique perspective.

The Crew has done tie dying at such events often, we started by buying a tie dying kit and then getting the content list and then buying the items separately and in bulk. The one caveat I have is be sure to have an activity or two prepared. The first step in tie dying, as any refugee of the 60's will know, is that you may need to soak your item in sodium carbonate for 15 - 20 minutes to prep the item and that is a long time to stand around looking at the articel in the bucket going, "is it time yet?" Be sure the people running the booth are wearing tie dyed articles to promote the activity and the kids will think its way cool!

At some point you have to decide is it better to go along to get along or to speak the truth. What this troop is doing is wrong, that doesnt mean it wont happen. It dosent mean that if they show up at a District/Council event they will be sent home, what it says is that this troop doesnt have much a regard for the uniform method of scouting. Is this is a big deal? I dont know. What kind of example does this give the youth? That one I know, a tremoundously lousy one!

I am a bit prejudiced, but you cant do much better than Camp Minsi

I earned Eagle in 1969 at the age of 16. Maybe it was because most of the leaders were ex-military, but world affairs were discussed often. I remember a discussion after the 1967 "7 Day War" Israel had. I remember one of the ASM's saying we had better never get in a war with "the Arabs" as they didnt value life the same way we do. I didn't understand it at the time, I now understand. I remember an alumnus of the Troop came back from Viet Nam for Christmas and he stopped in at the Troop meeting. WIth his dress uniform all sparkling and all the scouts who knew him crowded around him. I remember one scout asked him if he had seen any "action" the soldier nodded his head and indicated he had. Another scout excitedly asked if he had gotten to "kill" any body yet. It was at this point the soldier got up and said he really had to go and it was great to see everyone. Again, as time goes on I gain a greater appreciation of questions and comments.

from the BSA Publication "Advancement Committee, Policies and Procedure" Eagle Board of Review The Boy Scouts of America has placed the Eagle Scout board of review in the hands of either the troop, team, crew, or ship committee or the district or council committee responsible for advancement. The council will decide and promulgate which method or methods may be used. The board of review for an Eagle candidate is composed of a minimum of three members and a maximum of six members, 21 years of age or older. These members do not have to be registered in Scouting, but they must have an understanding of the importance and purpose of the Eagle board of review. At least one district or council advancement representative shall be a member of the Eagle board of review, when conducted at the unit level, and may serve as chairman if requested to do so by the unit. Because of the importance of the Eagle Scout Award, a unanimous decision must be reached as to the Scout's qualifications. If a unanimous decision is not reached, a new review may be conducted at the request of the applicant, the unit leader, or the unit committee. The review should take approximately thirty minutes.

SO the competent way of handling Hitler would have been? The competent way of handling the Japanese after Pearl Harbor would have been? The competent way of handling the North Koreans in 1953 would have been?

I understand your frustration, sounds like the Camp was run like a real merit badge mill rather than a Scouting Experience. One question I have is why your efforts seem to be concentrated on what to do with the scouts. What about the camp? Do you plan on making your displeasure of the situation known to the Camp Director? The Council Camp Committee? The Council Executive? If you want to show your sons a good example, show how to fight the situation at the source and put an end to an apparently bad situation.

As I understand it, UN resolution 1559 was passed six years ago, it told Israel to get out of southern Lebanon and Lebanon was to get Hisbollah out of southern Lebanon as well. Well, that hasnt happened. Well, actually Israel did get out of southern Lebanon, and the Golan heights and the Gaza strip. Maybe we should bomb Israel and Hisbollah for not paying attention to the UN resolution, fair is fair. There does need to be 17 more to meet the threshold level that was reached before Iraq was invaded.

If someone can point out historic fallacies to anything I have said, please do so. I see nothing wrong with an accurate recounting of history. Our Troop Meeting was held on Dec 7th last year, I asked the scouts is they knew what day it was. A few did, no politics, just a remembrance of history.

Lisabob, I totally and absolutely disagree. Any talk of why we are in Iraq has to start with the treaty that Saddam signed at the end of the first Gulf War and his antics in expelling the weapons inspectors and the shell game he played with where they could and could not look. And that there were 18 resolutions fom the UN saying that Saddam was to comply to his promises. The US did not go into Iraq unilaterally, the UN Security Council agreed 18 times that Saddam should honor his committments. Many scouts do not remember the first Gulf War, were they even alive then? I think the past history is important to know when discussing Iraq(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

as is often said, hindsight is 20:20. But if 3 years after 9/11 biologic weapons are deployed in Atlanta that get traced back to Iraq, I wonder what Bush's job rating would be? Lets say you are a Den Leader and its a Cubbies birthday, the mom has supplied a huge sheet cake and you go about the job of cutting it up. You look down and see 3 knives you brought from your kitchen and start to think, I thought I brought 4. Then you notice Andy, the ADHD kid dancing around with his hands behind his back. Andy has been in trouble in before, can't sit still, always "bugging" who ever he sits next to, maybe "flicking" the neighbors ears. He has learned the old "pull my finger" trick and finishes it off in the traditional fashion. He has told you he wants to be a Boy Scout because they get to use knives. And, he fancies himself a knife fighting expert, demonstrating his techniques with sticks on multiple occasions. So you ask Andy to show you his hands, and he smiles and laughs and says sure I will, but he doesn't. So you look around and all the Cubbies are hard at their task, and Andy still has his hands behind his back and refuses to show you his hands. What do you do?

Its easy to explain why we are in iraq, the UN passed 18 resolutions in 16 years demanding Saddam Hussein comply with the terms of the surrender agreement of the first Gulf War and Saddam wouldn't. Rather than do nothing, President Bush decided to act before Saddam got to big to deal with so the US did what the UN was threatening. Funny, the whole thing could have been avoided if Saddam would have done what he promised to do, allow the weapons inspectors freedom of movement. Most scouts can understand what happens when you break a promise

How's That?