OldGreyEagle

Ah, but GW, we do know the rules, at least the most important one, that is the Chartering Organizations hold the real power. And what do most BSA units do? Try not to involve the CO in the operation of the unit least the organization drop the Charter. You are correct, we the volunteers have very little say in the direction of the program although we are the one running the program. If you want things to change, it will be through the CO's and units not being afraid to involve them in the program

Yeah, that kid turned in a mighty gutty performance

This comes up from time to time on the Forum. And there is always a disparity with what to do. What happens to this scout is up to the Troop. I am not sure all that much which is said here will keep the troop from doing what it thinks is right, and what it thinks is right is what should be done. There also should be an effort made by the Troop not to allow this situation to occur in the future. Youth either do their jobs or they do not. They shouldnt find themselves parked in a position for over a year before someone tells them they dont get credit for the position. Good luck to your Troop and the youth (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

When you say "member of councils upper mgmt" do you mean on the volunteer side or the Professional side? The Ranger could be in the position of knowing there are multiple camps closer to the Council that the Councils camp and is feeling a bit insecure with his employment position. Not a good reason to try a guilt trip on you, but I understand his motivation

If active equals registered, and they are not active, why do they get registered? if you havent seen them, then don't reregister them

Lets see, the scout has been in the position for over 12 months, and he was never removed, he has fulfilled the requirement. The scout should have been removed before the time was up. You may have counseled the lad, and cajoled him to do better, but on the books he has been in the position for 6 months and that is all an appeals panel will look at. Rumors are rumors and until proven, they are nothing. Was he a gung ho scout prior to making Life? Could anything in his personal life have changed to account for such a radical change in behavior?

We had a poster a few years back that showed no restraint in hiding his contempt for "Council". His troop did pretty much what they wanted and when they wanted and of course they had no time for FOS or Popcorn. The unit had not been to a Council Camp in quite awhile and then the unit applied for a few Camperships from Council to get a few boys to Philmont and were turned down, and he was outraged, said this confirmed his take on "Council" as being useless money sucking pigs, or words close to it. Who is "Council" anyway? Is it the Council Executive and Associated DE's along with associated levels of Management? When a "Council" event takes place, who is responsible for the planning, management, and budgeting? In the COuncil I serve, its the volunteers, the Professionals support, but the Volunteers plan and run it. I would like to know how other Councils do things, it may not be done the same everywhere. Before a unit quits on Council, it may need to look at itself. If the unit has anyone who could put time in on a Council level, perhaps that person should avail him/her self of that opportunity. In a volunteer organization, if you constantly criticize without offering to make it better, nothing will ever please you. Then again, if you offer to help and are rebuffed, it may not be bad to drop out for 3-5 years to see if the hierarchy changes. DOnt be a unit that doesnt support council because 10 years ago, a council event stunk. And if you decide not to do FOS or Popcorn, dont complain if Council service slacks off, there are consequences to all actions.

"It is the 'faiths' that are supposed to adapt to BSA.. not the other way around. They need to find a way to fit the BSA into their lives... The BSA shouldn't have to find a way to fit into religion." Yet that is exactly the relationship between LDS and the BSA. The BSA has altered their boy scout program to fit that faith and has a program that is virtually for only the LDS, the Varsity Program. I support the BSA, but they are not always as consistent as they might

Actually http://www.racerchicks.com/racers/muldowney.html Ms Muldowney was the Drag Queen!

Hey Pack, we had a Drag Queen in my old neighborhood as well. her daddy owned a Service Station, (back then they were Service Stations, not gas Stations, there is a difference). She drove a '69 396 Malibu SS with a 5:11 rear end (I think it was 5:11, I know riding in it would give you whiplash) Everybody wanted to be her boyfriend, though my wanting to be a Priest pretty much kept my name off the short list, or the long list, or any list therein. Oddly enough I don't remember much what she looked like, but her car was HOT!(This message has been edited by oldgreyeagle)

You guys never do "lock-ins" or use cabins? You are a rustic brood, and I salute you !

Because of the mosquito issue and West Nile Virus the thought was to replace the water in the fire buckets with sand. The problem was, we had always been told in case of a tent fire, the best thing to do was drench adjacement tents so the fire wouldn't spread as the chances of saving the flaming tent is pretty remote. Somehow, throwing a dusting of sand on a tent doesnt do much to retard its flamability. Then again, there is the issue of the buckets. At first they were the 5 gallon food buckets we all know and love, and when you fill them with about 4.5 gallons of water, you have a bucket that is as likley to throw the youth in the fire as the actual water. So, have buckets of water that your youth can handle, have a fire drill now and then and also it wouldnt be bad to have a few fire extinguishers around, who knows, it "could" be an electrical fire at some point and water would be a bad idea. I guess it wouldn't be bad for the Troop to have a Fire Plan and drill on it once in awhile, or is that over the top?

I beleive what Scoutldr is referring to is the Pierre Salinger Syndrome, a belief if you see it on the Net, it has to be true. I try to give a reference if I know one exists. And even then, that is never the end of the discussion because sometimes you have to "know" when BSA policy may be ignored. I cringe when I read a first poster write, I want to find out the BSA policy one...., or What does the BSA say about.... because if they are on the web, then the BSA most likely doesnt say what they are looking for in clear language. And if they came away with an answer, saying "hey, I know its right, I saw it on Scouter.Com" then I just get the shakes. We are fun, we are a lot of things, but "The last word"? Reminds me of the long time resident in Maine who was asked if he had lived in East Millinocket his whole life, his answer? Not Yet

I always thought Bernoulli's Principle came into play with an airplane

http://www.spiralscouts.org/ I can just imagine the shock of all the Buddhist, Hindu, Islamic, Jewish et al scouts who wear their religious recognistions proudly on thier uniforms finding out that the BSA is a Christian organization

or http://www.notsurecruisingclub.com/Roof/Roof1.html

Hey, I resemble that crack about how "y'all" feel about the Sierra club. We have a mighty diverse group and you never know, a Sierra Club member may be responding to you at any time

The Venturing Crew goes to New York City to walk around the World Trade Center area, we were there in Dec 2001, to see what it looks like. We get to Battery Park and Central Park and then the Musuem of Modern Art. Navigating in NYC, now that is High Adventure

"I was discussing the whole idea with National yesterday, and I realize that I'm going to need to present a very thorough presentation for them to consider it" So, I take it National called you back, or alternatively, you phoned and got through to someone who would/could talk to you.

The District I serve has had 10 DE's in 11 years and the current one has been in his postion for nearly 20 months, and setting an endurance record unheard of in those 11 years. Please note this includes 18 months when we didnt have a DE. Each new DE comes in and asks us what do we expect of a DE, and my response is I dont know as we never have had one long enough to expect anything of him. I would expect that the DE has a grip on the Programs, and that means Cubs, Boy Scout and Venturing. If we had a Vasity Team, that woudl be incldued as well. We can say that the DE needs to understand that Scouting is not all about meeting numbers, but the DE's evaluation is going to be based on what? Numbers? So, is it the DE's fault if he concentrates on what secures his employment? The relationship between volunteers and Pros is unusual, they who may never have been in the program, over see many people who have more years in the program longer than many of the Pros have been alive and even then, my terminology is wrong. The DE doesnt oversee the volunteers, thats what the District Chair and COmmissioner are supposed to do. So, perhaps I should say those who have more years in the program than their DE has been alive should expect their DE to be a bit numbers driven, as thats where his job security lives and the volunteers shoudl be quick to praise the DE when he does good to his bosses and quick to alert the DE, in private prefferably, when he doesnt. Then again, the result of a good working relationship between DE and District is that you will soon be breaking in a new DE soon as the old one has been promoted, which is what we want, people to do well?(This message has been edited by oldgreyeagle)

This is exactly like the Grand Old Duke of York, but it's updated, although it could stand to be updated again. Its done to the cadence of The Grand Old Duke of York Good Captain Piccard He had 10, 000 men He beamed them up to the Enterprise And Beamed thenm off again And when your Up your Up And when your Down your Down And when your neither up or down You are nowhere to be found

I beleive someone in the forum advocates the correct recruiting for positions and you know, it works. The Troop I serve keeps all the Troops prescription drugs and OTC drugs in a trunk locked with a combination lock and only the owner of the trunk knows the combination. She is the Troop Committee Chair and Certified Pediatrician. Last year she was in demand at summer camp as multiple staff had the "creeping crud" or something like that, most likely mono, and she nearly wiped out her prescription pad writting amoxicillin scripts. We add that to the Critical Care Physician's Assistant who just completed his Wood Badge and we are pretty much safer on the road than at home. Choosing the correct person for the job is so important.

blade, you can call me naive, but I know more than a few Silver Beavers, Whitney Young, George Meaney and Venturing Leadership Award (like me) and all the recipients have a common personality trait, they work for the youth and the program, can't say I ever heard anyone say, I only have 2 more years before I get my recognition.

So, what is the result of the debate? That perhaps the new medical form should have a section that directs the physician to have the patient stung by a hornet, wasp and honey bee to determine if an epi-pen should be brought along? And I thought the uniform effected recruiting

Wonder if our new collegue in the Politics section is barking up the wrong tree with his knot idea. Perhaps NESA would entertain the Eagle scout who earned all available merit badges knot much more readily than the BSA?