OldGreyEagle

The husband comes home from playing golf, he is sweaty, rumpled and generally in poor shape. His wife looks at him and says "Darling you look awful", he replies, " it was the worst, Harry had a heart attack on the first hole" the wife replies, "How horrible for you", the husband replies "Tell me about it, it was hit the shot, drag Harry for 18 holes"

I had thoughts of a hard biting scathing come back but realized the best course of action is to break the cycle, it was thenand is now People will have to determine how they view pranks, hazing, bullying for themselves.(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

Analogous to the Hypochondriacs Grave Marker I told you I was sick !(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

Dread epalmer84 virus(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

Hey, when people are out to get you paranoia is just good thinking. It may amaze you, as it did me, but at times not everyone on this forum is who they represent themselves to be. If you are whom you say you are, I apologize, but that will not make me any less wary. In the troop I serve we have had Protestants, Polish National Catholics, Roman Catholics, Jews and Hindu's. Now there is a group to write a Scout's Own but it can be done. The BSA requires a belief in a higher power, as do most if not all 12 step programs, nothing more.

I resemble that remark about not having a sense of humor, I voted for GW....twice

Call me paranoid but... Is there any reason why adc294 asked a question and hasnt responsed back? Could this be an attempt to watch scout leaders squabble amoung themselves?

I would say that a motley crew would pretty much be an ecletic crew, thats a new category you know

Well then, we will be a motley crew at last...

Well, in the name of good clean fun, let me dust off a scouting memory of mine, I have posted it before, but perhaps not all have read it. It was a long time ago, in a place far far away, well, actually Chicago area, about 1965 or so. I was a bright young scout, really Gung Ho. I thought being a scout was the bestest thing in the whole world, I was part of the World Brotherhood of Scouting, it was the 60's and love was around us. On one summer campout, we drove for what seemed like hours. We got to the campsite and set up.. The Troop used an Army surplus 16X16, that thing was huge, and it was heavy and we all loved it. It was so big the entire Troop slept in it. The cooler older guys on one side and us other guys on the other. After the tent was up and the gear stowed, Charlie, the SPL came over and told me he needed my help. I was in like 7th heaven. Charlie was like a god to us younger scouts, he had his license and his own car. It was a 57-58 Chevy, it was painted candy apple red and roared like a jet, that car was cool. Rumor was he shaved everyday and had a girl friend. He had muscles and was talking about joining the Army. I fairly floated as we walked over to the group of older cooler scouts. Finally I was going to be part of the in crowd. Then I was informed I was to be the bag man on a snipe hunt. It was simple, all I had to do was stand on the Snipe trail and hold the bag open and the Snipe would run straight into it. Now, wait I said, I know what a Snipe hunt is, and I am not going to do it. I felt a lot let down that Charlie thought I was stupid enough to fall for a gag like that. So then Charlie says, well, you are right, but you know, Snipes are birds (As Ed is sure to point out)and we happened to have driven into where they live. So badly did I want to be a member of the "Inner Sanctum" that I bought it. I went out and held the bag, and held it, and held it and held it. Well, back at camp the older scouts sure were having a party at my expense, they had this kid who knew about Snipe Hunts out on a Snipe Hunt, it was glorious. The adults on the trip knew what was going on, and reminded them that I was supposed to be brought back to camp about 1 am if I didnt show up first. Back at the Snipe Trail I stood, bag open. I knew Snipes were rare birds and figured we had driven long enough to get in their range. I waited, and waited. Along about dawn I figured I had waited long enough. Seems the older scouts got their signals crossed and everyone thought someone else would get me, but nobody did. I got back to camp as breakfast was being made, and when I was spotted, the whole camp cheered, laughed and hooted. I was not having a fun time. I remember thinking, remember this moment, remember how hot your cheeks feel, how angry you are, you are never ever going to feel this way again. A few months later it was the Fall Camporee. Charlie again asked me for some help. I asked him what, I was more than a little suspicious of anything he said at this point. He told me he needed the Camps Canon Report. It has the schedule of the Camporee on it and it was floating around the camp and people would get it, copy it down and pass it on. So, after being assured it was real, I made him say "scout's honor" I went off. Gol dang it if every troop I visited had just had it but passed it along minutes before I got there. I went to over 10 troops before a kindly old scoutmaster who knew my dad from work asked me if I had ever been on a Snipe Hunt,. I almost fainted. The rage, anger, fear, humiliation just ran through me like an electric shock. He had done it to me again. I walked back to camp, slinked actually, imagining all who saw me were laughing behind my back, pointing me out as that absolute and complete idiot, first he falls for a Snipe Hunt and then he beleives the Snipe Hunt guy and looks for the Canon Report. When I got back to camp, I walked up to Charlie and told him I was sorry, but I didnt get it, but I would go after it first thing in the morning. I never did go after it and I never talked to Charlie again. I never did anything he said and completely blocked him and all his older buddies out. I had learned never, ever to trust what a boy leader said because they were out to get me. I resolved that they did not exist in my world. As time went on, I made sure that no other scout ever went through what I did. I would tell all the new scouts about snipe hunts and canon reports and left handed smoke shifter, 50 ft of shoreline and all that. I told them if anyone asked them to do anything that didnt sound right, to ask me first. I had a few angry older scouts, but I didnt care and I was getting big enough that nobody retaliated. I eventually was elected Senior Patrol Leader because the scouts knew I would not betray them. Maybe I am humor impaired, but I think I can write a funny skit, somebody start a Skit thread and I guarantee two skits you will want to do, but right now, there is no humor in taking advantage of the Navet of a young scout

It was the summer of 1967, the Troop of my youth was in the Grand Canyon, our scoutmaster was a really cool guy. He played the bugle and was quite good. He also smoked, but back then there was no prohibition against adult leaders smoking in front of the youth. He was finshing a cigarette before he blew the bugle for formation, and a scout asked if he could inhale and then play the bugle to see what would happen. Well, he tried it and I have a picture of the smoke pouring out of the bugle, we always said Jerry could play one smokin' horn

Boys join scouts for the same reason most people join any group, to have fun and relax, to have a sense of belonging and to be able to do things they cant do by themselves

On another note, and separate from the Introduction ceremony I have another activity. It is done before the Crossovers arrive, perhaps the month before. I start off by saying in the next month the Troop will be adding new members to the troop. Then I ask them all to remember the first meetings they attended when they started with the troop. How nervous and excited and maybe a little scared they all were. How much they each admired the older, cooler scouts and how much they wanted to be like them. I ask them to think back and remember who those older scouts were. And how much they wanted to be like those older guys, well, some of them anyway because there were some guys who just didnt seem to belong in scouting, they were mean, nasty, not caring. Every Troop has them (from the youths standpoint, if not from the adults) Each new scout saw a boy they wanted to be like, and a few they didnt. The question I pose to the established scouts is, 'Who do you want to be?"

What I am going to describe is the extreme, you can modify it any way you want to. First, get a copy of "Are you ready for this" by 2Unlimited. Next a huge sound system, they used to be called Boom Boxes, but ever since Ipods have been put out by the pod people, I hardly seem them anymore. Next, you need some huge flashlights, floodlights really, the kind that take the huge battery to power. Then, at the Campfire, you have the SPL, or perhaps a happenin' guy like C-bolt to very loudly and with excitement in his voice start by saying "ladies and gentlemen, tonight we introduce and welcome the 2007 crossover class of Troop XXX! First, from Pack XXX we have Old GreyEagle, he goes to East Hills Middle school and has a dog named Rex! From Pack XXA we have Pack Saddle, he goes to Lincoln West Middle School and want to be an Eagle Scout! From Pack XXB we have SR540 Beaver, he goes to Washington Elementary and wants to be Chief Scout Executive some day! Do it really wild like they do before basketball games, have the scouts come out in full dress uniform and stand in front of the campfire, then after all the introductions have the scoutmaster and SPL come forward, say the boys name and place the troop neckerchief on the scout. After all have had neckerchiefs placed, a rousing cheer for all is given. It has possibilities

it's nice to know the time honored tradition of humiliation and terror is alive and well in the BSA So, would it have been better if the crying scout had founf out that the shot story was a scam and he had "called you out" , would you have messed with him again? I guess its true, nothings funnier than tormenting someone just because you can, its the most scoutlike thing I can imagine

Doody? never was good at sepling

I submit the public has a right to know where you sit on the dodo issue, or will you hide behind a tree?(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

So its my God for me, your God for you, and Charlie's God for Charlie and we respect each other's choice, sounds scoutlike

AntelopeDud, I have to ask, did you mean to have that name or was it supposed to be AntelopeDude?, either way you will always be the Duke of Dung to me.... Anyway, the ACLU comes up quite a bit in the Issues and Politics section although quite frankly that section has been pretty dead lately Anyway, perhaps BSA could improve its image by focusing on what is "right" about scouts, and I don't along political lines (as Boy Scouts are Nonmilitary, Nonpolitical and NonClass). What about emphasis on the Community Service scouts perform, what Eagle Projects have done, where former scouts are now in the community, opportunities for scouts regarding adventure. There is enough of a media prescence that will focus on what the BSA doesnt do, we need to promote what it is we do do (Do do? another scatologically oriented comment?) Anyway, we keep on talking about how to make the BSA relevant and I can see Brianbuf rubbing his hands together in glee and bringing back his website citing us as his greatest achievement...(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

OK, in the key of "D" Duke Duke Duke Duke Duke of Dung, Dung, Dung, Duke of Dung, Dung, Dung, Duke of Dung, Dung, Dung, As I walk thorugh this world nobody will touch me Because I am the Duke of Dung And when you are with me, you will be my Czarina of crap And no one will harm us because I am the Duke of Dung! Duke Duke Duke Duke Duke of Dung, Dung, Dung, Duke of Dung, Dung, Dung, Duke of Dung, Dung, Dung,

If nominated I will not run, if elected I will not serve... (everyone can breathe easy now)

I am not sure what part of the scout oath and law is ok with causing embarrassment but that may just be semantics. Prior to leaving for summercamp the troop is assembled and scouts are reminded that for the week, they will be living together in a community just as they live in one at home, and that a persons tent is just like their homes. No one is to go into another's tent unless invited and no one is to touch anothers property without permission, just like at home. So, given that as a backdrop, these are my answers: *Haulin' my bed up a tree - I am not going to laugh, the boy is going home. Simple as that, they were told personal property is off limits and its meant. I dont want to have to worry whether or not my stuff is going to be where I left it. What do we teach the scouts, that adults stuff is ok to play with? If they want to haul something up a tree, ask me for suggestions, if they want a quick trip home, screw with my stuff *Haulin' a first-year scout's bed up a tree Why would a first years stuff be any less valuable than mine? You mess with other peoples property, you can't play with us, just that simple. And I am not sure how a scout's reaction to their stuff being violated should enter into the situation. So this year, a couple kids haul Timmy's stuff up a tree, Timmy laughs and thinks its funny, the perps are contratulated and there is an air of frivolity all around. The next year they haul new scout Tommy's stuff up a tree and he goes ballistic, he thought that scouts respected other peoples property and here he finds out they dont, are this years perps treated differently because the object of their humiliation reacted differently? *Gettin' in a minor fight with your tentmate on day 4 because you're tired and grumpy - Depends on the situation and level of violence involved, many things maybe the right course *A prank that goes awry, and causes minor hurt feelings or extra work, but was without malice - Not sure how a prank is done without malice, at the heart is the thought "We are gonna GET whomever", not sure where the scout oath and law are in the "gonna get" mentality *Settin' fire to your tent with the fireworks you smuggled from home, or doing anything else that's deliberately mean, malicious, or destructive gets you delivered home by your parent that same day. And then some serious conversations the next week Agreed--- hey it had to happen eventually didnt it?

AARRGGHHHH, I would love to go, and the Crew may be there but I am committeed to staff a College of Commissioner Science that week end. Myself and my alter ego, Pierre Aloysius Dumont, will both be in attedance as well as John Newton.

This thread has certainly cut across the breadth of scouting issues. I am not sure we have another thread that has so many hot issues wrapped up in one place. This is how I see the issues and I think in total, most of use are in violent agreement. I think it best when adult leaders know what the response to belligerent behavior will be. When the rambunctious scout is about to dismantle your last nerve is not the time to begin to formulate an appropriate response. If the scout had a pattern of behavior that would warrant a "drop" in rank, then the scoutmaster should know he has the support of the troop committee to do what needs to be done for the good of the individual scout and the troop. Rather that telling a scout I would drop him a rank, I will say I will have your parents come and get you and take you home. Then we will discuss your behavior. If the scout has had a pattern of disruptive behavior the parents are already on notice such a call may be forthcomming. next, when distruptive behavior is shown, the adult leaders of the troop, both scoutmasters and committee have to look at it. Does the behavior represent a danger to self and others? if the answer is yes, then there cant be a second thought. The boy needs to find help, and that may or may not be a volunter group of adults trying to run a Boy Scout troop. If the adults can't handle, or rather are not equipped to handle behavior that poses a threat to the youth or others then the boy is gone, no question. In the troop I serve I know we try our upmost to provide an environment where all boys can be a scout. But unfortunately we had to let a boy go because of violent mood swings. Even the parents could not predict when he would erupt and after two incidents, he was asked to leave, now he has Auspergers and no one felt good about his leaving the troop, but we would all have felt worse if he actually had buried that hatchet in the other boy chest. I dont think that a single leader, scoutmaster, committee chair, etc. should ever feel they have the power to dismiss a scout from the program, but each one of them has to know if they feel a scout is a danger to himself and/or others and calls for a parental pickup, they know there will be a committee meeting to review what happened and what happens next. The scout has to know it was not one person who is responsible for his leaving the troop. if he thinks it was one, then he can reconcile the action by saying, that mean old mr greyeagle, he never liked me. When there is a group decision made, then maybe the scout pays attention. Then maybe not but its a shot. The whole concept of by laws, rules, regulations, etc is a continual soruce of fodder. What some refer to as by laws may be as simple as when the troop meets, when dues are due, and that kind of thing. Then again, there are troops with by laws that spell out required participation in activities and other things I find non-sensical but then again, maybe in the situation they are in they may make sense. I dont think anyone wants to abjectly summarily toss anyone from the program, but just like relieving an SPL of his postion before his term is up, once available recourses have been exhausted, there is little choice left

In Denali you get to use cat holes to bury your waste, but they expect you to pack out used toliet tissue and sanitary products. Not sure how the rangers pick who has that duty to inspect the hikers, but I am sure its not the plumb assignemnt. If the trend were to continue and we had to pack out EVERYTHING we packed in I could see a new POR in the Troop to assure all sanitary conditions are met, Here are some of the titles I came up with: The Emperor of Excrement The Duke of Dung The Friend of Feces The Steward of Stool The Sultan of Sewage The Prince of Poop Troop Turdmeister The Sire of Scat